Current McLaren

Arguably one of the big teams in Formula One but lately they don't seem to be able to get the basics right.
Some of their strategy and decisions in the last few years has left more than a few observers scratching their heads.

Just a few for starters:

• Leaving Kimi out on a badly flat-spotted tyre, resulting in it exploding on the last lap.
• Leaving Hamilton out on tyres so badly worn they were down to the canvas; Bridgestone themselves demanded that McLaren bring him in and McLaren refused, keeping him out for a few more laps. That decision arguably cost Hamilton the first rookie WDC and is one which will haunt him and McLaren for the rest of their days.
• Not sending Button and Hamilton out to get banker laps in during Q1.
• Sending Hamilton out on used tyres in Q3, with rain forecast, meaning it would be impossible to set a fast lap time on his second attempt on new tyres.

Their major updates seem to send them further down the grid, instead of challenging for pole positions and wins. As the season progresses they tend to get worse before getting better, by which time it is generally too late.

It's often said of them "write them off at your peril", but is this necessarily true?

The last time they won the WCC was in 1998 and their last WDC was 2008, before that 1999.
Their days of regularly winning championships seem to be well and truly behind them.

It's all well and good coming up with reasons why they haven't won championships.
The fact remains though, they have won just one WDC in the last 12 years.

So where to now for McLaren?

(I wrote this in rather a hurry so I will flesh it out when I have more time.)

 

[KekeTheKing]

My view: Get rid of Button or Hamilton if they want to beat Alonso and Vettel to World Drivers Championships and concentrate on optimizing everything for only one Number 1.

Therein lies the problem. They're not going to drop either one, and Lewis would be crazy to jump ship to anywhere other than Red Bull, which is clearly not an option.

They're all stuck with each other, and they had better get the job done with this car.

 

[kristi]

They're not going to drop either one, and Lewis would be crazy to jump ship to anywhere other than Red Bull, which is clearly not an option.

They're all stuck with each other, and they had better get the job done with this car.

There is a body of thought which would suggest that Whitmarsh and McLarens are trying to cheapen up Hamilton.

Lewis' contract is up for renewal, isn't it? He was given a fat contract pre-recession when BMW, Toyota, Honda and Renault were all on the grid.

Now there are less 'Works' seats available but the grid is loaded with talent, arguably the greatest grid since Rio in 1982. Even "pay" drivers are impressing (Checo Perez, for instance.)
Raikkonen is back and isn't as expensive as he was in 2010. A fully motivated Raikkonen is formidable and McLaren know this.

And, sad to say, Hamilton pure driving talent isn't worth as much as it used to be pre-Pirelli, pre-DRS, pre-re-fulling when it was mainly about raw blinding pace instead of a mix of that AND looking after tyres consistently, etc.

Look at Button. A guy who hasn't had Pole since, what, Monaco 2009? And yet his over-all race pace isn't that much different to Hamilton's if one is to be truthful. Same with the points haul since they became "teammates".

I'm sure i'm not out to lunch on this theory. I bet you Hamilton's contract will be talked down and guys like Raikkoenen will be used as bargaining chips to cheapen up Hamilton's demands.

The driver market is saturated in relation to 2008 and there aren't as many works seats that make sense. So, Keke The King, you're right. They're all going to 'stick it out together' but McLaren will get Hamilton at closer to their price then what Hamilton's management would be wanting.

 

[Cookinflatsix]

The driver market is saturated in relation to 2008 and there aren't as many works seats that make sense. So, Keke The King, you're right. They're all going to 'stick it out together' but McLaren will get Hamilton at closer to their price then what Hamilton's management would be wanting.

Simon Fuller might have a joker card, like the merchandising side might have a bearing as well

He might appear like a ray in the sky for LHs contract negotiations

 

[ExtremeNinja]

kristi

It's hard to disagree with your well thought out and articulated post. It's one of those fleeting thoughts I've had from time to time but it just flashes by and has been obscured by all the other noise around the point of discussion. I haven't actually latched on to it and put it to good thought. I think there is much truth in your statement.

 

[racecub]

I dont think he inspires confidence. He's weak on decisions and too easliy taken in by disturbingly attractive young men with glib tongues and false smiles, as a consequence of which he squanders one of McLarens biggest assets. There were rumours of replacing him if things didnt improve around Siverstone time last yea,r and at the end of the year there was a bleading of top personel from McLaren to other teams...particularly Ferrari.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

People will always try to be cynical in this sport. But when Jenson won the last race Lewis went up to him spontaneously and hugged him. No amount of spin or PR from us is going to create that. We are in the unusual position of having two of the best drivers in the world, who are both young, disturbingly good-looking chaps with star quality.

 

[racecub]

I know. But it has to be accompanied with the false smile and glib tongue to have the desired affect

 

[F1ang-o]

Re Martin Whitmarsh quote
... that was two years ago...
A lot has happened since then.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

 

[riskitall]

There is a body of thought which would suggest that Whitmarsh and McLarens are trying to cheapen up Hamilton.

Lewis' contract is up for renewal, isn't it? He was given a fat contract pre-recession when BMW, Toyota, Honda and Renault were all on the grid.

Now there are less 'Works' seats available but the grid is loaded with talent, arguably the greatest grid since Rio in 1982. Even "pay" drivers are impressing (Checo Perez, for instance.)
Raikkonen is back and isn't as expensive as he was in 2010. A fully motivated Raikkonen is formidable and McLaren know this.

And, sad to say, Hamilton pure driving talent isn't worth as much as it used to be pre-Pirelli, pre-DRS, pre-re-fulling when it was mainly about raw blinding pace instead of a mix of that AND looking after tyres consistently, etc.

Look at Button. A guy who hasn't had Pole since, what, Monaco 2009? And yet his over-all race pace isn't that much different to Hamilton's if one is to be truthful. Same with the points haul since they became "teammates".

I'm sure i'm not out to lunch on this theory. I bet you Hamilton's contract will be talked down and guys like Raikkoenen will be used as bargaining chips to cheapen up Hamilton's demands.

The driver market is saturated in relation to 2008 and there aren't as many works seats that make sense. So, Keke The King, you're right. They're all going to 'stick it out together' but McLaren will get Hamilton at closer to their price then what Hamilton's management would be wanting.

well i dont think we saw the best of lewis last season.
if we do this season,he'll do a better job than button.

 

[Slyboogy]

Well judging by the results, he's doing a better job than Domenicalli.

Plus there's 2009 when they got out of a hole, and won grand prixs, you need a good leader for that.

He might get criticised for having two good drivers in the team rather than one, but his goal is the constructors more so than the drivers, and this year it looks as if he will achieve that title that McLaren have been chasing since 1998.

 

[kristi]

What's concerning (and borderline foolish even) is Martin Whitmarsh's comment in Jonathan Noble's Autosport.Com article the other day (26 March 2012) where he said "The real (title) contenders did not score too many points either...".

That a problem, in my opinion.

The problem is that McLaren/Whitmarsh don't think Alonso/Ferrari are a threat. Well, Alonso's leading the championship and he'll have 100 percent backing from Ferrari.

What will Whitmarsh think if Alonso is still within shouting distance after the Spanish Grand Prix (the meeting at which Ferrari will be bringing a heavy upgrade package)?

If Alonso is, indeed, within shouting distance, then Whitmarsh will HAVE to choose which driver to back 100 percent. Not doing so could prove costly. It may not, but it could. And then which one would he choose/which would he want to optimize/which one would he want to least compromise in Q3, pitstops, etc?

What's really interesting and bemusing is that Whitmarsh is totally discounting the guy who's leading the WDC. The only reason I think he's doing this is because he may (rightly) feel that McLaren will continue to out-develop Ferrari to the end of October and into November. Any other reason would be fool-hardy, im my view.

 

[Bill Boddy]

Alonso will not win the WCC, I guarantee it. It is the WCC that all the teams want, apart from anything else it is what brings in the money from FOTA.

If a team can win the WDC as well that is a bonus.

 

[kristi]

Alonso will not win the WCC, I guarantee it. It is the WCC that all the teams want, apart from anything else it is what brings in the money from FOTA.

If a team can win the WDC as well that is a bonus.

I will also guarantee that Alonso won't win the WCC. Alonso's one and only objective is the WDC. Always has been and always will be. If Ferrari end up with a WCC after Alonso's won his title, then he'll see it as a bonus for them.

Sure, Ferrari may want the WCC in any given year but we all know that only one week ago everyone was writing-off their 2012 season. A week ago Ferrari would have done anything to eek out a Grand Prix win here and a Grand Prix win there. Well, Alonso represents their only proper chance of eeking out those wins and they'll throw everything into maximizing Alonso's chances of taking those wins. And, if by any chance, they end up with a Drivers Championship for Alonso, then they will have breathed a sigh of relief given where they were just four or five days ago.

In addition, Ferrari have so much money that the difference between 1st place WCC prize money and 3rd place WCC prize money isn't as significant or as material as it would be for, say, Lotus or even Mercedes. So, I suspect, Ferrari's eye is now on eeking out at least one of the two championships and given Massa's form, they will put their eggs in Alonso's WDC basket than a WCC basket.

Lastly, FOTA doesn't give out the prize money for the WCC. It's FOM that gives out the money.

 

[teabagyokel]

Do you consider yourself a McLaren supporter though?

Broadly, yes.

You have to remember where McLaren were in 2009 when Ron was forced out. They'd just recovered from Spygate and Liegate, they'd won one WDC in 2008 where they should have taken the double in 2007, and it is sad to say that bad management contributed to those woes.

McLaren have been managed much better since 2009 than they were in 2007, for example, where the excellent car was let down by infighting.

 

[KekeTheKing]

2007 was an abject disaster, obviously spearheaded by the incredible petulance displayed by the twice-reigning WDC. Whether any Team Principal could have kept that situation in check is debatable.

Sure, there's been harmony since Ron left, but 2012 will be the real litmus test for Whitmarsh. I was just wondering whether McLaren fans had a good feeling about his ability to lead this team with two No. 1 drivers battling each other every round.

The replies have been more or less what I expected.

 

[teabagyokel]

Sure, there's been harmony since Ron left, but 2012 will be the real litmus test for Whitmarsh. I was just wondering whether McLaren fans had a good feeling about his ability to lead this team with two No. 1 drivers battling each other every round.

I think he's handled it exceptionally well so far anyway; even if it is a façade it has lasted longer than the average 2 World Champions team harmony.

 

[KekeTheKing]

I think he's handled it exceptionally well so far anyway

I guess we'll have to disagree on our definitions of "exceptionally"

Whether or not Marty played a large part, I've never heard/seen a driver take more abuse in a 3 win season than Hamilton last year. Button's 3 win season was hailed as his finest, often by Whitmarsh.

 

[teabagyokel]

Whether or not Marty played a large part, I've never heard/seen a driver take more abuse in a 3 win season than Hamilton last year. Button's 3 win season was hailed as his finest, often by Whitmarsh.

It appears Whitmarsh holds Button's finest season to be less impressive than Hamilton's finest.

 

[KekeTheKing]

Yeah, I suppose that's one way to look at it.