Grand Prix 2011 Canadian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sons command.

With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!

From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

Thought this might be useful if you wanted to sing along to the Canadian National Anthem before the start of the race.

Anyway, on to the Grand Prix, after all that’s what we’re here for. Last year Bridgestone provided tyres, which didn’t like the surface at the Circuit Gilles Villeneuve too much, and the powers that be in F1 thought “ah, ha here’s an idea to spice up the racing. Why don’t we ask those blokes at Pirelli if they can make sets of boots for F1 cars that fall apart on the warm up lap”, and they did.

In 2010 Hamilton put his car on pole (you may recall him pushing his car back to the pits, so light was it on fuel) and then went on to win an exciting race with teammate Jenson Button standing on the 2nd step.

So what for Canada 2011? Red Bull, at least car No.1, has been a tad difficult to beat but McLaren and Ferrari are getting closer during the race. With 5 wins out of 6 races Vettel has a healthy lead in the Championship and some bookmakers are already paying out on the title being his. Vettel was 3rd on the grid last year, behind teammate Webber, and finished 4th with unspecified gearbox problems, still ahead of Webber who had led for many laps but got caught out by the high tyre wear rate.

Fernando Alonso was 3rd last time out in Canada after getting mugged by a hard charging Jenson Button. Mercedes had a mixed race, Rosberg was “best of the rest” behind the McLaren’s, Alonso’s Ferrari and the Red Bull’s whilst Michael Schumacher treated the race like a destruction derby, straight lining chicanes and bouncing off other cars with gay abandon. What of Felipe Massa I hear you ask; well, he was one of Schumacher’s victims and lost time pitting for a new nose cone.

This is very nearly the last Hurrah for the exhaust blown diffuser and we have two, yes 2, DRS zones. So expect cars breezing past another before and after the pits, when they’re not in their getting new tyres of course.

Will it be another Red Bull walk over or can the McLaren’s and Ferrari’s tame the charging Bull? How will the Pirelli tyres hold up dusty and bumpy Ille Notre-Dame Circuit? Will it rain? Who will win? Can one of the minor teams struggle up into the points? I don’t know but I get the feeling there will be lots of speculation.

And we have our own track side reporter this year - take a bow Ray in Toronto and make sure you post some good photos

For Galahad’s excellent circuit write up, track history and all the stats a boy or girl could want click here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/circuit-gilles-villeneuve/

 

[RasputinLives]

5/6 stop would be interesting but then you have to ask are we going to get to the stage where the teams don't have enough set of tyres to get through a race and have to use the same set twice!

I wonder if anyone will factor into their strategy that we usually get at least one saftey car at Canada - get it in the right place and could be essential.

 

[teabagyokel]

Its a dangerous game, Rasputin. A lot of teams were surprised last year by the lack of a Safety Car. In the end they got lucky because the prime degraded.

 

[The Enforcer]

I wonder if anyone will factor into their strategy that we usually get at least one saftey car at Canada - get it in the right place and could be essential.

Dangerous game Rasputin, but I would expect several people will benefit from the midfield.

What I don't want to see is F1 going down the route of NASCAR / IRL where teams factor yellow flag periods into there race weekend and results being turned on there head purely down to a 'lucky call'.

 

[teabagyokel]

What I don't want to see is F1 going down the route of NASCAR / IRL where teams factor yellow flag periods into there race weekend and results being turned on there head purely down to a 'lucky call'.

We had a time like that in 2007-08 (roughly) with the one-stop merchants! Alex Wurz in Canada in 2007 and Nelsinho Piquet in Germany in 2008 are probably the best examples. With the end of refuelling, this has gone because the front has almost the same flexibility as the back.

 

[sushifiesta]

Monaco aside there have actually been very few retirements, or at least it seems that way to me. I don't think we'd seen a safety car before Monaco? So I think you would have to be feeling either very lucky or very desperate to have a strategy that relied on there being a safety car at some point.

 

[Bill Boddy]

Monaco aside there have actually been very few retirements, or at least it seems that way to me. I don't think we'd seen a safety car before Monaco? So I think you would have to be feeling either very lucky or very desperate to have a strategy that relied on there being a safety car at some point.

I was about to say Mercedes but then remembered that this is about tyres. But then maybe a safety car every ten laps might be what they need.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

Just so everyone here knows, Pirelli nominated Softs/Super-Super for Monaco, Montreal and Valencia BEFORE the Spanish Grand Prix!...Pirelli are taking Soft/Super-Softs to Canada because Montreal lacks the type of grip you get at Spain/Turkey/Malaysia...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91914

Paul Hembrey explaining how Hards may actually degrade more than Softs/Super-Softs on a track with lesser grip like Montreal...that running 'too hard' a tyre would cause excessive wheel-spin thus leading to graining and greater ware. He explains it better in the link above.

 

[The Enforcer]

Hate to say I told you so

That's the key Galahad, it's the hard acceleration out of the slow corners that will cause the most problems so mechanical grip, driver input and downforce will be key.

Because the circuit is predominately made up of slow and medium speed corners, interspersed with long straights the compound goes through very unnatural heat cycles and the chemical reactions that take place aren't seen anywhere else on the calendar.

The tyres will constantly go through a cycle of very heavy loading in the braking zones, followed by hard acceleration and a prolonged period of light loading on the long straights. This tends to overheat and work the compound for very short periods, followed by sustained periods of cooling down before the next heavy braking zone.

This is something the tyres in general aren't normally asked to go through as all other circuits (with the exception of Monza) offer a more constant set of loading parameters.

Pirelli IMO have gone for soft and supersoft as we know these tyres can loose core temperature very quickly and this heat and grip is required instantly when braking into the hairpin before the back straight for example.

 

[Lewywo4]

I was surprised to see that Pirelli are taking the Soft and Supersoft tyres with the wear rates being so high at Montreal.

Could the reason be that, the Scuderia seem to be having a problem with the hard compound tires.

 

[Slyboogy]

Could the reason be that, the Scuderia seem to be having a problem with the hard compound tires.

We have already discussed this matter...and it has got really boring....

 

[The Enforcer]

Could the reason be that, the Scuderia seem to be having a problem with the hard compound tires.

You clearly haven't read the article or the many posts explaining why the hard compound wasn't an option.

Everybody, Red Bull included haven't found the hard option that easy to cope with and any suggestion this decision was made to favour Ferrari is wide of the mark at best. (We all know what you're getting at, so drop the act).

My 'Black art of tyres' article will be ready tomorrow so if you want to learn more about tyre technology I recommend you give it a look and would welcome any questions you or anyone else might have (post me directly).

 

[Brogan]

Th Canadian quiz is now available, courtesy of TBY.

http://cliptheapex.com/threads/2011-canadian-gp-pre-race-quiz.2829/

 

[Sarinaide]

I would like to say I am suffering withdrawals already........Just counting down by the second I long for the day of weekly races........I miss race weekend.

I see some post talking of tyre strategy, but the possible duel will be between the 3 stoppers and 4 stoppers.

 

[johnnoble1990]

It's difficult to know how the tyres will react. I shall wait and see, but it is definitely the significant factor again. I foresee a ridiculous amount of overtakes as well with the double DRS . I don't like to judge too early, but if one was too long in Turkey, 2 on the track that produced the most dry overtakes last year will surely just see cars cruising past each other. Fingers crossed Mclaren will find themselves ahead of the Red Bulls and we could see this being the beginning of the real World Championship. I can't get on board with everyone saying it is over. If one driver can build up a 58 point gap in 6 races, then several drivers have the chance to reverse that gap in 13 races, especially if Mclaren or Ferrari overtake Red Bull to have the fastest car.

Bring on Canada. Having withdrawals as well after the drama of the last 2 races.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

I think we are in for the closest fought race of the season. We'll have the usual top 5, but none of us will have a clue what the podium will look like until the closing laps. I fully expect a roller coaster of a race and I really hope for the sake of the rest of the championship that Lewis can take this win and that all of Vettel's closest competitors can take points from him. I don't wish any ill against Vettel but I hope, more than anything, that the Red Bull gets levelled by the McLarens and the Ferraris. I really want to like Vettel but something is missing. I should have conceded to his talents a long time ago, but I still haven't seen him win in adversity. Even when the odds have been stacked against him, lady luck has come to his rescue. I know it sounds bitter, but I want this for his own sake, rather than just for my own satisfaction. It's all a bit too easy for him at the moment. I give him his dues all the same. He is more than a worthy champion and more than deserves to be leading the championship at this point. Does he deserve it any more than some of the drivers and teams that he and the Red Bull are currently beating? I am not so sure.

 

[Cookinflatsix]

Yes Vettel is a great driver especially now that he seems to be maturing, however it is frustrating that there is no proof that he is suddenly the best driver on he grid seeing as Lewis has had the better of him so far in other series
Hopefully Canada will allow us to see the drivers compete without a handicap, maybe Red Bulls one lap trick will not be as decisive in qualifying here

 

[johnnoble1990]

We will always struggle to class the best driver in the world. I'm pretty sure it is not Vettel though. Last season he struggled in the face of adversity and was perhaps champion of the circumstances in the end, while this season the combination of the speed of his car and Mark struggling with Pirelli's has turned it into a slam dunk, with a little bit of luck thrown in to help him out. This said, we have seen on a few occasions Vettel showing his maturity. Overtaking those 3 cars in a lap in Spain was insane, albeit a result of having a Red Bull and fresh tyres. It is too easy though to simply look at who is winning and say they are the best driver in Formula 1, because unlike most sports there is more factors in play.

I think in the end Lewis is the best driver in Formula 1 because of his natural talent. As said previously, Vettel hasn't always been master of the cars he has driven and at times last year he seemed to really lack natural racing ability, especially in overtaking and starting. Lewis has always seemed to have that and when he unleashes it, it really is something to behold.

We will have to wait till the end of the season to review it, but this will never be a completely quantifiable question.

 

[landogeorgelewis1]

I'm still puzzled by the need to have two DRS zones in Canada. They all might aswell take the KER'S out of the car because i can't see it been used all that often in Canada.

 

[jez101]

If anyone wants a punt on the number of stops for the winner in Canada, I have put another poll up

http://cliptheapex.com/threads/how-many-stops-in-canada.2885/

 

[RasputinLives]

I don't get this thing where people say Vettel hasn't proven how good he is yet and he made too many mistakes last year - he came through to win the title didn't he? so surely those mistakes don't matter right? As for lady luck being on his side if he'd had said lady on his side last season the championship would have been over way earlier. Throw in the season he spent in the Toro Rosso and I think you can safely say the kid has proven himself. He's not Lewis no - Seb has that Sennesque quality of liking to lead from the front where as Lewis is more Mansell like because he's far more comfy chasing the race - just means they are different not that one's better than the other. I think people need to stop being in denial about Mr V and realise we have 3 world class drivers on the grid at the moment.

back on topic though - I'm starting to get worried about the Canadian race with the double DRS - got a feeling it might ruin it more than help it. Always loved the race in Canada and will be dissapointed if it completely devalues overtaking.

I know I said Lewis before but got a sneaky feeling Jenson might get a win here - he's been very close this season so far and the gods of fate may serve him one up.