Grand Prix 2011 German Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

It's turning out to be a strange old season

Mixed conditions and poor pit stops paved the way to an enthralling race, while it had one of the lowest overtaking figures of the year, it certainly showed that overtaking isn't the be all and end all of grand prix racing, however the two Mclaren drivers showed that overtaking can be exciting.

Of the runners and riders, Ferrari have made the biggest gain and maybe, just maybe, Red Bull have lost their monopoly over the top step of the podium and we might finally have a championship, however I'm sure I have said this after China and Canada.......

The curious case of Mclaren continued apace this weekend as they had no pace, found pace and then lost it again. In the changeable conditions at the start of the race, Hamilton and Button charged through the field until the dry conditions when the natural order reasertied themselves, however, it is hard to see how they really showed in fully dry conditions as Button lost a wheel nut early on and Hamilton had to fuel save for the latter part of the race.

Going into the German Grand Prix, Red Bull will understandably be favourites as Sebastian Vettel looks to extend his lead at the top of the championship as he continues in his quest for back to back champions (and the youngest to do so before I'm mistaken) but he'll have to fight off a resurgant Mark Webber who is finally challenging his team mate again after a slow start to the season after he struggled to acclimatise to the Pirelli tyres, he was also stung by the team orders at the end of the last Grand Prix, so you can't bet against him for at least a podium position next weekend.

Renault seem to have disappeared after a strong start to the season, Vitaly Petrov seems to have fallen back into 2010 mode after a strong start to the season. Nick Heidfeld has fared better recently and still features in the lower ends of the points, however a podium seems a long way away, a theory solidified as their side exhausts have had to be abandonded due to the propsed rules, however with the debate going on at the moment, this may not be the case after all.

Mercedes seem to have found pace recently, Rosberg is constintely in the midle of the points while Schumacher seems more like himself again, in more ways than one.......... But at his home grand prix, he will be keen to show that he still has it, along with a large number of German drivers, the most represented country on the grid, so many people will be keen to show that they are the best German on the grid.

Team lotus made it into Q2 again which is a major achievment for them and shows that they are getting closer to the midfield and their major goal of getting points before the end of the year so they can beat Virgin and Hispania.

This year we return to the Nurburgring as part of the deal is that the circuit alternates with Hockenheim, last time we were there was in 2009 where Mark Webber won his first grand prix in the Red Bull. In recent memory Nurburgring will be best remembered for the crazy race in 2007 where a heavy rain shower caused havoc at the start of the race and famously allowed Markus Winkelhock to lead the race in his Spyker, joining the elite of people who led a race in their first (and only race)

For Galahad's excellent circuit write up, see here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/nurburgring/
 
Its a bit harsh to say that Vettel is a bit wet behind the ears on one result....mind you a fourth as well despite the mistakes......RBR did not look on, Mark Webber will be spitting blood right now to know or realise that 3rd is really underachieving from the circumstances.

Who said he was wet behind the ears? Who is judging him on one result? Why did Webber under achieve?
 
One thing I noticed is...

The driver who was leading was always the fastest, we saw this with Hamilton, then Webber.

When both of them weren't leading their pace wasn't as good as the leaders, yet they weren't in the "dirty air" as the gap was above 1s, so they wouldn't lose time due to that.
 
Who said he was wet behind the ears? Who is judging him on one result? Why did Webber under achieve?

Webber's result seen as underachievement:

1] Yet another Pole not converted despite blinding weekend pace.

2] He got the undercut to work and still somehow found himself getting easily beaten.

3] I think we can all assume that RBR are still the car to beat so sitting behind a rather tip toeing Ferrari out of gas and never really going fast the whole race is a very disappointing result..........at some point Webber cannot keep starting on 1 and ending up 3rd.....underachieving.
 
Absolutely fantastic race. I think the wacky racing has died down slightly as the season has gone on, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. We have got rid of the boring easy overtakes and kept the crazily good ones. This season has also thrown up some unique situations, such as drag races for the line and final lap pit stop races.

I think today Lewis proved his doubters wrong again. I think what his critics don't realise is that certain incidents should be analysed in themselves because 9/10 he is an overtaking genius.
 
Webber's result seen as underachievement:

1] Yet another Pole not converted despite blinding weekend pace.

2] He got the undercut to work and still somehow found himself getting easily beaten.

3] I think we can all assume that RBR are still the car to beat so sitting behind a rather tip toeing Ferrari out of gas and never really going fast the whole race is a very disappointing result..........at some point Webber cannot keep starting on 1 and ending up 3rd.....underachieving.

Coming third behind the two best drivers in Formula 1 in equal machinery is not underachieving. It is meeting expectation. What makes you think that Fernando was tip-toeing? Let him make his own excuses if he feels he needs to.
 
What yellow flags? The flags where when Webber overtook Hamilton, there were no yellow flags on the main straight.
I thought It at the time, as Heidfeld was beached, Hamilton ran deep, and Webber snuck past. Why is Hamilton under investigation though?
 
Yep. Just saw on the f1 forum that there was definitely a green flag where Webber overtook Hamilton. Should be no penalty.
 
Could be because he jumped into the mechanics possibly?

Don't know why they have such rules....no donuts, no proper celebrating, can't pick up another driver who's cars let him down.
 
As for Vettel, his racing craft is once again going to brought into question. The first time this season he has raced in the pack and he looked a little amateurish at times. You would never see Lewis or Fernando being that much slower than their teammates without a fundamental problem with their cars.

The rest of the season could be very interesting, regardless of whether the championship is over or not and that is because it is just so tight now. 3 driver from 3 teams spent most of the race within 2 seconds of each other.
 
One thing I noticed is...

The driver who was leading was always the fastest, we saw this with Hamilton, then Webber.

When both of them weren't leading their pace wasn't as good as the leaders, yet they weren't in the "dirty air" as the gap was above 1s, so they wouldn't lose time due to that.

Following that close lap after lap requires some patience and I would suggest it's rather difficult to lap consistently faster than the car in front without overtaking it :thinking:

Penalty for Lewis?

The beeb are looking into whether Lewis overtook Webber under yellow flags

Other way round. It was MW overtaking LH.

Edit: Whole load of peep's got in there before me! Sorry if this is just another repeat!
 
Just to make it clear, Alonso himself said the fuel issue had no bearing on his pace, even on the last lap.

I'm not sure why you think the Ferrari wasn't "really going fast the whole race"?

Clearly they were fast,...but nowhere near the McLaren and Red Bull overall pace. How well Ferrari faired was always going to be decided on qualification, and no surprises to see where they ended up. Yes the second was a fantastic result that I would have happily taken without a litre of petrol being burnt up.

The Pace refered to was close enough to stick, never quick enough to ruffle feathers.
 
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