Rival Championship!

Do you support FOTA's decision to split from F1?


  • Total voters
    16

Boyle

Race Winner
Contributor
So now we have it, the breakaway confirmed. FOTA and the FIA have, it would seem, become irreconcilably split with no compromise over next year's budget cap and regulations being reached.

So, what does this mean? Will this rebel series be able to stand against the FIA F1 championship? Will the FIA be forced to make serious concessions after trying to call FOTA's bluff? :surrender

The list of questions is endless and who knows where we will head next (oh yeah, I know, it's Silverstone :D ).

Tune in next week for the latest in this unpredictable story.

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Sorry for being so brief but I am too tired to put any thought into this thread
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
I'm speechless (well, almost).

It was threatened but I don't think anyone ever really thought it would happen.
Still, good luck to them.

The ramifications of this are huge though.

Bernie and FOM are going to be affected.
Existing teams, drivers and sponsors are going to be affected.
Circuits, fans, broadcasters, suppliers, etc.
Even feeder series as they traditionally have links with teams and not the FIA.

The existing F1 championship is going to change beyond all recognition next year.
Presumably all the other failed teams will now be given places to make up the numbers?
Who will Williams and Force India go with?
Will the FIA sue Ferrari, Red Bull and Toro Rosso in an attempt to force them to participate in their series?

It's arguably the biggest thing to happen to F1 in it's 59 year existence.

I still feel there is some way to go in this saga...
 

Speshal

World Champion
Valued Member
:o

I think Max's bluff has been well and truly called.

Forgive me for being a cynical old trout but doesn't FOM exist to make money for CVC so they can service their debt - are they really going to watch their cash cow waddle off into the sunset without a fight because at the end of the day it all comes down to money.

As Bro said, massive changes are ahead but could we yet see FOTA & FOM Vs The FIA?

I also think Lola's decision to withdraw from 2010 is telling of the state of affairs.
 

rufus_mcdufus

Champion Elect
Yep - big legal battles now to follow - could go on some years.

Are FOTA calling the FIA's bluff? No - I think it's final this time. You could tell that FOTA had reached breaking point in the last week or two, and I also suspect they have a lot of grievances which they can't air whilst under contract to the FIA. I'm dying to find these out - we're going to hear the true story on some of the past episodes once the contracts finish.

I'll be really really happy if real F1 has finally got out of the clutches of Bernie and meddling Max. We've got a lot to look forward to in terms of racing, but also a lot of intrigue.
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
I still don't feel this is over.

Eddie Jordan, on the BBC website has suggested that if Max were to agree to stand down, a lot of the issues might magically disappear.

Now might be the time for Bernie to have a word in his old mate's ear. BE certainly won't let his empire go without a fight - remember when Max said F1 wouldn't miss Ferrari? Bernie's response: oh yes we would.
 

McZiderRed

Champion Elect
Supporter
In the words of The Ruttles, I'm shocked and stunned.

Actually, as a few have already said, Bernie won't give up without a fight. He (or FOM) has too much to lose. Would a light weight F1 earn enough money to service CVC's debt? I think we'll be seeing Bernie running round trying to keep everyone together...

All this excitement is almost too much for me. I'm off to watch P1...
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
GordonMurray said:
Eddie Jordan, on the BBC website has suggested that if Max were to agree to stand down, a lot of the issues might magically disappear.
I said the same thing on another forum a few days ago.

When it comes to the crunch, Bernie is obviously going to side with the teams as it's them who generate all the revenue and profits.

Who knows? This could be the beginning of the end for Max and a fresh new start in F1?
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
Brogan said:
GordonMurray said:
Eddie Jordan, on the BBC website has suggested that if Max were to agree to stand down, a lot of the issues might magically disappear.
I said the same thing on another forum a few days ago.
Great minds think alike?

CVC own something called "The Formula One World Championship". Bernie is their employee, albeit a very highly-paid one. So Bernie would like to go with the teams, I'm sure, but I don't see why the teams would be interested in that. In a new series they can be the owners, they don't have to pay half of the profits to an external body. Why give up that sort of opportunity?

Unless Bernie gave up all involvement with FOM and came over to FOTA as Chief Executive of the new series, bringing all his contacts and experience to bear in sorting out TV, sponsorship and circuit deals? He must be under some sort of contract to CVC though, which would make it difficult for him to escape.

Far better, I think, for him to try to patch F1 back together in its current form, perhaps under new FIA leadership.
 

cider_and_toast

Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex
Staff member
Premium Contributor
I think when you sift through all the guff about "Two Tier F1" and "budget caps" when it finally comes down to it, the money is what it's all about.

Every statement from FOTA includes the words "The commercial rights holder" and it was very telling in their breakaway press release that there were lines that spoke of all the money generated being re-distributed to the teams.

I think that the biggest issue is why should the teams be restricted to spending 40 million each when they generate far more in revenue for FOM. It must be seen as their efforts and FOMs money.

I'd like to think there is a way back from this because it's just not going to work in the long run for either party. Max is right in one respect that the likes of Toyota and BMW can walk away at any time. Somehow though, I think a bomb has gone off at the heart of F1 and the damage caused can't be repaired.

We shall see.
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
Interestingly, N.Technology have joined Lola in withdrawing their names from the FIA's reserve list of teams.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76298

"AUTOSPORT understands the team has decided to inform Formula 1's ruling body that it has withdrawn its application because the circumstances have changed since it applied and it no longer wants to be involved in a sport without the major manufacturers."

So they're obviously taking the breakaway threat seriously. If the new series does come to pass, don't be surprised to see Lola, N.Technology, Prodrive and others involved.
 

cider_and_toast

Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex
Staff member
Premium Contributor
That's interesting because that would mean that these teams feel it would be more cost effective for them to run in the FOTA series. This comes back to the point about the cash generated by the series being shared among the teams.

I think you've hit on a good point there GM. I speculated in another thread that the reason that Campos and Manor were chosen above some of the other more likely entries (Lola or Prodrive) was that they were more onside with the FIA thinking.

The only thing that neither side have in this debate is time. It's going to take a huge amount of effort for either side to get things up and running in time for next march in the event of a split. FOTA have to find at least 16 tracks that are capable of hosting F1 races that aren't on the current callender. I can see members of the BRDC speeding to FOTAs office now. I fully expect that any break away series will be shown on a digital network because they will be able to put up the cash quickly. I don't think it would be a great idea to do that though because you limit your viewing figures in most countries however the BBC aren't going to pay for something twice.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
This is starting to pile the pressure on Bernie and Max/FIA.

If all the new teams on the reserve list withdraw then they're going to be left with a handful of "B" teams, certainly not enough for a full grid.

Have Williams and Force India made any comment?
As it stands they're the only 2 teams of the existing 10 who will be racing in F1 proper.

Notwithstanding of course the legal battles that will ensue over Ferrari, Red Bull and Toro Rosso.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
This is Planet F1's take on Williams and Force India:
Vijay Mallya looks like he might be shipwrecked in a sub-GP2 series, stranded like a beached whale now that the tide has gone out. Frank Williams was stuck whatever the case. He was already heavily involved with the FIA by manufacturing the chassis for their F2 series and sounded like he had already been advanced cash by Bernie for running in 2010. Mallya, who was thought to be funding his F1 dream from his industrial fortune, gave the excuse that he had various banking covenants that obliged him to sign up. How much is his team worth this morning...?
The comment about Williams being advanced cash for 2010 is interesting.

I know Planet F1 is a bit like The Sun of the motorsport press but it does make some interesting points.

More here: FOTA Split: What Comes Next?
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
The point about the circuits is interesting too - a lot of the promoter's tickets are sold on the basis of the top drivers who'll be there: Alonso in Valencia/Catalunya, Hamilton and Button at Donington, Massa at Interlagos etc.

Those circuits will certainly want to get a refund on their hosting fees if the local heroes don't materialise.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
Press release from the FIA in response to FOTA:

The FIA has noted the latest press statement from FOTA.

The FIA is disappointed but not surprised by FOTA’s inability to reach a compromise in the best interests of the sport. It is clear that elements within FOTA have sought this outcome throughout the prolonged period of negotiation and have not engaged in the discussions in good faith.

The FIA cannot permit a financial arms race in the Championship nor can the FIA allow FOTA to dictate the rules of Formula One.

The deadline for unconditional entries to the 2010 FIA Formula World Championship will expire this evening.

The 2010 FIA Formula One World Championship entry list will be announced tomorrow.
http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pressreleases/f1releases/2009/Pages/fia_fota_2010.aspx

Sounds to me like both sides are entrenched and won't budge.
 

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
Brogan said:
Here's Alonso's opinion on it:

"Formula 1 is finished. It will be a standard engine, small teams and no drivers - this is not the Formula 1 people want."

"The new series will be the new Formula 1."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8108300.stm
Well, Fernando, you are spot on. If those teams that were mentioned leave F1, then F1 is essentially gone, and we'll all be watching the FOTA World Championship next year.
the FIA said:
The FIA has noted the latest press statement from FOTA.

The FIA is disappointed but not surprised by FOTA’s inability to reach a compromise in the best interests of the sport. It is clear that elements within FOTA have sought this outcome throughout the prolonged period of negotiation and have not engaged in the discussions in good faith.

The FIA cannot permit a financial arms race in the Championship nor can the FIA allow FOTA to dictate the rules of Formula One.

The deadline for unconditional entries to the 2010 FIA Formula World Championship will expire this evening.

The 2010 FIA Formula One World Championship entry list will be announced tomorrow.
The FIA is disappointed by FOTA's inability to reach a compromise agree to the FIA's demands. The FIA has been damned unreasonable for this whole time period.

The 2010 FIA Formula One World Championship entry list will be announced tomorrow - McLaren, BMW, Renault, Toyota and Brawn will be off it and Ferrari, Red Bull and Toro Rosso will probably be on it!

The big player now is Mr. Ecclestone. His whole world might have just collapsed and he has 6 months to rebuild it. He needs the FIA World Championship in his camp and he will be the man who will get a compromise if anyone does it!

There will not be two rival series next year - there will be the FOTA World Championship. F1 will collapse if it is just the new teams! Max's brinkmanship has utterly failed and led to the logical outcome.

As I have said before, F1 can live without Ferrari. It can't live without the whole damn lot of the teams.

Its the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine!
 
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