FIA The FIA admits the controversy at the Abu Dhabi GP is “tarnishing the image of the Championship”

[Il_leone]

My feeling is that there will be a prevailing acceptance of Max as champ because he will be seen as a worthy champion, over the course of the season. Abu Dhabi wasn't the final – like other races it represented approx 5% of the total points available for the year, during which there were other errors leading to points being awarded where they shouldn't have been. I think that it will be accepted that over the season, Hamilton was luckier in this respect than Verstappen, so fair-dos lets all get on with it and not let it happen again.

And Mercedes definitely would have done the same, as well as any other team out there.

The only teams that would are Ferrari certainly when Todt was in charge and Benetton because some Italian guy (who knows about F1 according to one driver ) would do it.

Mercedes - no judging by Toto 's reaction and the way Red Bull have behaved throughout the season constantly bending Masi's ear and trying to get Hamilton disqualified and also trying to push the rules the only time I've seen this is Schumacher and Ferrari

 

[Johnny Carwash]

 

[The Artist.....]

There are individuals who are calling on the result of the Abu Dhabi race to be changed, to go back to the result at the end of lap 57, which seems to me to be really problematic, as it opens up a pandora's box of possible problems.

Firstly, the obvious race to revisit is Singapore 2008. After all, we know that the race was (effectively) fixed by Renault. If we were to go back to the point where Renault fixed the race, Massa was leading, with Hamilton in second, and they would have left Singapore (notwithstanding the half points rule), with the scores at:
Massa 82, Hamilton 81 Over the remaining 3 races, Massa gained 20 points, Hamilton 14, so Massa would be given the world championship...
Massa champion, 102: 95

• But then, you might say, what about Spa. Surely that was fixed as well?

If you removed that penalty, then Hamilton wins (instead of 3rd, gaining 4 points), Massa was 2nd, losing 2 points, and the championship ends:
Massa: 100, Hamilton 99...

What about if Singapore was completely annulled, and the Spa penalty removed, then the final points would be 95:95

• However, having removed the penalty in Spa would have switched the order to 6 Hamilton wins to 5 Massa wins.

When you start, retrospectively, changing decisions, you end up with lots of ifs, buts and wherefores. By retrospectively applying penalties, removing penalties, or annulling races, you can change the overall shape of the season.

Oh, and whilst we're at it...

People have focussed on the discussion behind the safety car... However, the discussion of Hamilton's jumping across the chicane at the beginning of the race is also important, as in this case, it was a driver breaking a written rule:

27.3 Drivers must make every reasonable effort to use the track at all times and may not leave the track without a justifiable reason. Drivers will be judged to have left the track if no part of the car remains in contact with it and, for the avoidance of doubt, any white lines defining the track edges are considered to be part of the track but the kerbs are not. Should a car leave the track the driver may re-join, however, this may only be done when it is safe to do so and without gaining any lasting advantage. At the absolute discretion of the Race Director a driver may be given the opportunity to give back the whole of any advantage he gained by leaving the track.

If we're going to criticise Masi for inappropriately applying the regs to allow 5 cars to pass, and then restarting the race, we also need to criticise Masi for not using one of the two options available:

• Require Hamilton to hand back the place that he regained by jumping across the kerbs
• Handing Hamilton a penalty for not handing back the place (Had this been done, such was Hamilton's advantage, he would have won the race)...

There is no third option.

(People have criticised Masi for the way that he discussed with Red Bull about moving Verstappen behind Hamilton in Saudi. However, he was just following regulation 27.3, which was allowing the competitor to give back the whole of the advantage he gained by leaving the track. Had Red Bull not accepted that, they would then have had to accept a penalty later)...

 

[Il_leone]

Results will not be reversed given the ramifications on what is deemed controversial championship decides?

1990 Senna admitted it only a year later it was intentional
1994 Schumacher deliberate block knowing his car was damaged
2008 they only found out about crashgate a year later

The fact the FIA were keen not to have a cloud over their head means they have backed themselves into a corner

People talk about lap 1 incident again Hamilton was repeating the same thing Verstappen has bern doing the previous seasons ..waiting for the stewards to tell him to give the place back..which never came...

Would it have been applied at the end of the race? We don't know and in which case if Hamilton won by 25 seconds, then would he have been hit with 30 seconds penalty. How do you justify that given Mercedes was faster than Red Bull throughoutthe race? Looking at the overtake everyone was surprised Verstappen went for it including the stewards but he did not make the apex clean to deem it a pass

The stories coming out are Masi will not be race director for sure

 

[FB]

There is a rumour that Eduardo Freitas (current WEC Race Director) is in the frame. I suspect the pressure in F1 might be different to WEC, as the WEC teams do as they are told and don't "run up to the ref waving pretend red and yellow cards".

He has the reputation to do the job, whether he can cope with the politicking which goes on from the teams will be interesting. There will need to be the change in structure which has been mooted.

 

[F1Brits_90]

yes this is the death knell for masi & it shame he will know fade into obscurity. also a shame because he was Charlie Whiting protege he never got to mentor. but also because i would like to hear his side of story at some point

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493266551683878920

 

[gethinceri]

Good, if they're binning Masi, better if they clarify the safety car rules, best if they apply them.

 

[Il_leone]

yes this is the death knell for masi & it shame he will know fade into obscurity. also a shame because he was Charlie Whiting protege he never got to mentor. but also because i would like to hear his side of story at some point

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493266551683878920

It's easy to scapegoat Masi who will either be moved to another role or got a pay off now. Maybe he has singed non disclosure agreement relating to his pay off but this is Jean Todt's responsibility who has left his role

I do think the report needs to be hard on both Red Bull and Mercedes actions throughout the season

 

[Johnny Carwash]

The FIA still marking there own homework.

 

[gethinceri]

well if I were marking your English...

 

[Johnny Carwash]

well if I were marking your English...

Have i been reprimanded by the grammar police?

 

[The Pits]

*You're English

 

[cider_and_toast]

Geth takes his role extremely seriously.

 

[Brogan]

*roll

 

[GeoffP]

It’s a roll your always working on, ain’t it

 

[gethinceri]

Bastards.

 

[GeoffP]

I’ll have you know I resemble that!

 

[Wombat]

What was done to Hamilton in the ADGP was disgraceful and despicable beyond words. The only really meaningful and fair fix is for the FIA to change the result to the true winner of the race and the WDC. This is the only thing that can restore at least a measure of integrity to the WDC and F1. Lewis was the true winner, both of the actual race (which he dominated) and also by the actual FIA Sporting Regs. (which unequivocally indicate that the race should have ended under safety car conditions). To merely acknowledge that the safety car rules were violated and manipulated without also changing the results to acknowledge and declare that Lewis was the true winner will be superficial, gutless and extremely unfair. F1 is supposed to be a sporting competiton, not a WWF analog.

Statements claiming that it’s too late to change the race results are without merit. For one thing, it’s never too late to do the right thing. Furthermore, late changes to race results are not unprecedented in F1. For example, the winner of the 1976 Spanish GP was changed from Lauda to Hunt about two months after the race had taken place (and the title was closely contested between these two drivers).

 

[Il_leone]

Wombat love to see the Verstappen/Red Bull fans suddenly and claim FIA conspiracy after 2 months of arrogant taunting.. but ain't going g to happen due to the commercial embarrassment it will bring to F1

Strangely Verstappen would be a victim of his teams actions

 

[The Artist.....]

Il_leone To claim that Red Bull manipulated the results is to also say that Mercedes manipulated the results (by calling up Masi, and asking for no safety car earlier in the race).

We have no counterfactual, so we have no idea what would have happened, had the messages from the teams not been sent. For this reason, "phoning up" the race director needs to be stopped.

It would be much better if, without the teams' knowledge, there was a "Michael Masi imitator" who answered the calls, and they were all played out (live) on the TV, whilst the race director gets on with his work. It would very quickly get rid of this badgering of the referee.