2011 Silly Season

Ill try for you, its actually very simple, its only the company names that cause confusion, if they were called A, B, C it would save the confusion. Ill explain everything though, so hopefully anyone knowing 'nout will be able to follow...

The stories start here in the Lotus Renault thread and F1Y has also thinned the mud, but ill try and explain the route cause...

...I own and run the company Grizzly Group. All my customers etc know me and refer to me as Grizzly Group, but actually Grizzly Group is simply a non-trading holding company or parent company that gives a banner to trade under. My company is actually split into several smaller companies: Grizzly Associates, Grizzly Estates, Grizzly Investments, Grizzly Partnership and Grizzly Services. Each a limited company, entirely separate legally, taxed independently and make profits/losses independently.

There are lots of reasons to do this, but one of the biggest reasons is, if for examples sake, Grizzly Investments makes a bad investment and looses $100 000 000, enough to put the company under. If i did all my business through one company, Grizzly Group, then Ive just lost everything. However, since the other parts of my business are all entirely separate companies, only the Investments wing goes under.

Go back a few decades and this is exactly what Collin Chapman, very wisely, did.

Parent company - Group Lotus, had several daughter companies, the important ones here for example being Team Lotus, the F1 team, and Lotus Cars, who made the 7, Elan, Esprit etc.

This is all Lotus, or 'Group Lotus', but problems in one company do not effect the other. So if the F1 wing went pop, it didn't take down the whole Lotus company. The Renault team is not THE company Renault, just as Virgin Racing is not THE company Virgin, they are new companies set up to deal solely with F1, supported by their parent companies.

So way back when all of Lotus Group was looking to sell up, Proton Bought many of the companies, including Group, but the F1 team was not sold to them, rather David Hunt, who actually took ownership of Team Lotus before they entered their last GP in '94.

So cut to 2009 and a Malaysian business man enters F1. Their title sponsor is Proton, Proton wish to use their Lotus banner and as is common practice, the title sponsor is incorporated into the team name. 'Lotus' is on the grid, but not the glorious 'Team Lotus' owned by British Businessman Hunt.

The rest is now 12 months of history of fall-outs, arguments and corporates vs individuals >:(

:confused: did i help LOL
 
Excellent explanation Grizzly.

The only thing you didn't add that I think is worth mentioning is that it seems that Proton didn't realize they weren't buying Team Lotus when they bought the Group (someone didn't do their due diligence exercise properly by the sound of it), hence all the recent posturing and threats by them as they try to save face.
 
Chad Stewarthill said:
Excellent explanation Grizzly.

The only thing you didn't add that I think is worth mentioning is that it seems that Proton didn't realize they weren't buying Team Lotus when they bought the Group (someone didn't do their due diligence exercise properly by the sound of it), hence all the recent posturing and threats by them as they try to save face.

That could of been because one of the companies within Group Lotus was Lotus Racing, The Malaysians may have wrongly assumed that was the F1 side of the company but was in fact a seperate racing company which I believe ran the Elise class of racing amongst other lower classes.

The current F1 team has been racing under the Lotus Racing banner which is owned by Proton who have or are launching a GP2 under the same name, Fernandez is also launching a GP2 team but thankfully under his Air Asia banner which will limit the confusion.
 
Chad Stewarthill said:
I still wouldn't be surprised if Webber retires and Massa leaves Ferrari :thinking:

And Hulkenberg is rumoured to be leaving Williams for another (as yet unspecified) F1 seat with Maldonado coming in.

Edit: Now confirmed - Hulk to leave Williams:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/88301


Thats a real Shame for Hulkenburg, He seemed of shaded rubens in Qualifying towards the end of the season and picked up a good few points towards the end of the season, perhaps not shading Rubens in races though.

Deserved a second season at Williams and I think would of been a lot stronger. Money talks tohugh and it seems that Williams are going to go for the money. Theres a couple of very decent drivers with huge backing behind them, but I think they will do no better then Hulkenberg this season considering there going to be rookies. And hulkenberg would of been a lot stronger i feel with a seasons experience behinf him.

Hopefully he can pick up the seat at Force India, Liuzzi has been very average, espically in qualifying, and only has had a sprinkling of good results. Think if the Hulk moves to one of the 'new' teams (how long before there not new teams?) then i think he's screwed if he is going to have a long term carrer in F1. I see the new teams moving towards the established teams but ultimately still being at the back.
 

Damn! thought i read about the palava with the loti teams and Renault in this thread a couple of days before i posted, only just relized it was a thread of its own :embarrassed:

i understand who the differnt Lotui are, and why there are differnt lotii (yes that 3 spellings of the plural for lotus, one of thems right :snigger: )

What i don't understand is the relationship with each other for next season.

Mr ex A1gp guy (forgot his name) is currently with 'Proton's lotus' Group Lotus, but wants to use David Hunt's Lotus,Team lotus, The Lotus company that actually raced in f1 but branched away when lotus went up the wall and proton brought most of the holding company.

Proton have kicked up a stink claiming the own all rights to the lotus name including Hunts team Lotus.

Renault F1 could become Lotus (or thats was the rumours at least), but i am not sure who how or why, For instance is it Renault or Geenni who wants to use the lotus name. And i don't know which Lotus wants to become a part of Renault F1, Weather its Mr ex A1 gp guy, or proton themsleves.

Is that all correct? thats what im struggling to understand.
 
This is just as i understand proceedings, not necessarily correct...


Fernandez (des?) wanted a legit Lotus team and as such has always aimed to be called 'Team Lotus' i believe. With discussions on-going between Hunt and Proton, Proton licensed Fernandez a 'Lotus Racing' banner and gave some sponsorship, but stated they were not interested in buying the 'Team Lotus' banner. Proton fell out with Fernandez (1Malaysia Racing) when he went ahead and did his own deal with Hunt, so Proton removed sponsership of the team, his rights to the name for next year, started legal proceedings against him and suggested they would buy into the Renault F1 team instead of supporting 1MR, pretty much out of frustration and anger to piss him off as far as i can see...
 
Doesnt really matter, but this is what the numbers will probably be unless the team decied not to go with championship finishing position (Rosberg-Scumi). I've only included contacted drivers, it also shows how few good places are remaining.

1-Vettel
2-Webber
3-Hamilton
4-Button
5-Alonso
6-Massa
7-Rosberg
8-Schumacher
9-Kubica
10-(Renault 2)
11-Barrichello
12-(Williams 2)
14-(Force India 1)
15-(Force India 2)
16-Kobayashi
17-Pérez
18-Buemi
19-Algersuari
20-(Lotus 1)
21-(Lotus 2)
22-(HRT 1)
23-(HRT 2)
24-Glock
25-(Virgin 2)*If di Grassi races next year he would take no 24 not Glock.
 
The Lotus (Proton) deal with Renault is rumoured to be going ahead on Wednesday.

http://motoring.asiaone.com/Motoring/Mo ... 47301.html

This is increasing the chances of 2 Lotus teams on the grid next year. Would Bernie step in to limit the confusion it would cause?

There's also another rumour floating around that Petrov could be heading to Virgin as they now have new Russian sponsors. No reliable source though so could be just conjecture.
 
HRT tie up with Toyota gone to wall. Just posted on Autosport

HRT not made revelent payments. Two Less drives to look for, for the people who got a contract yet, No more of the.... legend sakon Yamamoto?

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/88313

Considering HRT were planning on using Toyota Cars for next season,They not being able to make payments to them for the variuos uses the Tie up invloves. and all gone quiet on the 'big deal' that HRT was supposed to have done.

no Cars, No money presumably that also means no team then?
 
TBYsaid:

HRT's drivers next year will be Sakon Yamamoto, Vitaly Petrov, Jose Maria Lopez and Pedro Diniz!

416_ker_ching.jpg
 
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