Grand Prix 2011 Canadian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

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O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sons command.

With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!

From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

Thought this might be useful if you wanted to sing along to the Canadian National Anthem before the start of the race.

Anyway, on to the Grand Prix, after all that’s what we’re here for. Last year Bridgestone provided tyres, which didn’t like the surface at the Circuit Gilles Villeneuve too much, and the powers that be in F1 thought “ah, ha here’s an idea to spice up the racing. Why don’t we ask those blokes at Pirelli if they can make sets of boots for F1 cars that fall apart on the warm up lap”, and they did.

In 2010 Hamilton put his car on pole (you may recall him pushing his car back to the pits, so light was it on fuel) and then went on to win an exciting race with teammate Jenson Button standing on the 2nd step.

So what for Canada 2011? Red Bull, at least car No.1, has been a tad difficult to beat but McLaren and Ferrari are getting closer during the race. With 5 wins out of 6 races Vettel has a healthy lead in the Championship and some bookmakers are already paying out on the title being his. Vettel was 3rd on the grid last year, behind teammate Webber, and finished 4th with unspecified gearbox problems, still ahead of Webber who had led for many laps but got caught out by the high tyre wear rate.

Fernando Alonso was 3rd last time out in Canada after getting mugged by a hard charging Jenson Button. Mercedes had a mixed race, Rosberg was “best of the rest” behind the McLaren’s, Alonso’s Ferrari and the Red Bull’s whilst Michael Schumacher treated the race like a destruction derby, straight lining chicanes and bouncing off other cars with gay abandon. What of Felipe Massa I hear you ask; well, he was one of Schumacher’s victims and lost time pitting for a new nose cone.

This is very nearly the last Hurrah for the exhaust blown diffuser and we have two, yes 2, DRS zones. So expect cars breezing past another before and after the pits, when they’re not in their getting new tyres of course.

Will it be another Red Bull walk over or can the McLaren’s and Ferrari’s tame the charging Bull? How will the Pirelli tyres hold up dusty and bumpy Ille Notre-Dame Circuit? Will it rain? Who will win? Can one of the minor teams struggle up into the points? I don’t know but I get the feeling there will be lots of speculation.

And we have our own track side reporter this year - take a bow Ray in Toronto and make sure you post some good photos

For Galahad’s excellent circuit write up, track history and all the stats a boy or girl could want click here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/circuit-gilles-villeneuve/
 
I know I'm a Hamilton fan, so it might be argued of what I'm about to say that 'I would say that wouldn't I', but isn't Lauda completely out of order with his comments?
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/92265

Hamilton had one relatively low-speed brush with Webber which could be argued as a racing incident, and which Mark himself described as 'a bit clumsy' by Lewis. Then He was removed (unintentionally) from the race by his teammate while trying to pass him on the straight, after getting a much quicker exit out of the chicane.
Neither incident was remotely 'completely mad', 'dangerous' or going 'beyond all boundaries', especially considering all the other crash-bang-wallop incidents later in the race (Button, Alonso, Di Resta, Sutil, Heidfeld etc.)

Not to mention Schumacher's [my driver of the weekend btw] double move to push Hamilton off the track at the hairpin, which was responsible for putting Lewis back behind Button in the first place, and which went completely uninvestigated.

So why is Lauda picking on Hamilton? Is he 'completely mad' himself, or is he just jumping on an all-too-easy bandwagon?
 
I really don't get all this 'racing line', 'no overtaking zone' ' one car length ahead' stuff that's repeatedly used in arguments for blame and punishments. Are these new rules that are in place as I can't find them?

I understand some places may be natural places to do things but they aren't automatic rights to keep that position or hit someone else. The better overtakers brake later, take unusual lines and often will try to overtake wherever there is an opportunity (which incidentally is anywhere they like within the white lines). Even some of the drivers (ahem Massa) are jumping on it.

How about we celebrate the fact that finally overtaking (and some of the pains that go with it) by large has actually been allowed. Its called a race for a reason. The less penalties the better.

Is it possible to give a double 'like'?
 
Are you sure that's what they are saying Bro? I read it that they were querying why LH stopped where he did if he thought he only had a flat tyre (the team confirmed his thoughts) but they told him to stop as they believed he had damage, hence why LH didn't get into trouble as the team told him to stop.
 
For those who were discussing it earlier, this FIA document seems to suggest there was no damage to Hamilton's car, other than a puncture.


The Stewards have investigated the actions of the driver of Car 3 (L. Hamilton) after his collision with Car 4 (J. Button) in particular the matter of where he stopped his car.
Having heard from the driver and the team representative, the Stewards have concluded that the driver was convinced he only had a flat tyre. This was subsequently confirmed by the team representative to be correct.
http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/f1_media/Documents/can-document-48.pdf

Does this mean twas correct that he thought it was only a puncture, or correct that it was only a puncture?

There have been so many different comments on this it is hard to know, however, you would think the team would have learned something from Monaco.
 
Where in the regulations does it state that? Is it perhaps an unwritten rule, or did they maybe make it clear in the drivers' briefing that no-one was to attempt a pass at a chicane?

Ughmm it was Schumi/Kubica the year prior that proved two cars don't go into that high speed chicane...it is not a rule only common sense.

I understand some places may be natural places to do things but they aren't automatic rights to keep that position or hit someone else. The better overtakers brake later, take unusual lines and often will try to overtake wherever there is an opportunity (which incidentally is anywhere they like within the white lines). Even some of the drivers (ahem Massa) are jumping on it.

How about we celebrate the fact that finally overtaking (and some of the pains that go with it) by large has actually been allowed. Its called a race for a reason. The less penalties the better.

First off it wasn't and overtake it was a barging off, so it cannot legally be called a pass, and yes when it doesn't come at the risk of another drivers race being compromised by all means overtake, he could never make that apex at that volocity and even under heavy breaking did not turn ito the corner, it was a shotgun move that cost one driver everything while another benefited from his own safety car......If Kubica could not make that apex on the inside line in dry conditions then well it was never going to happen under slippery conditions. 100% buttons fault, as Alonso had the line and by virtue of the race line the volocity it allows into the chicane.
 
Well Whitmarsh has said there was race ending damage but I can't help but think this is McLaren being over cautious again due to fear of penalties, which I don't blame them for. Any other team would have allowed them back. Would VMM have any data on the suspension other than TV footage?
 
Sarinaide, he went for the gap, and he was alongside, the alonso turned in. it happens a lot, however, it is in the focus at Tue moment due to the penalties in Monaco. So i respectfully disagree.

as for the manner of the win, I can name instances of similar circumstance where the driver has been praised. Lewis in Monaco, for finishing sixth despite his issues, vettel at silverstone 10, in spite of his dodgems to come through the field.

I know you disagree, and that is fair enough, i am simply trying to point out the inconsistencies. in my opinion, of course.


Does anyone notice how similar Alonso's line is to Rosberg's ahead, it is the race line he is turning to make the chicane on the proper race line, does anyone really notice that at the point of impact Button is heading out to the grass, over braking, understeer the lot.....from .20 seconds it is really conclusive that Button barged because he made the mistake and had nowhere to go.
 
Sarinaide, barging off is a bit strong (I'm assuming you are talking about with Alonso). Alonso would have seen clearly where JB was, he chose to keep his line which he's allowed to do, but sometimes there may be contact. It was unfortunate that Alonso got beached but these things happen. I'd rather drivers felt they could attempt to overtake otherwise I may as well sit on a bank on the M25.

And you're assuming that Hamiltons off is why that was dropped. I clearly saw the result as "no further action" which is the response for racing incident.
 
I think the point that is missing from this discussion that was highlighted by the stewards was that Alonso was on an outlap. He had only just come out in front of JB and his tyres would not have been up to temperature. This makes a difference, no?
 
Sarinaide, barging off is a bit strong (I'm assuming you are talking about with Alonso). Alonso would have seen clearly where JB was, he chose to keep his line which he's allowed to do, but sometimes there may be contact. It was unfortunate that Alonso got beached but these things happen. I'd rather drivers felt they could attempt to overtake otherwise I may as well sit on a bank on the M25.

And you're assuming that Hamiltons off is why that was dropped. I clearly saw the result as "no further action" which is the response for racing incident.

With McLaren's vast superiority over Ferrari, there were plenty of better places to take him and there is a high possibility it would have happened anyways, it is just like Lewis didn't recognise the window closing, Jenson didn't see a closing window soon enough, I am very much for passing but there are places where you can legitimately pass and also where there is lesser collateral risk.
 
My problem is that at about 4 seconds on that video, Button is alongside if not slightly ahead of Alonso. He had to slow more to make his line into the corner but once another car is alongside Alonso cannot just try to follow the racing line - it will result in an incident. I dont think Button would have gone straight on as he broke earlier than Alonso to make his tighter line, however, nor do I think that he could have made the overtake stick as Alonso would have the inside line at the next corner.

In the end it was fairly small contact with a big consequence that was unfortunate for alonso and fortunate for button. It is almost of a reverse of what happened to the two sister cars at Monza last year but with the fortune reversed.
 
I'm sorry sarinaide, I completely disagree and think we'll have to agree to disagree. JB was ahead going into that corner which Alonso could have seen and could have taken avoiding action should he so wished. As Jenov pointed out Alonso wasn't up to speed either/had the right grip either.

They are F1 drivers and should therefore go for opportunities when presented. If JB hadn't done it at that point those valuable tenths lost behind Alonso may have altered his finishing position as he may never have got into Vettel's DRS zone.

I understand you are an Alonso fan but it really was just one of those things. Barging it wasn't.
 
Sarinaide, not sure if you spotted it, but rosberg was not alongside another driver when he turned in.

I personally think that alonso would have handled it differently if it was Lewis alongside him.
 
About the race - you know - the bit at the end of the Grand Prix afternoon yesterday...

I'm trying to imagine what it would have been like without the artificiality of DRS. Difficult one this. With it we had excitement and yet without it we'd have most likely had another procession. But is it true RACING? Personally I think not...
 
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