Ferrari to protest Vettel for overtaking under yellow flags?

[Brogan]

A further twist..

App H of FIA Sporting Regs, art 2.4.1 says 'if flags and lights used, supplementary regs of event must specify which is regulatory'.

I must admit I wasn't aware the precedence changed race-on-race depending on the supplementary reg's in place for each circuit.

Yet again it makes you question why the FIA don't just have a single system and stick to it.

https://twitter.com/ianparkesf1/status/274090978288209921

 

[Brogan]

This, by the way, is what caused the yellow flag in the first place.

 

[KekeTheKing]

pirateplunder - I would say the Marshall is definitely waving the Green incorrectly. And I would also say it is highly unlikely that Seb even saw the flag. He was probably paying much more attention to the Sister car that got completely off the throttle.

If Seb is incredulously penalized here, it will have been Red Bull/Mateschitz/Toro Rosso's fault for creating this situation. Vettel was left with no other option than to pass a dramatically slowing Vergne.

Remember, in India Button was not penalized when he CLEARLY overtook under Yellow because he claimed that Karthikeyan slowed dangerously.

 

[Hamberg]

That's that then

 

[Josh]

Ferrari have now said on Twitter that they asked the FIA for a clarification of the overtake in question.

 

[jez101]

I'm not even sure that this has any bearing on the situation, but the only thing that is unequivocal about this scenario is that DRS was definitely DISABLED on Lap 4 when Vettel went by Vergne in the DRS Zone. It was enabled on Lap 3 when Vettel passed Glock in the DRS Zone, but it was disabled again before he got back there.

14:05 - DRS ENABLED (About to pass Glock)
View attachment 5460

14:06 - DRS DISABLED (End of Lap 3)
View attachment 5461

Now on Lap 4 (This screen was taken at the exact moment of the "pass") - Still DISABLED
View attachment 5462

14:09 - DRS ENABLED again (Lap 5)
View attachment 5463

Top effort pulling all that together. You obviously have more feeds than me

There is definitely a synchronisation problem though because the world feed doesn't show the DRS Disabled Message until Lewis is entering T12

You also have better screen capture software than me

 

[Hamberg]

Scuderia Ferrari‏@InsideFerrari
La Ferrari ha chiesto, tramite una lettera, un chiarimento alla FIA in merito al sorpasso di VET su VER nel corso del giro 4 del GP Brasile.
https://twitter.com/InsideFerrari

Translate:
The Ferrari asked, in a letter, a clarification from the FIA ​​about the overtaking of VET VER during the 4th round of the Brazilian Grand Prix.

 

[teabagyokel]

jez101 - I think it always shows it on the timing screens first.

 

[pirateplunder]

Brogan - Although, as there are no lights at that particular marshalling post then surely the supplementary regs wouldn't come into play? The only indicator is the green flag.

 

[KekeTheKing]

Yet again it makes you question why the FIA don't just have a single system and stick to it.

Because they thrive on obscurity. They enjoy being able to make decisions based on more than meets the eye. They relish the opportunity to do things as only they see fit.

This is why I simply cannot stand the argument "Rules are Rules......" Not with the FIA. They're the judge, jury, and executioner. They've been known to come to baffling decisions when certain drivers and teams are involved.

 

[mnmracer]

Why would the marshall have made an error?
They flag for the sector past their post; Maldonado happened in the sector before their post.

 

[Hamberg]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104644

Formula 1's ruling body, the FIA, says there is "no case" to answer in the controversy involving Sebastian Vettel's overtaking of Jean-Eric Vergne during the Brazilian Grand Prix.

 

[KekeTheKing]

If Race Control says that Sector 4 is YELLOW, the Marshalls in Sector 4 should not be waving a green flag. Seems common sense to me.

 

[pirateplunder]

mnmracer Surely they flag according to what they are told by race control? Either MS4 is under caution or it isnt. If it isn't then the the light at the exit of turn 3 would be green. If it is then that light would be yellow (which it was). hence, MS4 is still 'yellow' and doesn't go green until the start of turn 4. A marshal half way down the sector waving green is nonsensical - to me.

As an aside what does this do to Vetel moving to Ferrari in 2014? Has Alonso just won here - Ferrari protest, either Vettel looses the WDC or doesn't but either way relationships can't be improved from the whole thing?

 

[Brogan]

Move along, nothing to see here.

Ferrari must be feeling rather foolish stating that they've written to the FIA seeking clarification mere seconds before the FIA say there is no case to answer.

To clarify: Vettel's pass was not illegal, he is still WDC and will remain so.

 

[Hamberg]

Wow Bro, you sound just like Adam Cooper, could it be...

 

[jez101]

At around 4.32 in Brogan 's video above you see the Williams on the crane as Vergne goes past followed by Vettel. Now I know that the yellows were for that, it makes even more sense for the marshall to be waving green because that was are past where the danger was.

It wasn't clear either what the flags were for, or what happened to Pastor until today

It does appear that there were some communication issues though. No wonder the FIA want to close this can of worms!

 

[Brogan]

Now that it's all over, here's an alternative take on it

http://sniffpetrol.com/2012/11/29/ferrari-to-challenge-christmas/

 

[KekeTheKing]

Well that was fun while it lasted.

Good to know that in the Multi-Billion dollar Ultra-Technological world of F1, a misguided Brazilian marshall can save your bacon.

 

[jez101]

Was the marshall really misguided KekeTheKing ? I mean, he could see that the cars were past the danger. He could see that the next race control light was green and there was no danger in between.

I've never been a marshall but in the 'good old days', they would be the ones telling race control what was safe and what wasn't. Now is it the other way around? If so, why give them flags at all - lights are far more visible as the sorry saga shows.

As best as I can tell, he was waving that flag for over a lap as Vettel went past it twice . The bloke was right that they had passed the danger after all. Do you think that perhaps this is a feedback issue (to the timing screens, the definition of sector 4 etc) rather than a control issue (where the guy just acts of his own accord)?