Which team has the best driver line-up? McLaren, Ferrari, Mercedes, or Red Bull?

[cider_and_toast]

It's hard to say how strong the teams chasing Merc will be next season but looking back at this season, Hamilton, Rosberg, Alonso, Button and Ricciardo extracted the best level of performance out of themseleves, the car and their teams. Seb, Kimi and Kyvat struggled.

So as a pair it would have to come down to team Merc or team Mc. I'm going to have to say, team Merc just shade it. The reason being is that both drivers are in year two of the current regs with the same team. Both drivers are quick across all areas of the weekend (with one quicker than the other on Sunday and vice versa on Saturday). Alonso is a great all round driver where as of the four in question Jense is perhaps the weakest in qualifying leaving himself more to do in the race.

The biggest un-knowns are how Kimi will come back, if at all. How Seb and Kyvat will do in their new teams and for all of the drivers, how they work together to develop the car.

 

[KekeTheKing]

The Jim Clark/Graham Hill pairing in 1967 certainly worked out fine. However, neither of them was noted for having the massive egos that prevail today.

Formula One should have just folded up shop and disbanded in 1969. These asshats that were born after Nam are completely useless and don't even deserve to call themselves racers. Egotistical pussies the whole lot of em I tell ya!

Hey it's fun to be a bombastic old coot once in a while! Can't wait until 2044 so I can tell the youngins how great the F1 pilot was at the turn of the Millenium.

Oh yeah and I went for the brats in Brackley. By some margin.

 

[Mephistopheles]

I think it has more to do with the attitude of the sportsmanship between the drivers than the development of the sport that myself and siffert_fan were getting at, when was the last time a driver threw away a race win to help his fellow competitor who was in danger?

The last time I remember a driver giving another driver in need help was at Spa and that person was Eddie Irvine of all people but he was already out of the race anyway, Micheal Schumacher himself didn't even stop to lend his own brother a hand when he thought he may have been seriously injured at Indy one year, because it would have compromised his championship.

These are the values me and siffert are talking about and they are sadly missed, modern day drivers don't even bother to slow down for double waved yellow flags anymore which is why the virtual safety car will be introduce next year, to be quite honest modern day drivers should be ashamed of themselves..

 

[cider_and_toast]

Mephistopheles but could you imagine the outcry if Button was called in to the pits and forced to hand his car over to Alonso to help his championship chances? It was bad enough after THAT message.

While I agree with you about drivers not slowing down. Do you think part of the reason they don't stop these days is because they know that expert and well trained marshalls are close at hand to help out. In years gone by that was never the case. Just look at the number of drivers who had to try and rescue their fellow racers because the marshalls were poorly equipped or didn't have fire proof gear.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Maybe cider_and_toast but I know that if it were my brother in that car then I would have stopped and sod the race.

Edit.

I see what you are getting at about giving up your car to your team mate but I feel that is an entirely different issue and one I do not agree with...

 

[cider_and_toast]

Oh yeah I agree but that's part of the reason why you and I aren't F1 world champions. We're not ruthless bastards.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Yeah I'm a big ol' softy at heart..

 

[Westy]

So it was already mentioned, but where is the Williams lineup? Massa has come closer to a title than Ricoardo. And Bottas has shown himself to be a real talent having secured a number of podiums. I do understand not putting every team up, thanks for a good discussion topic.

Out of the selection we have to choose from the choice comes down to the rubric you are using. Are we going by number of titles? Are we going on current form? The drivers full body of work? Projected car performance.

On number of titles the Ferrari pairing have it sewn up thanks to Vettel's dominance.

On current form then Hamilton, Rosberg and Ricciardo are the best of the bunch. Therefore the Merc team get my vote.

Based on the full body of work for each driver then I feel the McLaren pairing are the best. Fernando's 6 tenths is legendary.

Lastly, projected car performance - again the Merc is probably in the strongest position here. Their car and engine package was top knacker this year and it is completely reasonable to believe it will continue best season.

All that being said, the Merc pairing scored two points followed by 1 point each for McLaren and Ferrari. The RedBull team come home with nothing to show for it.

Thank you for reading another of Westy's ridiculously long posts.

 

[KekeTheKing]

By the raw numbers

McLaren duo - 3 WDC
47 Wins
30 Pole Positions
29 Fastest Laps
147 Podiums

Ferrari pair - 5 WDC
59 Wins
61 Pole Positions
64 Fastest Laps
143 Podiums

Mercedes match - 2 WDC
41 Wins
53 Pole Positions
29 Fastest Laps
96 Podiums

 

[Jen]

I thought we were supposed to be looking at the best driver line-up. I voted for McLaren. That doesn't mean they will have the best car but the best drivers to get the maximum from their machinery.

And it is a hope, not a certainty, that Mercedes will once again produce the best car - for all of those who voted for Hamilton and Rosberg. Both brilliant drivers, but yet to be tested against a better machine!

 

[KekeTheKing]

Hamilton won the title in a Non-WCC car that was inferior to the Ferrari far more often than it was superior. What are you talking about Jen??

 

[Il_leone]

the one true skill amongst these drivers is wet weather racing and Mclaren have the best two . Rosberg a still circumspect in those conditions

Rosberg pushed Hamilton close through consistency and the car being by far the best in the field by a margin and did not have the race pace consistency when it mattered something Button would always make up for his lack of 1 lap speed

Alonso and Button are amongst the best two in the field who do not need to rely on pole position to win

One other stat that does not help Rosberg - he has not won two races in a row as well being able to answer if he can beat and outrace Hamilton head to head

 

[Hamberg]

Hamilton won the title in a Non-WCC car that was inferior to the Ferrari far more often than it was superior. What do you mean Jen, it's not clear?

 

[Jen]

Hamberg, the thread is about best driver line-up, is it not.

I was merely pointing up that the best team of drivers does not necessarily have the best car and that the best car last season won't necessarily be the best in the next.

I thought that was obvious!

 

[Hamberg]

Not 'obvious' no, but clearer now. I was just interested as I think the strongest lineup regardless of machinery is Mercedes so I'm not doing it based on a hope that Merc has the same dominance.

Hamilton and Alonso indisputably drag their cars to places not thought possible, with Button and Rosberg with more to prove. But from what I've seen of both drivers I think in the same team Rosberg would have the edge which then, in my opinion, gives the Merc lineup the edge regardless if equipment.

 

[Brogan]

Thread locked until I tidy it.

Any more personal attacks and rule breaches will result in warnings and thread bans.

Edit: Thread reopened.

 

[Il_leone]

I'll stick with two of the best racers come Sunday afternoon

I'll add in both have beaten World champion teammates

With Rosberg - Schumacher was way past his prime so Hamilton is the only one of real quality he has raced against

Button is the only one to beat Hamilton as a teammate over 1 season and admitted he is one of the fastest drivers over 1 lap he has come up against

 

[P1]

It's interesting very few people rate the Ferrari driver line-up as best, even though together they have won 5 world championships, versus the 3 at McLaren and 2 at Mercedes.

Shows how much the machinery is more important than the driver.

 

[cider_and_toast]

For me, it's not so much the machinery as getting the maximum out of the machinery.

Looking at this season and projecting forward, neither Vettel or Kimi got the maximum speed out of their cars (at least compared to their team mates anyway).

 

[Tuscan1969]

Agreed cider_and_toast ; my assesment is about the drivers as a pair and NOT about what car they are driving.

If I was to factor the car in I'd say Merc pair top and Williams pair second with Red Bull pair third