Things ... Welcome to the Future (2018 - 2019 Silly Season)

[F1Brits_90]

in raw speed Verstappen is a few tenths quicker for majority of times in qualifying. but never gets to show it as he does have had reliability problems both self inflicted & Renaults fault. unfortunately for riccardio qualifying enhances your reputation more than the race does. its how F1 has always been down the years, since qualifying has been televised.

also had a look at the gap in qualifying between max & daniel
Australia - MV 0.273
Bahrain - MV 0.178 (in q1 before Max binned it)
China - MV 0.152
Baku - DR 0.083
Spain - MV 0.002
Monaco - N/A
Canada - MV 0.179
France - MV 0.190
Austrian - MV 0.156
Britain - MV 0.497
Germany - MV 0.191 (in q1 before Riccardio PU went bang)
Hungary - N/A

 

[RasputinLives]

unfortunately for riccardio qualifying enhances your reputation more than the race does. its how F1 has always been down the years, since qualifying has been televised.

Since it's been televised indicates that it only enhances the reputation of the driver with the fan base and not with the teams. Qualifying has a weird status in F1 right now. I mean it's not even qualifying really because you don't actually have to set a time to be in the race. I understand why people enjoying watching it and analysing it but it being used as a way of deciding who is the best driver seems a bit daft.

Let's look at 100m sprinting. No one cares who wins the qualifying rounds. It's just a matter of getting through to be in the actual race. No one is arguing that Usain Bolt wasn't all he was cracked up to be because he came 2nd in Olympic semi finals are they.

 

[Angel]

Ahh yes but qualifying is often the yardstick by which the commentators tell us who is performing best in each team. You're right though, the race results matter far more, after all the points are won on a Sunday, no one gets anything for Saturday.

 

[vintly]

Quali is a time trial - I love time trials. Not as much as a race but fantastic nonetheless. Hence of course quali is exciting - oh and it’s the fastest you’ll ever see the cars on that track. Which is also quite a draw.

The 100m sprint analogy does’t work - if you got a yard on everyone for winning the semi-final you can be sure Bolt woulda won it.

 

[Publius Cornelius Scipio]

IMHO qualy is important but the fastest time in the race even more so

 

[Izumi]

With imposition of parc fermé, a rule I absolutely despise, I am not convinced that we aways do see fastest laps of the event during qualifications trials. I rather see approach to qualification as a strategic decision on compromise which has taken into consideration anticipated weather at the race start, related downforce setup and choice of tire which will do the job once lights go off. Lap speed might not be then fully representative of equipment's capability.

Ferrari paid just recently heavy price for miscalculation of that equation and not being permitted to correct so badly needed race setup on Sunday morning. The golden advice "just shut up and drive" has for very long time outlived its usefulness.

 

[F1Brits_90]

But RasputinLives in the current iteration of f1. This is usually the 2 laps in Q3 on the whole weekend. where they are on it they arent managing tyres fuel power unit parts. Its wringing every drop out of that car. Q3 is 100m final. The 100m 1st rd QF & SF are more your free practises

 

[RasputinLives]

I'm afraid to break it to you all but F1 has never been about raw speed. It's always been about who can cover 200 miles in the quickest amount of time. That's a marathon not a sprint. If you want to see cars full out fast as they can the there is always drag racing.

 

[Titch]

Love drag racing.

 

[F1Brits_90]

I'm afraid to break it to you all but F1 has never been about raw speed. It's always been about who can cover 200 miles in the quickest amount of time. That's a marathon not a sprint. If you want to see cars full out fast as they can the there is always drag racing.

We all know that points are on sunday But i said since qualifying televised. That always helps the repuation & thats huge in F1. Riccardio started getting his red bull drive because of the 5th in bahrain, is always highly regarded more than prost because of amongst others his qualifying. Hamilton has always had that feeling of beating his teammate because of his qualifying

If you get beaten by your teammate constantly in qualifying you will get under pressure

 

[Izumi]

What's wrong with "prost"? I am assuming you are referring to Alain Prost, the man with a few WDCs to his credit.

 

[F1Brits_90]

What's wrong with "prost"? I am assuming you are referring to Alain Prost, the man with a few WDCs to his credit.

That sort of my fault, im writing as im talking & didnt double check so forgot to write about senna before the prost thing

But yes prost has 5 world championships. But he is never mentioned in top elite. Because he was a professor. Senna despite 10 fewer wins & 2 fewer championships. Is for most rated higher because of his mighty qualifying lap

 

[Izumi]

I like Alain Prost. I rate him higher than Senna. Moreover, I have tendency usually ignore what British media say about a French racing driver, but then, I also rate Schumacher as one of the most talented and accomplished drivers of his era. Go and figure. Some of us fans are - simply put - a different breed.

 

[RasputinLives]

Prost is always in the elite and if anyone doesn't mention him when taking about the elite they've not done their research.

 

[The Pits]

He wasn't great in formula E though.

 

[RasputinLives]

Senna was crap in Formula E too. Piquet was much better though. Guess he's the GOAT

 

[Angel]

Well Christian Horner thinks Ricciardo has taken a 'big risk' signing for Renault. If he has that just proves how unwelcome he felt at Red Bull doesn't it? I get the feeling he's been made to feel like leaving was his only sensible option, much like what happened with Vettel during/after the 2014 season when he jumped ship and went to Ferrari. Unfortunately for Ricciardo there wasn't an obviously better option for him to go to. On a more positive note I am sure Daniel will be thrilled to know that Jacques Villeneuve thinks he's done the right thing, awww isn't that nice?

Christian Horner also says it wouldn't be the 'healthiest thing' for Red Bull to sign Alonso. Can you imagine him and Max together and how they'd be on the radio? Thinking on it, I reckon it could be quite entertaining in some ways but apparently it's not going to happen. As I said before, as much as anything I think Alonso is too old and not cool enough for them.

 

[Ruslan]

The nice thing about this move is that it gives us a measure of Hulkenberg, Perez, Ocon and Sainz compared to DR and Verstappen. Hulkenberg and Perez were teammates for three years at Force India, so we have a pretty good sense of how they compare with each other. Perez and Ocon have been teammate for two years. So, now we get to compare DR with Hulkenberg, which I think will be very telling.

Just for the record, the three years Hulkenberg and Perez were together:

Points
Perez: 59 + 78 +101 = 238
Hulkenberg: 96 + 58 + 72 = 226

Highest Finish
Perez: 3rd + 3rd + 3rd (x2) = 3rd (x4)
Hulkenberg: 5th (x4) + 6th (x3) + 4th = 4th

Qualifying Duel
Perez: 7 + 8 + 9 = 24
Hulkenberg: 12 + 11 + 12 = 34

Highest grid
Perez: 5th + 4th + 2nd = 2nd
Hulkenberg: 4th + 5th + 3rd = 3rd

Perez vs Ocon for almost two years (through Hungary 2019):

Points
Perez: 100 + 30 = 130
Ocon: 87 + 29 = 116

Highest Finish
Perez: 4th + 3rd = 3rd
Ocon: 5th (x2) + 6th = 5th (x2)

Qualifying Duel
Perez: 13 + 3 = 16
Ocon: 7 + 9 = 16

Highest Grid
Perez: 6th (x2) + 8th (x2) = 6th (x2)
Ocon: 5th + 6th = 5th

Verstappen vs DR for almost three years (from Spain 2016 through Hungary 2019):

Points:
Verstappen: 204 - 13 = 191 + 168 + 105 = 464
DR: 256 - 36 = 220 + 200 + 118 = 538

Highest Finish
Verstappen: 1st + 1st (x2) + 1st = 1st (x4)
DR: 1st + 1st + 1st (x2) = 1st (x4)

Qualifying Duel
Vestappen: 6 + 13 + 9 = 28
DR: 11 + 7 + 3 = 21

Highest Grid
Verstappen: 2nd + 2nd (x3) + 3rd = 2nd (x4)
DR: 1st + 3rd + 1st = 1st (x2)


So assuming that you consider Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel and Verstappen to be the top four drivers in F1 (which many do): then, who is the 5th best?

Just to develop a more complete comparison, let me look at Sainz compared to his highly rated teammates:

Points:
Verstappen 49 + 13 (4 races) = 62
Sainz 18 + 4 (4 races) = 22

Highest Finish
Verstappen 4th (x2) + 6th = 4th (x2)
Sainz 7th + 9th = 7th

Qualifying Duel
Verstappen 9 + 3 = 12
Sainz 10 + 1 = 11

Highest Grid
Verstappen 6th (x2) + 5th = 5th
Sainz 5th + 7th = 5th

Points:
Hulkenberg 9 (4 races) + 52 (12 races) = 61
Sainz 6 + 30 = 36

Highest Finish
Hulkenberg 6th + 5th = 5th
Sainz 7th + 5th = 5th

Qualifying Duel
Hulkenberg 3 + 7 = 10
Sainz 1 + 5 = 6

Highest Grid
Hulkenberg 7th + 7th (x4) = 7th (x5)
Sainz 8th + 5th = 5th

Points:
Sainz 0 (2 races)
Gasly 0

Highest Finish
Sainz Ret
Gasly 13th

Qualifying Duel
Sainz 2
Gasly 0

Highest Grid
Sainz 14th
Gasly 15th

It is quiet clear from these comparisons that Sainz is a weaker choice than either Verstappen, Ricciardo, Hulkenberg, Perez or Ocon. That sort does not leave him a lot options. Given that he is weaker than these five drivers (and we assume Hamilton, Vettel and Alonso), then this does not make a strong argument that he should be the #2 at Red Bull or even at McLaren.

 

[Il_leone]

Angellica I can see the conversation

Helmut/Horner " Max , guess what we aint going to promote Sainz "
Max " That's great ! Then who are you going to promote, Gasly?"

Helmut/Horner "No!"

Max " Then who then?"

Helmut/Horner " Max ,we don;t think you're quite ready to lead the team. So we are going to sign Alonso!"

Max"You're going to sign who? " " sake!"

 

[Il_leone]

Yes Christian Horner loves to kick people in the balls