"I Don't Believe It!"

[Brogan]

Think it's unfair to add 2011 to that list, that isn't the ban on refuelling that's coming into play there, it's the high wearing tyres, DRS and KERS...if refuelling had all that, it would pretty much be on par.

2011 perhaps.
2010 didn't have Pirelli tyres or DRS though.

The only difference between 2009 and 2010 was refuelling was banned.
And in fact, FOTA agreed not to use KERS for 2010, so if anything there were less opportunities to pass in 2010.

The point still stands.

 

[Incubus]

Re-fuelling = 666.

 

[Slyboogy]

2010 didn't have Pirelli tyres or DRS though.

Had more wet races

Then it also had far more boring races aswell....the wet races usually have double or triple amount of overtakes compared to dry, and we saw lots of processional races in 2010 with overtakes not even reaching double figures.

 

[Brogan]

Had more wet races

It doesn't matter how many wet races there were.
I provided the dry race figures - that is a valid comparison.

I'll leave you to it.

 

[Slyboogy]

I haven't forgotten anything, there is a dry race data-set.
2009 - total dry passes (15 races) : 156
2010 - total dry passes (15 races) : 320
2011 - total dry passes (7 races) : 460

The point still stands.

Ah I see...

Now this is what confuses me, how can there be more passes when cars are on the "same" fuel loads, rather than cars on lighter or heavier fuel loads

 

[KekeTheKing]

You can do the same with fuel

Not the same. They would chop seconds off the pit stop by "short filling", in order to get some clear track.

Nowadays, ALL the work has to be done by the driver because the pitstops are of similar duration.

 

[KekeTheKing]

The only difference between 2009 and 2010 was refuelling was banned.

Bro, you know we had this discussion with many critics last year, and I'm loathe to bring it up, but another main factor in the 2009-2010 increase was the addition of the "Slow 6" cars.

 

[Slyboogy]

Not the same. They would chop seconds off the pit stop by "short filling", in order to get some clear track.

Nowadays, ALL the work has to be done by the driver because the pitstops are of similar duration.

I beg to differ....McLaren came up with a new system.

Put three wheels on the car properly, leave the fourth one hanging hoping for the best. That's "short filling" in my view

 

[Brogan]

Bro, you know we had this discussion with many critics last year, and I'm loathe to bring it up, but another main factor in the 2009-2010 increase was the addition of the "Slow 6" cars.

Agreed.
Which puts us back to where we were in the 80's with regards to field spread and performance differential.

Surprise, surprise, the overtaking figures are similar.

 

[Slyboogy]

Which puts us back to where we were in the 80's with regards to field spread and performance differential.

Surprise, surprise, the overtaking figures are similar.

Which had mega reliability issues, and cars running out of fuel and so on and on....

 

[Andyoak]

... And the added entertainment / frustrations of no Blue Flag Rules to help you get past back markers.

It would be interesting to see how Vettel would cope with that; seing as general opinion here seems to be he isn't very good at overtaking....

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

... And the added entertainment / frustrations of no Blue Flag Rules to help you get past back markers.

It would be interesting to see how Vettel would cope with that; seing as general opinion here seems to be he isn't very good at overtaking....

He's not bad in a reasonably priced car though.

 

[Andyoak]

Does overtaking a stack of tyres in the middle of the road count?
Gotta say that was a tidy looking lap he did... and he did come over as a genuinely nice guy. Could certainly imagine enjoying a few pints in his company - can't say the same for Schumacher.

 

[VanChallis]

His `Impression` of Nigel Mansell was hilarious. And the fact that he's a Monty Python fan makes him go up in my estimations as well. I liked Vettel anyway but the TG interview made me like him even more. Genuinely funny and down to earth guy, with an outstanding talent. As well as that, he is quite `German` with the wanting to check tyre pressures!

 

[RevMaxPower]

Van - you know Seb's tyres work very well under pressure.

 

[VanChallis]

Van - you know Seb's tyres work very well under pressure.

Except in Canada

 

[RevMaxPower]

The bottom line remains - NO fuel = NO go = NO race = NO Podium...

Absolutely unforgiveable to not supply a driver with enough fuel to do his job.

 

[Slyboogy]

Absolutely unforgiveable to not supply a driver with enough fuel to do his job.

That happens nearly every race

Rosberg also has had that problem like Hamilton, in China this year, effectively cost him a podium, maybe even a race victory.

 

[Mezzer]

BTW, has anyone seen any information on how much fuel Hamilton had when he returned to the pits at the end of the race? As I've said before, based on the directions he was given on holding back, any fuel still in the car after the finishing line was just ballast.

 

[TN23]

I sound like a bit of a Hamilton fanboy here, but I think that the FIA should set a fuel weight (sorry, mass the scientists around here!) for all cars each season. With turbos (like we are supposed to be getting in 2014) it is up to the driver then to use that boost button wisely, too many boosts will end up with the car out of fuel before the end.

It would seem that I want to bring back the eighties set up!