Grand Prix 2011 Canadian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sons command.

With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!

From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

Thought this might be useful if you wanted to sing along to the Canadian National Anthem before the start of the race.

Anyway, on to the Grand Prix, after all that’s what we’re here for. Last year Bridgestone provided tyres, which didn’t like the surface at the Circuit Gilles Villeneuve too much, and the powers that be in F1 thought “ah, ha here’s an idea to spice up the racing. Why don’t we ask those blokes at Pirelli if they can make sets of boots for F1 cars that fall apart on the warm up lap”, and they did.

In 2010 Hamilton put his car on pole (you may recall him pushing his car back to the pits, so light was it on fuel) and then went on to win an exciting race with teammate Jenson Button standing on the 2nd step.

So what for Canada 2011? Red Bull, at least car No.1, has been a tad difficult to beat but McLaren and Ferrari are getting closer during the race. With 5 wins out of 6 races Vettel has a healthy lead in the Championship and some bookmakers are already paying out on the title being his. Vettel was 3rd on the grid last year, behind teammate Webber, and finished 4th with unspecified gearbox problems, still ahead of Webber who had led for many laps but got caught out by the high tyre wear rate.

Fernando Alonso was 3rd last time out in Canada after getting mugged by a hard charging Jenson Button. Mercedes had a mixed race, Rosberg was “best of the rest” behind the McLaren’s, Alonso’s Ferrari and the Red Bull’s whilst Michael Schumacher treated the race like a destruction derby, straight lining chicanes and bouncing off other cars with gay abandon. What of Felipe Massa I hear you ask; well, he was one of Schumacher’s victims and lost time pitting for a new nose cone.

This is very nearly the last Hurrah for the exhaust blown diffuser and we have two, yes 2, DRS zones. So expect cars breezing past another before and after the pits, when they’re not in their getting new tyres of course.

Will it be another Red Bull walk over or can the McLaren’s and Ferrari’s tame the charging Bull? How will the Pirelli tyres hold up dusty and bumpy Ille Notre-Dame Circuit? Will it rain? Who will win? Can one of the minor teams struggle up into the points? I don’t know but I get the feeling there will be lots of speculation.

And we have our own track side reporter this year - take a bow Ray in Toronto and make sure you post some good photos

For Galahad’s excellent circuit write up, track history and all the stats a boy or girl could want click here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/circuit-gilles-villeneuve/

 

[RickD]

I feel sorry for all those looking at Mclaren through their rose tinted glasses, for 18 months of Whitmarsh's tenure there has been dissapointment after dissapointment, they make one step forward and then three steps backwards, Hamilton's pitstops are consistently slow, speaking of which (numbers don't lie), no one has offered a logical explanation as to why this is the case all we get are people dismissing this strange phenomenon as mere conspiracy theory, although we can see with our own eyes that Hamilton's stops have been dismall at best!

If you put your hand on it, can you scratch that record?

You do seem to have a problem moving on from a point. You have made your point enough and no one wants to listen, so please make another point on your next post instead.

Also, this is a polite forum, this is not 606 (thank god), even if it does seem to be going that way with some of the new members.

On topic: Who is doing a rain dance?

 

[johnnoble1990]

Me!

 

[tranquility2k9]

I have a pretty good idea as to why McLaren are off the pace in qualifying at Canada. They shouldn't be so bad in the race, if it is wet, they'll be laughing, but, even in dry conditions, they should be closer.

The reason is due to their rear wing and DRS setup. Regardless of what their PR team has said and interestingly Paddy Lowe also said that their is no need to bring specialist low downforce parts for this race on Friday - they have clearly been caught out.

Throughout the whole season McLaren's rear wing and DRS has quite obviously been running in a higher downforce spec and when the DRS is activated, the gap that opens is much smaller due to them running a larger flap. Red Bull and Mercedes in contrast run a much lower downforce config with a small flap and when their DRS activates, you get a huge open gap. Ferrari were somewhere inbetween, however, they brought a new rear wing / DRS system especially for this race that is lower downforce and has a much smaller flap. McLaren appear to be running the same DRS and rear wing they have ran all season! This has quite obviously hurt their top speed, with Hamilton quoted as saying they're between 10 and 12 KPH off the top speed of their rivals. But what's more, is that I think one of the huge question marks over Red Bull's superior qualifying pace has been answered. I don't know if you heard Martin Brundle early on in qualifying talk about how the other teams have found that the blown diffuser and off-throttle exhausts become much more effective when running a lower downforce rear wing. It essentially compensates for the loss of rear downforce from the wing, but they obviously gain from the straightline speed. Teams like Ferrari have supposedly found this out this weekend, as it is the first time they've ran a low downforce spec with these latest blown diffusers. Red Bull have been running a very small flap and relatively low downforce rear wing for the entire season and it seems that teams underestimated how effective the blown diffuser was at compensating for the natural loss of downforce from that type of wing. Red Bull knew all along. With Red Bull running a very aggressive blown diffuser and supposedly gaining more than anyone from off-throttle exhausts, they are clearly able to run a very low downforce spec rear wing, gaining good top speed, whilst still generating rear downforce from the floor area.

McLaren are essentially running a high downforce rear wing, but are not really gaining from it and are then losing out big time due to their poor straightline speed and DRS benefit on this track. There is no other logical explanation for why McLaren would suddenly be slower. They were right on the money in Monaco and had race pace to win in Barcelona. They should be fast here and I feel the above reasoning is why they are not (at least in qualifying).

 

[johnnoble1990]

I do hate the whole "will it, won't it rain" debates, but it is hard not to speculate it because it will dominate what happens in the race. It is extremely frustrating though waiting on the weather. Why does it always rain in Cricket, a sport where it is a hindrance, while in formula 1, where it makes it better, it never seems to actually happen (last year aside). Forgot racing in Bahrain, let's hold all races in the peak district.

 

[johnnoble1990]

Yep. It does seem the answer to why Red Bull are faster in Quali than race day is the DRS. Most people seem to think Red Bull are slow on the straights without it, and fast with it.

 

[tranquility2k9]

Some interesting quotes to backup my last post from Peter Windsor:-

"Martin Whitmarsh of McLaren: with hindsight we should have brought a smaller-cord rear wing. We're carrying too much drag"

"Ferrari have benefitted nicely from new off-throttle engine map for qual and new rear wing on RBR7 has improved its top speed"

"HAM additionally slowed on the straight today by a top gear that was too long (ratio based on guestimates of wind levels, DRS, etc)"

 

[Cookinflatsix]

For Mclaren, part updates might not be enough, team boss competence update might also be needed

 

[tsheporam]

For Mclaren, part updates might not be enough, team boss competence update might also be needed

 

[tranquility2k9]

Although McLaren have clearly not brought the optimal spec car to this race, I think people are worrying too much. At Barcelona they were a second off Vettel in qualifying and were then faster in the race. Hamilton was only 5 tenths off in qualifying and most of that was due to a sub-optimal DRS, which will be irrelevant in the race for general race pace. I wouldn't be surprised if McLaren don't have the fastest car tomorrow whether it is wet or dry.

 

[tsheporam]

Although McLaren have clearly not brought the optimal spec car to this race, I think people are worrying too much

For the past 18 months have Mclaren given you reason not to be concerned?

 

[MCLS]

Seems to be a bit like Monza 2010 in terms of qualifying v race strategy

 

[FB]

I think it looks like being quite an exciting race. Ferrari certainly look back on form, Mercedes are there or there abouts (at least Rosberg is) and McLaren always seem to go better in the race than in qualie. The big question, can the prancing horse beat the Red Bull?

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

Here's my contribution to the proceedings:

 

[EvilWhippet]

I'd like to give a quick hand to Quick Nick for shaking the quali monkey off his back. He almost always finishes up on his starting position so he's a strong bet for strong points. Saying that, anything can happen in Formula One, and it...

 

[MCLS]

I wouldn't bet against him, he seems to like Canada, (IMO he should have won in 2008) and the Renault is the best of the rest behind the top 4 teams so its not out of the question.

 

[Brogan]

In the BBC interview Hamilton mentions a problem with the car which may affect him tomorrow.
Could we see a retirement from one of the top 5 for the first time this season?

 

[MCLS]

Right now I cant see it affecting them as much as the problem at the start of the Chinese Grand Prix which he won.

 

[johnnoble1990]

It was a little too vague for us to speculate on. Hopefully the problem is fixable within the parc ferme conditions (KERS).

I have to agree with FB that this is another race extremely well setup. Going on past differences in Quali to Race pace, i reckon Ferrari will be quickest tomorrow, with hopefully Mclaren ahead of Red Bulls for pace. If it rains, everything goes out the window because we almost literally have no info on teams pace in the wet. It could turn to madness.

 

[johnnoble1990]

This was what autosport had to say on the weather for tomorrow. Made at 10pm.

By dawn on race day, the main belt of rain will have cleared to the east, but the track will remain wet for some time. There is expected to be a brief interlude during the early morning hours, but frequent showers will follow on behind, towards the latter stages of the morning and into the afternoon.

The feed of showers from the west is expected to be continuous, keeping the track in a damp condition in the hours before the start of the race. A partially wet race is expected at the very least, given the current forecast and the feed of showers should be maintained during the race window.

Temperatures will take a nosedive once the main part of the low pressure system blows through, with a maximum of just 18 degrees Celsius tomorrow afternoon.

Could be interesting for Mclaren to see if they could maybe get a better start than the others if we start with intermediates. The usual cross over madness could also provide opportunity for drivers in positions to take gambles. The bit at the end on temperature is interesting. Wasn't it the low temperatures that caused tyre problems last year?

 

[MCLS]

And throughout pre season testing this year.