Grand Prix 2017 Azerbaijan Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Baku.

No, fear not fellow clippers, it's not my hayfever getting the better of me but it's the next F1 venue in the 2017 F1 season. Designed to be the worlds fastest street circuit, this year the grand prix carries the name of the host country unlike last year when, for reasons never fully explained it carried the European GP title.

Last years race was effected by kerb bolts not being fully tightened down, causing a number of tyres to be shredded and a flying drain cover that re-arranged the underside of one of the cars. These little issues to one side, on the whole, the circuit did set out to achieve its aim of speed with some of the highest straight line speeds ever recorded in F1, along the long back straight.

The race itself saw the top 6 spread out by over a minute showing that the key to success was a powerful engine and a high top speed. Hamilton suffered badly due to starting in the wrong mode. This highlighted the 'radio driver instructions' issue once again and was the catalyst for this rule being quietly slide into oblivion not long after. The track itself drew praise from several drivers.

So, to this seasons GP. Given the criteria for success at this track, Mercedes and Mercedes powered cars must start as favourites to do well. With Perez rounding out the podium spots in 2016 and with Force India's strong performane in Canada, they will surely be in the mix as the next best Merc runners.

Ferrari will be looking to bounce back after a difficult GP in Canada where Vettel did brilliantly to recover to 4th however, his pace over the weekend could have delivered more, and Kimi suffered from failing brakes which meant his race disolved into nursing the wounded car home over the last few laps.

Red Bull's season continues to underwhelm with pre-season predictions of title challenges now very much a distant memory. With Ferrari and Mercedes clearly a measure better than RBR and with this track requiring power, Force India should be right on Red Bull's tail. Max will be looking to bounce back after his DNF, and hopefully not over Seb's front wing this time while Danny will want another good finish.

Williams should do well here. They have the Merc engine and Stroll will have a certain spring in his step after a strong enough performance in Canada to show why he's in the car. Massa is also confounding some critics this season by driving pretty well. It's clear that neither driver have a great car underneath them but they should be able to do something here.

Torro Rosso, Haas and Renault will be pounding around looking for a sniff of some points. Of these three teams, none of them seem to be setting the world of F1 on fire and mediocrity is the best they can expect. Of the 6 drivers, Jolyon Palmer has the most to loose. He MUST start out performing his team mate or come the next set of European races he'll be watching from the sidelines. The Hulk looked pretty on it in Canada so Palmer has no easy task.

Last up comes Sauber who, running last years Ferrari engine, will stand little hope of doing anything here and will be praying for a race of high attrition. Much to everyone's suprise, last year there wasn't a single safety car period and only 4 cars DNF'd so it's not looking good for the team.

So I can't see much further than a Hamilton win and should anything go wrong, Bottas will more than likely pick up the pieces.

Oh..... hang on.... I missed one team out.

McLaren.

Hmmmm, it's a high powered circuit that requires a lot of grunt from the engine. It's a street circuit so the car needs to be able to handle bumps well, be well balanced but at the same time have a high straight line speed.

I'll give both cars about 10 laps before they are smoking and stationary track side.
 
i remember watching that live RasputinLives it was ridiculous because he accelerated & braked on the main straight, but the reason for ban he got which was completely right decision. was because the stewards had no choice when he got taken out himself a few laps later the 6/8 drivers caught up in it. were cheering in the pitlane. so when you have 8 drivers saying you need to take action. your going to ban 1 guy than upset 1/3 of the grid

& your probally right about mental side cider_and_toast because he really only been under the cosh for title battle in 2012 even then it was still by far the better car, as 2010 fell into his lap as huge underdog, 2011 & 2013 won it by miles often it was just 2nd place after 2nd lap
 
The safety car has the disadvantage to the leader of closing the field up; what is needed is a system recognises this by giving a smooth transition to racing again. An absolute minimum is that the lead driver is not allowed to reduce his speed or reduce his rate of acceleration inordinately once he is in charge.
 
The safety car has the disadvantage to the leader of closing the field up; what is needed is a system recognises this by giving a smooth transition to racing again. An absolute minimum is that the lead driver is not allowed to reduce his speed or reduce his rate of acceleration inordinately once he is in charge.

Doesn't it already say that in the rules? Lead driver musnt make exaggerated increases or decreases of speed? Seen it somewhere but can't remember the exact wording.
 
Doesn't it already say that in the rules? Lead driver musnt make exaggerated increases or decreases of speed? Seen it somewhere but can't remember the exact wording.
You mean Article 39.5:
No car may be driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers or any other person at any time whilst the safety car is deployed. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane.
 
You mean Article 39.5:

2017 FORMULA ONE SPORTING REGULATIONS
39.13
When the clerk of the course decides it is safe to call in the safety car the message "SAFETY
CAR IN THIS LAP" will be sent to all teams via the official messaging system and the car's
orange lights will be extinguished. This will be the signal to the teams and drivers that it will be
entering the pit lane at the end of that lap.

At this point the first car in line behind the safety car may dictate the pace and, if necessary,
fall more than ten car lengths behind it.
 
"If he had accelerated then braked, accelerated then braked, then yes it would be erratic. However he didn’t, his deceleration was smooth and consistent. He is allowed to brake. He just is not allowed to do so erratically.
The braking in the corner was perfectly acceptable and not particularly abnormal (he slowed by just 9 mph through the apex which is not erratic or excessive) plus it may well have been kers generation that applied the brake. Remember vettel was not at a constant speed. He accelerated which is why he hit hamilton.
The speed was pretty normal for a street circuit and even other tracks. Just go and watch footage from Bahrain this year where vettel was controlling the pack at the safety car restart. He backed them up and was going much the same speed.
Vettel was just frightened that he was going to be overtaken by Perez (which almost happened at the previous restart) so he was probably thinking more about that than watching hamilton. It was vettels responsibility to drive safely behind hamilton."

Another reasonable explanation from Lee1 on the f1fanatic's article
 
olegg
Art. 39.13 by my interpreation of the rules does not suspend Art. 39.5, because the safety car is still considered to be deployed until the drivers cross the first satey car line which means that a driver must abide Art. 39.5.
Furthermore Art. 39.13 states:
In order to avoid the likelihood of accidents before the safety car returns to the pits, from the point at which the lights on the car are turned out drivers must proceed at a pace which involves no erratic acceleration or braking nor any other manoeuvre which is likely to endanger other drivers or impede the restart.
 
Ok. Im struggling to find anything meaningful regarding the telemetry from Lewis.

I appreciate that he did the same thing both restarts. However, that may or may not be meaningful as it will depend on circumstances. Braking hard and accelerating is fine when you are sevetal car lengths clear, but Vettel was much closer the second time.
 
"at a pace which involves no erratic acceleration or braking nor any other manoeuvre which is likely to endanger other drivers or impede the restart."

It is not very clear wording.
But in my opinion and in the opinion of the stewards, Hamilton was not violated.
But the funny thing is the claims Vettel and his supporters
that Vettel in a similar situation would be acting similarly
 
Ok. Im struggling to find anything meaningful regarding the telemetry from Lewis.

I appreciate that he did the same thing both restarts. However, that may or may not be meaningful as it will depend on circumstances. Braking hard and accelerating is fine when you are sevetal car lengths clear, but Vettel was much closer the second time.
Maybe this helps?
Sebastian Vettel

The same discussion seems to be taking place in multiple threads.
 
No, those are news reports based on a statement which whilst true does not show the detail.

There are no official docs on the fia website, although that could be due to the findings resulting in no penalty.

My point is simply that the statements i have seen would suggest that doing the same thing on both restarts is sufficient for several assumptions to be made.

If these ate not assumptions, then there must be more actual official info available which i have not been able to find.
 
IMG_3733.JPG
Yes, 39.13 is I believe the rule I was thinking of. And the stewards after looking at telemetry thought Lewis was 100% in the clear.
These couple of pictures show he didn't do any sharp increases or decreases of speed, but it shows Vettel was somewhat erratic.
 
I unashamedly copied it from someone who posted it on another forum. :embarrassed:
But there is this on YouTube, confusingly, for some reason Hamilton is red and Vettel is Tourquoise :dunno:

 
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