Mercedes and Ferrari in 'secret' Pirelli tyre tests

[Kewee]

Mephistopheles......Exactly what I mean by pushing the boundaries to breaking point. If anyone reads back over my postings they'll find I've never suggested Ferrari are lily white. They were at their worst during the Schumacher/Brawn era. Ferrari is a very different team now than they were then, but even that doesn't mean they're faultless. As I have said if they're not pushing the boundaries they may as well stay in Italy.

 

[Brogan]

There's a difference between pushing boundaries and cheating.

 

[Kewee]

Brogan.....Of course there is. The issue for all of us of course is we never know for sure whether slipping over those limits was intentional or accidental and our opinion on that point will sometimes vary depending on the team, even though it shouldn't. I think that's called being human. There was a very good interview with Ross Brawn in the F1 magazine a couple of years ago. He said the same, that if your not right on the limit of the technical and sometimes sporting regulations you won't win. He also admitted to knowing when they were pushing beyond the limits and getting away with it during his time with Schumacher at Ferrari. Ross Brawn understands how to cheat and still appear to be an absolute gentleman.

 

[Brogan]

Teams and principals know full well when they're cheating.

A cheat is a cheat, not a gentleman.

 

[Kewee]

Brogan.....Of course they know when they're cheating. I said 'we' didn't know, not the teams and principles. Ross Brawn was very clear in the interview that he knew when they were cheating.
You also appear to have misunderstood me on this point. I said Ross Brawn was able to "appear to be an absolute gentleman". I didn't say he was a gentleman.

 

[Brogan]

Some of us were never fooled.

 

[Kewee]

Brogan.....I wasn't either. I was never a Ferrari fan during the Schumacher era. Ross Brawns behavior was appalling for anyone with their eyes half open to see. Ferrari as they are now is a team I'm sure Enzo would have been proud of. I doubt he would have been during the Brawn/Schumacher era despite the titles won.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Maybe there is something in the bananas....

 

[Fenderman]

 

[FB]

Here's one:

http://cliptheapex.com/threads/cheats-scandals-and-dodgy-dealings.766/

and another in a similar vein:

http://cliptheapex.com/threads/the-CTA-what-the-award.557/

 

[sobriety]

How about the ferrari technical veto? That should have been (be, according to pitpass) a massive scandal, but somehow wasn't...

 

[Titch]

Ferrari appear to be able to get away with a great when it comes to dodgy dealings. Not everything..but a great deal. Part of their strategy is always to shout very loudly about the wrong doings of other teams, so that everyone looks in that direction rather than at them.

 

[Kewee]

sobriety.......There was nothing underhand about Ferrari's technical veto, it was very transparent and many of the bigger teams agreed with their motives and aims and during that time were very happy for Ferrari to act as a spokesperson for them. This was during the talk of a breakaway series remember. Essentially Ferrari have always wanted more freedom for testing and technical development to allow teams to go head to head with their technology as well as the drivers doing the same on track. If fans were honest with themselves instead of finding made up reasons to bitch about Ferrari, they'd realize they want the same thing Ferrari do, a more open formula with fewer restrictions that would allow the major players in F1 to show the true pinnacle of motorsport.

 

[Brogan]

Umm, no, it wasn't transparent at all.

No-one knew about it until it was revealed during the court case.

 

[Kewee]

We're obviously talking about two different things. Almost certainly my confused mind.

 

[Olivier]

If anybody reads just this last page, they can be forgiven to think it was Ferrari the team facing court and getting away with no punishment ...

 

[F1ang-o]

I think Titch explains the Ferrari situation, very succinctly, a few posts back...............

 

[Kewee]

If anybody reads just this last page, they can be forgiven to think it was Ferrari the team facing court and getting away with no punishment ...

Probably my fault Olivier. My original posting on this thread was about the dramatic difference between the penalties handed down to Mercedes compared to McLaren in 2007. Unfortunately as soon as I enter a topic there are some who, knowing I'm a Ferrari fan, will turn the discussion in Ferrari's direction to enable them to have little digs at me. I honestly don't know why. There are many I enjoy communicating with on this site, so I don't understand why some seem to want to spoil it for me.

 

[Brogan]

According to The Times, Red Bull have threatened to boycott the YDT and set up their own three day private test session.

They have stated that a reprimand is all they will receive so it's worth it.

 

[Kewee]

It's a long way from over for sure though if Mercedes and Ferrari arrive at Silverstone in good shape Red Bull really can't allow themselves to be distracted by the outcome of the hearing. Normally a team shouldn't need to be told that but with differences at the front of the grid sometimes measured in 100th's it wouldn't take much to trip momentarily.