The car or the driver?

[no-FIAt-please]

I think the proof is in the pudding really

Couldn't it be that Vettel was just better than most other drivers with the tyres? He wasn't the only one who managed the tyres fine, Alonso only seemed to have problem with them in cold races where his Ferrari was unable to heat the Medium tyre fast enough and it's unlikely that those problems were Alonso related as Massa had them aswell.

 

[Bushi]

Mclaren was in my eyes the car that manged his tyres best in the first few races.
Ferrari has those tyre heating problems since 2007. Raikkonen was always complaining about them and then we have Silverstone '08(?) which was a backwards race for Massa.

 

[teabagyokel]

I'll need jez or tooncheese to help me out here, but was there not a race where McLaren had the best pace on every set of tyres in the race but was outthought by Red Bull?

 

[tooncheese]

Button was as fast as Vettel at Monaco (often faster), with Fuel adjusted times. The extra two pitstops cost Jenson a near certain win. However I believe Seb was meant to do a two-stopper, but they put the Primes on by mistake and decided to go to the end.

 

[Kewee]

It clearly takes a good driver to get the best out of a car. There are drivers who seem able to extract significantly more from their car than their teammate, Alonso stands out in this regard. In the case of Vettel, he received every upgrade one race sooner than Webber so always had that advantage. Red Bull would deny that, there are insiders who know otherwise.

 

[Josh]

It clearly takes a good driver to get the best out of a car. There are drivers who seem able to extract significantly more from their car than their teammate, Alonso stands out in this regard. In the case of Vettel, he received every upgrade one race sooner than Webber so always had that advantage. Red Bull would deny that, there are insiders who know otherwise.

Where did you get that from? I've never heard of that and their cars always looked the same to me.

 

[RasputinLives]

It clearly takes a good driver to get the best out of a car. There are drivers who seem able to extract significantly more from their car than their teammate, Alonso stands out in this regard. In the case of Vettel, he received every upgrade one race sooner than Webber so always had that advantage. Red Bull would deny that, there are insiders who know otherwise.

Where did you get that from? I've never heard of that and their cars always looked the same to me.

He said - insiders know different - so obviously Kewee is one of the Red Bull pit crew right?

That or someone who doesn't like Vettel very much and just decides to quote something they suspect as fact to try and put down his acheivements.

surely no one would do that though.

He must be Christian Horner.

Hi Chrstian! welcome to Clip The Apex!

 

[Slyboogy]

I heard that Alguersuari got every update first after Canada so he could actually do something! :wink

Wait...I am starting to believe that a little

 

[Bushi]

It clearly takes a good driver to get the best out of a car. There are drivers who seem able to extract significantly more from their car than their teammate, Alonso stands out in this regard. In the case of Vettel, he received every upgrade one race sooner than Webber so always had that advantage. Red Bull would deny that, there are insiders who know otherwise.

True, as history teaches us Alonso has always given the best parts to his teammate.

 

[Viscount]

It clearly takes a good driver to get the best out of a car. There are drivers who seem able to extract significantly more from their car than their teammate, Alonso stands out in this regard. In the case of Vettel, he received every upgrade one race sooner than Webber so always had that advantage. Red Bull would deny that, there are insiders who know otherwise.

I'd like to believe that but I don't. Throughout the season, if Webber didn't get one of the more obvious exterior updates when Vettel did someone would have noticed and the press would have had a field day. Red Bull most expensive update was their Monza package with new front wings, floor and perhaps other unknown upgrades (costing $1 million in production plus wind tunnel costs according to Ross Brawn) and if they really were favouring one driver that would be the one race to do it as no one was supposed to see their updated floor so they could've just given it to Vettel alone without anyone noticing, but Webber also had it as was seen when he crashed out and his car was lifted by the crane.

 

[sportsman]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/97233
McGrath added that beating qualifying master Sebastian Vettel will be crucial if McLaren is to be successful in 2012, particularly as its analysis indicated that the raw pace of last year's MP4-26 was superior towards the end of the season despite Red Bull and Vettel's run of poles.
"He must be a brilliant driver, because by the end of last season we definitely had the best car and he was still whupping us," McGrath said.
"We're trying to figure out exactly what he's doing that's so good. How does he pull out that fast qualifying lap every time? We think it's driver skill. There's no trickery on the cars, he just gets more out of it than we do."

 

[no-FIAt-please]

There can be no doubt that Vettel is a fanatastic driver, particularly in qualifying but if you're telling me the MP4-26 was a faster machine than the RB7 in Brazil then you must be mad. Abu Dhabi perhaps, seeing as McLaren were able to match Red Bull throughout the weekend and it looked as though there it was Vettel that made the difference in Q3.

 

[teabagyokel]

McLaren haven't been very good at Interlagos for years!

 

[sportsman]

There can be no doubt that Vettel is a fanatastic driver, particularly in qualifying but if you're telling me the MP4-26 was a faster machine than the RB7 in Brazil then you must be mad. Abu Dhabi perhaps, seeing as McLaren were able to match Red Bull throughout the weekend and it looked as though there it was Vettel that made the difference in Q3.

I am not telling you anything.That statement was made by Mr.McGrath.So I assume that you think he is mad.Which I personally very much doubt.

 

[sportsman]

http://www.racer.com/mclaren-set-for-new-car-legality-fight/article/225427/

That was the article I was refering in this post before Autosport removed it.

 

[Mephistopheles]

The car 100% without the car the driver would be sat on his arse in his grid slot

 

[Wombcat]

Well, what do you think would happen if the car was on the grid without a driver

 

[Mephistopheles]

Well, what do you think would happen if the car was on the grid without a driver

The same but a computer could be programed to drive it

 

[RasputinLives]

This is F1 not bladerunner!

Although I think Kimi probably is a replicant

 

[Kewee]

Sorry it's taken a while for a follow up comment. To those who disbelieve my comment. It came from a very reliable source. I'm not anti Vettel in any way at all. He's developed into a fine driver, but in saying that, they've have always had their share of politics bubbling away beneath the surface at Red Bull. The same could be said for other teams also. You'd have to be blind to not realize Red Bull was built around Vettel with the intention of turning him into their first World Champion. Witness the horror of certain people in the Red Bull camp, when, for a brief moment in 2011, it appeared that Mark Webber was going to be Champion. The reaction within the team was there for all to see.