Sebastian Vettel

Lots of threads have alluded to having a discussion about the current world champion so lets get it all off our collective chests (oooeer!)

Lots has been has been written about this young man from his testing debut with BMW Sauber in 2006 aged just 19 - he then progressed to the the toro rosso team for his first full race season in 2008 - the memorable race being his drive in the wet at Fuji where he managed to rear end his future team mate Mark Webber who said ""It's kids isn't it... kids with not enough experience – they do a good job and then they fuck it all up." - Little was Mark to know he would be paired with the "Kid" just 2 years later.

His maiden win came at the 2008 Italian GP where he qualified up from, the race started under the safety car in the rain and the young German led from start to finish in the Toro Rosso - becoming the youngest winner of a grand prix ever.

Then we enter the era of the Red Bull. In 2009 he joined the Red Bull team, which got off to a torrid start as he managed to crash into Kubika in Australia, a feat he would go on to repeat during the 09 season.

Last year needs no mention........

So to the crux of the matter. Is Sebastian Vettel?

the real deal, the baby schumi, the new pretender - a genuine racer? - aka Wunderkind

or

A very quick driver, who lucked into a very fast car and can bang it on pole and lead from lights to flag and be the quickest pilot of a car, yet can't overtake for toffee? aka WunOrAother

 

[FB]

Maybe Marko thinks Seb has got a bit complacent and wanted to give him a "gee up". Some people respond to an arm around the others to a kick up the arse. Maybe this is Red Bull's metaphorical kick up the arse to Sebastien.

 

[The Pits]

I seem to recall Tom Walkinshaw having a similar conversation with Damon Hill in 1997

 

[Jen]

I too was on the Sebastian Vettel thread which is why I posted the piece about him.

I actually wasn't replying to your post. I was discussing Sebastian Vettel on the Sebastian Vettel thread.

Thank God for that and gosh, how confusing some things become!

 

[RasputinLives]

Yes. I'm very confused by semantics.

 

[F1Yorkshire]

http://sniffpetrol.com/2014/07/28/vettel-makes-kettle/

 

[no-FIAt-please]

Another chance at a win gone for Vettel. Ricciardo cleans up again.

All this tells me is Vergne>Vettel .

 

[Il_leone]

well it just seems no matter how hard Seb is trying Daniel is simply doing a better job

his first off having a go at Lewis his tyres were cold and that allow Rosberg past him

his second off where he got wide and allowed Daniel through probably was the gap that Daniel needed to stay ahead of Nico given he might have held up Daniel

I think the telling thing is the gap which is 58 pts so more than 2 races and surely he is not going to face the ignominy where he may have to support Daniel in the drivers title race

 

[FB]

Seb had to make one more pit stop that Daniel today. As he wasn't able to run in FP2 (as the wiring loom was burnt out) they weren't able to assess tyre wear on full tanks so took Ricciardo's data as the base line. Seb had significantly more tyre wear than Daniel.

Not trying to undermine Ricciardo's achievements but there needs to be some perspective on Vettel's performance other than "he's crap and been found out"

 

[Il_leone]

that is what I meant no matter what Seb is doing , Daniel simply is able to do a better job

 

[Bill Boddy]

Since they used Ricciardo's data which caused Vettel's tyres to wear excessively why didn't Ricciardo's tyres go the same way?

 

[cider_and_toast]

Ricciardo was at or near the front the whole race while Vettel was having to drive a lot harder especially towards the later stages.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

Vettel seems to have four wheels off the circuit at any opportunity where there is an advantage to be gained. It wasn't pretty watching him drive yesterday and it smacks of desperation. Ricciardo is sublime. A third win underlines utter dominance in this teammate battle. The verdict is in and there seems to be no question now.

 

[Bill Boddy]

Some time ago I said that I would reserve my judgement until after Spa. Maybe I should give Vettel even more time, until after Singapore maybe? Or just how long will it take until he outdrives his less experienced team mate?

 

[F1Yorkshire]

The flyaways at the end of the season has always been where Vettel has dominated. If he can't regain his status as the lead Red Bull driver in the next few races then I think his day is done. As has been said already.....

All this tells me is Vergne>Vettel .

 

[FB]

One thing I think everyone in sport knows is that, eventually, someone will come along who is better, stronger, faster than you are. I don't think Vettel is finished yet though.

 

[Incubus]

The flyaways at the end of the season has always been where Vettel has dominated.

---------------------------------

I keep hearing that but maybe there's also a case for saying "flyways at the end of the season have always been where Red Bull dominated"?...

 

[F1Yorkshire]

I don't think Vettel is finished yet though.

He may have a future with another team but Red Bull certainly have shown they won't hesitate to replace a driver when they clearly have a whole raft of future stars waiting in the wings. Vettel will race for Red Bull next season but probably not as the number 1 driver in the team.

You're right Incubus, we'll just have to see what happens.

 

[sushifiesta]

My opinion of Vettel will only change if he's comprehensively beaten by Ricciardo again next season.

 

[RasputinLives]

My honest is that Vettel is not actually performing badly at all. In fact he's had some great drives with yesterday being one of them. Its just that Ricciardo is having an amazing season.

We saw Alonso get beat by a new young team mate and then bounce back so maybe we can see Vettel do the same.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

I didn't think he drove well at all yesterday. Wide on the exit of every corner, cutting Eu Rouge every lap. Bailed overtakes resulting in lost positions and went backwards for the entire race only moving up at the end through fortune of coming out on top of a four way battle that could have been anyone's and pretty much was from corner to corner. All this whilst his teammate went forward in the race with the fortune of the Mercedes gift but also with some clean decisive overtaking, clinical driving within the limits of the circuit and a measured and perfectly judged win. When there is that potential in the car and, without incident, Vettel completely failed to capitalise on it then it is impossible to say he drove well.