Current McLaren

Arguably one of the big teams in Formula One but lately they don't seem to be able to get the basics right.
Some of their strategy and decisions in the last few years has left more than a few observers scratching their heads.

Just a few for starters:

• Leaving Kimi out on a badly flat-spotted tyre, resulting in it exploding on the last lap.
• Leaving Hamilton out on tyres so badly worn they were down to the canvas; Bridgestone themselves demanded that McLaren bring him in and McLaren refused, keeping him out for a few more laps. That decision arguably cost Hamilton the first rookie WDC and is one which will haunt him and McLaren for the rest of their days.
• Not sending Button and Hamilton out to get banker laps in during Q1.
• Sending Hamilton out on used tyres in Q3, with rain forecast, meaning it would be impossible to set a fast lap time on his second attempt on new tyres.

Their major updates seem to send them further down the grid, instead of challenging for pole positions and wins. As the season progresses they tend to get worse before getting better, by which time it is generally too late.

It's often said of them "write them off at your peril", but is this necessarily true?

The last time they won the WCC was in 1998 and their last WDC was 2008, before that 1999.
Their days of regularly winning championships seem to be well and truly behind them.

It's all well and good coming up with reasons why they haven't won championships.
The fact remains though, they have won just one WDC in the last 12 years.

So where to now for McLaren?

(I wrote this in rather a hurry so I will flesh it out when I have more time.)

 

[KekeTheKing]

If a majority of posters want Hamilton discussion out of the McLaren thread, then so be it. Although it'll be hard to keep his name out of here when the announcement comes down in the near future.

 

[EvilWhippet]

I'm not sure what I'm allowed to post in here, or if it's being discussed else where...so delete/move as you see fit.

Apparently Mclaren are offering Hamilton two thirds of what Button's currently getting, which they surely know he won't stand for. I don't believe Mclaren have purposefully hindered Hamilton at any point, sadly all their F ups have been down to incompetence, not malice. I do believe Button gels better with Whitmarsh at least. The most recent name I heard touted for Hamilton's seat was Heikki Kovalainen. If that's true, it seems obvious Mclaren do not want two top level drivers.

Maybe what Mclaren want is a team focussed on one top level driver, without having to actively favour anybody, so they're elbowing one out to bring in a less talented, more submissive points scorer. The bit I don't understand is that it's Hamilton they're elbowing out. Maybe I'm bias because I'm a fan, but unless Button's 2012 ends the same way his 2011 did Hamilton would appear to be the one they'd want to keep if it's winning and scoring points that's important to them. For all the misfortune he's faced this year it's Hamilton that's been doing the points scoring and winning the most.

 

[Brogan]

Perhaps the lack of parity with regards to salary is Whitmarsh's way of forcing Hamilton out?
He must know that Hamilton would at least want to be on the same remuneration as Button and wouldn't settle for less.

 

[teabagyokel]

If what EvilWhippet says is true, maybe they've made a decision about what kind of driver, nay even person, they want to have in their first car. It always strikes me McLaren are a corporation that doesn't want to leave anything to chance. And that means they don't want to allow a mid-2011 slump to appear because Nicole Scherzinger got out of bed on the wrong side that morning.

With Button, they know if they get the perfect car, he'll win them the Championship - and McLaren are almost certainly confident they can build a perfect car. It might just be one more variable out of the equation where the team is concerned. The flip side is of course, if they don't build a perfect car, the basket containing all their eggs will be dropped...

 

[MCLS]

And the eggs would only be good for another 2/3 years. I'm a self admitted Hamilton fan but in the long run McLaren would be foolish to let Hamilton go given he's still got at least 10 years in F1. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that they should get rid of Button or anything like that, but forcing out Hamilton because they want Button to be the number one driver would be a big own goal by McLaren, and I don't think it would go well for Hamilton either as he won't get in a car as competitive, Mercedes certainly would provide as good a chance at the Championship as McLaren

 

[Brogan]

Slight change of subject....McLaren have admitted they still don't know what the cause of the failure was on Button's car at Monza.
That has to be slightly worrying as not even knowing the cause means they can't investigate it to try and resolve it.

 

[Mephistopheles]

That is very strange Brogan lets hope it is just a one off...

 

[Jos the Boss]

With Button, they know if they get the perfect car, he'll win them the Championship ...

And they have nobody challenging them, JB wasn't on top in the latter part of 2009 when everyone caught up in the development race, even Rubens won more than him in the second half

 

[Mephistopheles]

What do you mean by "Even Rubens?" is that the same Rubens that on several occasions had the better of Michael Schumacher? I would say that beating Rubens over a complete season is nothing to be sniffed at and defending a points lead is harder than chasing one....

Rubens was and still is a great driver....

 

[The Pits]

The Brawn car was not a serious challenger towards the end of 2009, as Brawn was focusing on 2010, and all the budget was focussed there to keep the team alive.

Besides, despite anyones assertions, Button closed out the season with a race to spare, I think some people tend to forget that. his team mate was in third, and though he won 2 races, Button was second in one of those, and I think a review of the season would indicate that Button finished ahead of Barrichello as many times as Lewis finished in front of Heikki (although if checks prove this incorrect I reserve the right to edit my post!!)

So, I believe that yes, given the car, and a team focussed on development, he could win a wdc with McLaren.

 

[Jos the Boss]

Mephistopheles By even Rubens I mean the man who he had consistently out-performed all season, he's no slouch, but that season Button well and truly had the betterof him

 

[Mephistopheles]

Yes maybe but you have to remember that even Lewis had problems maintaining a healthy points lead during a championship and on one occasion failed to do so because of the pressure, so it is unfair to criticise Jenson's results in the second half of the 2009 season, don't you think?

Lewis himself is not immune to pressure just take a look at last year and you will see the truth in what I say and I am in no way putting him down by pointing this fact out....

Nobodies perfect, not even me......

 

[EvilWhippet]

I should clarify, my post is purely speculating on the 2 thirds possibility which is quote of conjecture as far as I know...

 

[Incubus]

I think that sentence is in need of clarification?...

 

[EvilWhippet]

I read that he was being offered two thirds of Button's salary, however it was proceeded by "apparently". Thus it's not exactly backed up, and the stuff about them maybe wanting to elbow Hamilton out is just my speculation.

 

[Incubus]

Ah awright.

 

[teabagyokel]

With Button, they know if they get the perfect car, he'll win them the Championship

Jos the Boss - That Brawn was the best car up to Monaco, thereafter the Red Bull comprehensively out developed it.

 

[Quintessentially]

McLaren must have obviously done the sums and realised that commercially they need Hamilton just as much as he needs them machinery wise. I am not convinced by the reports that they’ve offered Lewis less money than Jenson. Jenson gives them stability, probably more than Lewis, but they will need a significantly faster car for Jenson to become a serious championship challenger let alone win the championship (especially if Pirelli carries on with this tyre strategy). Also when you consider the fact that for the past 3years Hamilton has single handedly won all their pole positions bar the anomaly at Spa a few weeks ago, they could easily disappear into a oblivion if Lewis were to leave, which I believe is now inevitable. Hamilton has had some well publicised issues but he never lost his competitiveness or raw speed. Take him out of the equation and could McLaren have absorbed the sort of slump Jenson had up until Silverstone? No airplay for sponsors = no ££

 

[The Pits]

They managed before Lewis, and I am sure they will manage after him, if he is indeed leaving. Also, despite the poles (anomaly in Spa?!?!?!?) both drivers have had wins, and the points tally is not massively different (24 points? yes I know, operational, pit stops etc, but the points is the points) so I am sure there would be some life after Lewis.

 

[Olivier]

I'm not sure if this belongs in here (as there's the Hamilton, Button, Mclaren and the seat at Mclaren threads). Please feel free to move it if required.

Jo Ramirez talks about Hamilton, Button, Prost and Senna

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/...l-has-to-learn-and-life-with-prost-and-senna/