Michael Schumacher

The Vettel thread surprised me as such that when I searched for a Schumacher thread, I could not find one. So I propose this thread for Schumacher because regardless of your opinion whether his return is succesful or not, I think we can all agree that there's always something to talk about whether he's had a good or bad race.
Historical Discussion may be allowed on the thread as long as it's on topic.
Enjoy! :)
 
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Wouldn't one take a different line while defending a position than one would when not defending?

A defending line isn't neccessarily the fastest. Non?

Perez had a nasty shunt at another street circuit (Monaco) and missed a race (Canada) because of it... so I find it tough to believe he'd deliberately risk his neck by 'break-testing' a guy who could pile into him.
 
RayInTorontoCanada said:
Wouldn't one take a different line while defending a position than one would when not defending?

A defending line isn't neccessarily the fastest. Non?

Perez had a nasty shunt at another street circuit (Monaco) and missed a race (Canada) because of it... so I find it tough to believe he'd deliberately risk his neck by 'break-testing' a guy who would pile into him.
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Fixed!
 
Slyboogy said:
By Andrew Davieshttp://www.planetf1.com/race-features/7203543/Singapore-GP-Winners-Losers , not my favourite writer by all means, but he criticises Schumacher quite a but and was surprised to hear him say this.

I kind of agree with him, it was an unusual line, and he did seem to brake earlier than normal, quite a contrast to when Rosberg braked for the corner who was just ahead on track.
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Perez was defending the inside. This is a pretty normal thing to do when you have a faster car behind you. Whether he lifted early is up for debate but I doubt we will ever know for certain.
 
Josh said:
Perez was defending the inside. This is a pretty normal thing to do when you have a faster car behind you. Whether he lifted early is up for debate but I doubt we will ever know for certain.
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Also, lifting a little earlier isn't uncommon when you're going into a tight corner with space for only one car (especially with marbles off line). Lifting slightly earlier puts the other driver into a sub-optimal situation and allows you to dictate things as your mind will always be faster than his reaction. In other words, you might be able to put the hammer down while he's still cought off.

I doubt it was malicious. He'd just lost one position and was desperate not to lose the other and his reaction was what it was. The data traces of his other laps and the lines he used (*if* he wasn't defending on the other laps) would be irrelevant to this specific lap where he *was* vigorously defending.

The onus is on the guy behind in the majority of cases.

I think it was a 'racing accident'. Just like Hamilton-Massa...just like Button-Alonso in Canada.
 
Josh said:
While that is true, Ray, if Perez lifted/braked early with Michael so close behind (which he must have been aware of otherwise he wouldn't have taken the inside line) then that would have been pretty silly.
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I have to agree with that. Schumacher didn't even get a great exit off the previous corner, as he took too much kerb. Something just doesn't seem right for him to hit Perez so far before the corner. An overhead shot would have helped, as the camera angles didn't help to judge who was at fault, but I'm surprised Schumacher got close enough to hit him that far before the corner.
I don't believe Perez did anything to deliberately cause a collision, but I do think he surprised Schumacher with the line and early lift.

We'll probably never know, and Schumacher will have to take it on the chin :thankyou:
 
Josh said:
While that is true, Ray, if Perez lifted/braked early with Michael so close behind (which he must have been aware of otherwise he wouldn't have taken the inside line) then that would have been pretty silly.
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Fair enough. Silly things happen sometimes. Drivers make silly moves or silly assuptions sometimes.

Perhaps one silly assumption might be thinking that Schumacher's reaction time would be the same as a guy his own age as opposed to the reaction time of a guy double his age.

According to many people the reaction time of a 42 year old is slightly (and I mean slightly) slower than a 21 year old.

Obviously Schumacher isn't a normal/average human...but i'm sure it still applies F1 Driver Vs F1 Driver.

Is that possible?

Honestly, this is pure conjecture on my part. Perez already was hurt at Monaco and I really question if he'd purposely try something that could hurt him on a street circuit again.
 
RayInTorontoCanada said:
Fair enough. Silly things happen sometimes. Drivers make silly moves or silly assuptions sometimes.

Perhaps one silly assumption might be thinking that Schumacher's reaction time would be the same as a guy his own age as opposed to the reaction time of a guy double his age.

According to many people the reaction time of a 42 year old is slightly (and I mean slightly) slower than a 21 year old.

Obviously Schumacher isn't a normal/average human...but i'm sure it still applies F1 Driver Vs F1 Driver.

Is that possible?

Honestly, this is pure conjecture on my part. Perez already was hurt at Monaco and I really question if he'd purposely try something that could hurt him on a street circuit again.
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I don't think anyone would have avoided him if they were as close as Michael :p
 
Bill, you've probably misunderstood what I wrote.

It was a racing accident but Alonso was at fault for getting 0 points by beaching/DNFing the Ferrari.

It certainly wasn't Jenson's fault that Fernando beached the car.

The tangle itself was a "racing accident" (which, IMO, didn't merit a penalty (which is what is being discussed here)) but not scoring points in the Canadian GP was Nando's fault.
 
If it was a racing incident then it was no-one's fault by definition.

In the case of Schumacher's reaction time, yes it does slow as you get older but you also get more experienced. In a case like this, however, no driver has sufficiently fast reactions to save the accident from happening.
 
I'm just glad that nothing serious happened to either driver. It was real squeeky bum time when I first saw the accident but fortunatly the speed and angle wasn't great enough to flip Schumachers car as happenend to Webber because Webber had the fortune of a pretty big run off while a flipped Schumacher would have either landed on or smashed into the a concrete wall.
 
Bill Boddy said:
If it was a racing incident then it was no-one's fault by definition.
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People can be at fault in a racing incident. Racing incidents are always avoidable, generally by not racing or not racing as hard. whether something is deemed to be a racing incident or otherwise, the driver will always go and have a look at what went wrong and determine whether they could have done anything differently. In most cases they could have.

Example. Kobayashi and Hamilton. Racing incident. Both at fault. Both could have avoided it. Both could have done something different.
 
Bill,

I specifically said that it was in the context of penalties. Alonso-Button, Hamilton-Massa, Schumacher-Perez...'racing incidents' not worthy of penalties.

Doesn't mean it wasn't Nando's fault for beaching the car and getting 0 points from an event where Ferrari had their best qualifying of the year (ALO 2nd - MAS 3rd on the Grid; MAS fastest in Q2).

Ninja and I are in agreement on this, you're not. Fine with me. Have a good day. :goodday:
 
As I've said over on the Sauber thread there seems to have been multiple incidents where someone has been caught out by the braking point a Sauber has taken - this may explain why their car seems to be so easy on their tyres - add this to the fact that this was the first time Michael had followed Perez for any length of time and this might contribute as to why he got caught out.

Not sure I can lay blame at anyone's door on this one.
 
RayInTorontoCanada said:
Bill,

I specifically said that it was in the context of penalties. Alonso-Button, Hamilton-Massa, Schumacher-Perez...'racing incidents' not worthy of penalties.

Doesn't mean it wasn't Nando's fault for beaching the car and getting 0 points from an event where Ferrari had their best qualifying of the year (ALO 2nd - MAS 3rd on the Grid; MAS fastest in Q2).

Ninja and I are in agreement on this, you're not. Fine with me. Have a good day. :goodday:
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Ray, since this is the Schumacher thread would it be better if we moved to the Alonso thread instead?
 
Interesting note, since the start of 2010, Schumacher is the 9th highest points scorer.

He remains behind Vettel, Alonso, Webber, Hamilton, Button, Massa, Rosberg and Kubica.
With 14 extra races and a better car throughout.
 

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