How Good is Sebastian Vettel?

[Il_leone]

Bushi
It was the manner of the way Red Bull or should I say the muppet Horner handled it. If your teammate damages a piece of their car then its their bad luck when you're trying to beat him

What you don't need is your team undermining you and make the decision before consulting you about it and the fact they said it was "a Championship decision"

2010 Vettel actually made a lot of amateurish errors in between some fantastic wins when leading into the first corner


2011 - Webber on Vettel's tail and Horner says back off when Webber was ready to overtake him and it seemed to be the whole season if there was a kers failure it was always Webber's car

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2010 and 2012 Vettel won both championships at the last race but along the way he made so many amateurish errors so therefore he should have won the title long before

 

[Slyboogy]

2011 - Webber on Vettel's tail and Horner says back off when Webber was ready to overtake him and it seemed to be the whole season if there was a kers failure it was always Webber's car

Not quite true, Vettel had his fair share, but when it happened to him, he was leading as he had already done a good enough job it didn't effect him.

The one time it might have done, was in Spain that year when Hamilton was constantly on his tail.

 

[Il_leone]

Slyboogy

Not sure what happened to my quote facility...

For Webber the kers failure seems to be always during quali when he needed it most to work effectively with the DRS the Red Bull has

 

[Foaad]

@ ll_leone

I think some of your facts need correction. Contrary to your statement, Vettel did not damage the front wing, it unhinged at the end of P3, during which if I recall correctly he was fastest. Newey was adamant that he wanted to run the front wing and so they decided that based on drivers' championship standings and personal driver preference it should go to Vettel. And to add to that, Webber did not like the front wing anyway as mentioned by an insider.

http://en.espnf1.com/redbull/motorsport/story/23634.html

Regarding the incident in 2011, Red Bull had already given Mark the preferred strategy to pit earlier to help his cause and the only reason he was able to catch upto Vettel later in the race was due to a botched pitstop that lost Vettel the lead and he came behind Hamilton. Even then Webber, true to his charachter, ignored team instructions and did all he could to overtake but Vettel was able to stay ahead on merit. And regarding Mark's poor reliability, he recently had the record of the most races without mechanical failure, while Vettel in 2010 has lost atleast 4 victories to mechanical failures since 2010, while when he has an ailing car, he still manages to nurse it home like Spain 2011.

 

[Bill Boddy]

There were several occasions during the 2012 season when Webber reported that his KERS was not working, either during qualifying or in the race. Have you taken these into consideration?

 

[mnmracer]

Have you taken into consideration the times it's happened to Vettel, or were you not aware he too had KERS problems?

 

[teabagyokel]

There are people getting rather passive-aggressive in this thread, so can we please stop?

 

[mnmracer]

Not intended, just asking. Sorry.

 

[Il_leone]

Foaad It was more the manner the way Red Bull or I should say the stupid muppet Horner handled the whole matter. I've already said that is just bad luck if it unhinged on Vettel's car...and assumed Webber was No 2 in the middle of the weekend.

It is hard enough to beat an equally fast teammate but to have the management team help him in moments of misfortune is ridiculous

All they did was make Webber angry ...I am surprised Webber did not tell Horner to stand with him on the podium afterwards

 

[RasputinLives]

Raikkonen&Redbull=PartyTime welcome to CTA. Couldn't agree more with your view on Sebastian. Its always going to be debated though as every succesful driver in history has had the same thing levelled at him.

As a none staff member can I just say not to be put off by sportsman. I'm not really sure why he feels the need to come on the forum and rubbish it but I would suggest if he sent you a link to his paradise wonderland of a forum its to poach new members. Speaking as someone who has been around the forums I come here because whilst sometimes the debate can get heated everyone on here is shown respect as long as they show it to others, the banter is good and everyone is welcome whatever their knowledge level or wherever they've come from. Someone promoting 'No ex 606 members' as a plus point to their forum puts me off straight away. Yes 606 had a lot of idiots on it but to dismiss every single person who was ever a part of it is a little biggotted isn't it. Whilst your at why not label all Germans facists, all Russians commies and all Anericans fat. I'm not sure why I expect anything different from someone who kids themselves they are an unbiased observer.

Anyways stick around and enjoy the chat. You'll find the staff massively hard working, the stats unbelievable, Galahad 's fantasy game frustrating, teabagyokel 's team mate prediction game equally so. You'll find Brogan a fair ringmaster, FB a sarcasm master, Josh a bit freaky deaky dutch, gethinceri very Welsh, Fenderman king of the likes, @sly moose obsessed and Jos the Boss always wrong abiyt the weather.

errrm also they like you to stay on topic so ermmmm.... yay Vettel!

 

[Josh]

"a bit freaky deaky dutch"

 

[mnmracer]

if not for us Dutchies, the world would not know (a word for) cookies!
(relevant to this thread because Vettel likes cookies, cookies makes you (and Vettel) happy, and happy people drive faster)

 

[Slyboogy]

Nothing wrong with being Moose obsessed.

 

[Jos the Boss]

and Jos the Boss always wrong abiyt the weather.

errrm also they like you to stay on topic so ermmmm.... yay Vettel!

Only abiyt!

 

[Mephistopheles]

Shit hot...

 

[Bushi]

Foaad It was more the manner the way Red Bull or I should say the stupid muppet Horner handled the whole matter. I've already said that is just bad luck if it unhinged on Vettel's car...and assumed Webber was No 2 in the middle of the weekend.

It is hard enough to beat an equally fast teammate but to have the management team help him in moments of misfortune is ridiculous

All they did was make Webber angry ...I am surprised Webber did not tell Horner to stand with him on the podium afterwards

Hockenheim 2010 anybody?

 

[The Artist.....]

Bushi

I suppose the difference is that Ferrari never pretend that they have equal status, but Red Bull always work on the external appearance of equality...

 

[Mephistopheles]

Seb maybe brilliant or he maybe just brilliant in a brilliant car..

Who knows, but I did notice that he wasn't that brilliant at the beginning of the season when the red bull was off the pace and Mark was outscoring him, so maybe he isn't as brilliant as some people think he is....

 

[teabagyokel]

That's a comment I scarcely see applied to the reigning double world champion who could suddenly only beat Berger by one point in a worse car...

 

[mnmracer]

He must also think Hamilton isn't as brilliant as some people think he is because he only outscored Button over 3 years by 1 point. Context is over-rated.