A Lack Of Respect
- Thread starter teabagyokel
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DOF_power said:
I don't you get the meaning.
Outside a small group of McLaren enthusiasts (mostly english or kiwis or can-am american fans) there was no McLaren, it was just the Marlboro cars and their drivers.[/quote:2dbpu43c]
I don't think you get the meaning. The team was McLaren. I am not interested in what the entire world's perception of the team was, it was McLaren. I'm not interested in who anyone thinks was the team, they're down in the historical records as McLaren. I bet you wouldn't claim Alfa Romeo were 'Team Marlboro' in the early 80s!
And that opinion will carry over to Lotus, Brabham, Williams, Ferrari and anyone else you intend to apply it to.
A quirk of mistaken perception will not deprive "British garagistes" of the credit they deserve in my eyes.
Brogan said:
Exactly, the british garagiste team were never a point of interest for that larger masses like the nation champion/ constructor team.
teabagyokel said:
Again I repeat myself, Alfa was never team Marlboro. And don't tell about that sponsorship because I know about it.
Alfa was always Alfa Romeo, with some Marlboro stickers at a time.
DOF_power said:
If it is about repeating oneself, McLaren was never ever ever ever ever* Team Marlboro.
Ever.
I would just like to point out that you will only ever deprive independent English constructors of their credit. This deprives you of credibility, as your posts seem to have an axe to grind. Your consistent measuring of races with comparisons to Monza 67/69/71 make you seem like a dreamer and hence also cost you credibility. But what really loses your credibility most of all is the lack of any kind of consistency in an argument, often within the same post, and your tendency to stick your head in the sand when confronted with evidence.
Please note that this is not a personal attack, just a critique of your comments as I have seen them on this site.
*ever
I'm as confused as everyone else about this "Team Marlboro" thing?
Does this mean that before Mclaren were "Team Marlboro" then BRM were "Team Marlboro"? What were Mclaren in the 70's when, for races in North America they ran with different sponsorship (Labbats beer I think?)? Were they known as Team Labbats in the US and Team Marlboro in the rest of the world?
Does this mean that before Mclaren were "Team Marlboro" then BRM were "Team Marlboro"? What were Mclaren in the 70's when, for races in North America they ran with different sponsorship (Labbats beer I think?)? Were they known as Team Labbats in the US and Team Marlboro in the rest of the world?
cider_and_toast said:I'm as confused as everyone else about this "Team Marlboro" thing?
Does this mean that before Mclaren were "Team Marlboro" then BRM were "Team Marlboro"? What were Mclaren in the 70's when, for races in North America they ran with different sponsorship (Labbats beer I think?)? Were they known as Team Labbats in the US and Team Marlboro in the rest of the world?
Jackie Stewart was once talking about the Yardley car (Maca had both Marlboro sponsorship on 2 cars and Yardly on 1 car).
What ever the sponsor was, if it wasn't the James Hunt/ Senna/ Prost car.
DOF_power said:
I don't you get the meaning.
Outside a small group of McLaren enthusiasts (mostly english or kiwis or can-am american fans) there was no McLaren, it was just the Marlboro cars and their drivers.[/quote:1q38evza]
You talk very knowledeably about the wider world.Well I have travelled and worked in the wider world and watched F1 races in bars, hotels and other places frequently in parts of the Far East and both North and South Africa.These hotels and bars were the only places which had televisions so naturally F1 fans would gather there.
I have never heard any of the group of F1 fans who gathered there refer to Marlboro cars.It was always Mclaren, Ferrari, Hesketh, Williams or whichever team.The only car that I have ever heard of referred to by its sponsor was Graham Hills Embassy sponsored Lola.
sportsman said:
sportsman said:
Witch is were the small group of enthusiasts comes into picture.
The masses mean 8/10/12 million TV viewers per country in countries like China, Brazil, Germany, Italy, Spain and such.
A bunch of people (mostly british expats and/or commonwealthers I recon) gathering in bars and hotels comes into the small group of enthusiasts category a.k.a. minority.
British garagistes team that don't build cars and continental auto makers with a great history in motor-sport are not the same, they are different and appeal or don't appeal to different crowds, always were always will be.
Ferrari appeals to a huge audience (1/3 of the F1 fanbase) on account of being Ferrari.
All british owned teams combined that don't build cars do not equal this, hence Bernie's words.
Red Bull is just an energy drinks company, that one day will pull out of F1/GP racing (or whatever the series will be known).
Ferrari appeals to a huge audience (1/3 of the F1 fanbase) on account of being Ferrari.
All british owned teams combined that don't build cars do not equal this, hence Bernie's words.
Red Bull is just an energy drinks company, that one day will pull out of F1/GP racing (or whatever the series will be known).
fat jez said:
What generalization ?!
In a documentary from 1968, during at the Mexican GP, one of the presenter asked the question as to why people watch GP racing.
There were 3 categories (excluding the Ferrari brigade) namely:
1. a english/ british young woman said because of the cars and the sport
2. a man (british) said for the crashes and driver(s) (he was G. Hill "supporter")
3. a mexican young woman said for the event/ emotion
These 4 types, the cars/ motorsport fan, driver/personality and crashes "supporter", event and emotion "fan" and the manufacturer-team tifoso are the people that watch GP racing.
Whether some here feel insulted by this, I then I apologize, but this simply and objectively speaking what the fanbase is made of.
fat jez said:
If it's generalization, then riddle me this Batman ?!
Why was there no big audience (a.k.a >= 5 mil) and constant audience decline in Britain when brits were not winning despite most teams being british (a.k.a in the 97 - 2006 time-frame).
Why were there little to no fans in Spain (or live coverage) before Alonso ?!
The honest politically incorrect truth, people (the millions/ the masses) care (biasly) for their national drivers and/or Ferrari/ Ferrari-McLaren (witch combined have over 50% of team support according to all polls, and that becomes over 60% if you add Mercedes).
Why all this constant political correct B* ?!
When the truth is most GP "fans" are short term with a short attention span.
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