Grand Prix 2010 Chinese Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Well here we go for round 4 and the third long haul race in a row. For those of us in Europe that's going to mean another early start on Saturday and Sunday.

It seems longer than 2 weeks since the last GP and the motorsport press has been unusually quiet. Most teams are set to introduce their early season upgrades in time for the Spanish GP so don't expect the status quo to change too drastically this weekend.

If the Red Bulls can keep their cars on the track and in full working order then it's going to be difficult to see any one else topping the time sheets over the weekend.

Ferrari have announced that they are going to test a Mclaren style F-Duct in practice so it will be interesting to see if that makes any difference.

Further down the field Lotus have announced they will be adding a couple of upgrades that may be worth a few 10ths and Force India will continue to use Paul Da Resta in first practice as he continues his F1 education.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Is this going to give us a better indication as to how the season will play out?

It it stays dry and we don't have an unusual qualifying session with the top teams out of position, is it going to be processional as everyone is predicting?

Or will we see some aggressive strategies now that the teams have some useful tyre data?

I'm hoping for a good, hard race with all of the contenders in with a chance and some mixed up strategies.
However, as we saw in Malaysia, track position is more important than stopping for fresh rubber so I could well be disappointed.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

I suspect that although the will be several updates on various cars here they will still be in the fairly minor range and it woun't be until we get to Spain that we will see exactly where teams are at.

I believe Bridgestone have said that tyre wear is expected to be high at this circuit, if that will make a difference or not to the actual racing i'm yet to be convinced and if it stays dry then for the sunday afternoon armcair fan it may turn out to look not that exciting a race. Having said that i'm really quite intruiged to see how schumacher goes this weekend, given his apauling luck in the last two races will he be any closer to Rosberg?

I think i've also convinced myself that Hamilton and Alonso would have given the Red Bull's a good run for their money in Maylasia had they started nearer the front and this circuit my suit them both in the same fashion, so bring it on!!
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Could be good, hope the weather doesn't get too involved.

I think the McLarens may well have the edge in top line speed with the massive straight, but who knows if Ferrari manage to get their F Duct to work?

BMW Sauber is the only outfit that has so far been able to successfully copy the McLaren concept

errrrr didn't they develop it last year?
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Session 1 ended a little bit ago; according to the official F1 feed, the session was red-flagged around 11:15am local time(11:15pm US EDT) due to a crash at Turn 16 involving Toro Rosso driver Sebastien Buemi. By all accounts, there was a front-end suspension failure which sent Buemi into the gravel traps around 16(officials there are saying that it appeared the whole front suspension seemed to shatter w/both front wheels coming off at the same time........... :o :o :o :o :o ). Thankfully, Buemi appeared unhurt and the gravel trap did its' job, slowing the car sufficiently enough to prevent major damage upon impact w/the barriers.......... Session was restarted at 11:24am local time and completed through the scheduled end at 11:30am.

Anyway, here are the session times from the F1 feed...................
1} Jenson Button(Vodafone McLaren/Mercedes), 1:36.677 sec[15 laps]
2} Nico Rosberg(Mercedes GP), 1:36.748 sec[17 laps]
3} Lewis Hamilton(Vodafone McLaren/Mercedes), 1:36.775 sec[19 laps]
4} Michael Schumacher(Mercedes GP), 1:37.509 sec[14 laps]
5} Sebastien Vettel(Red Bull/Renault), 1:37.601 sec[20 laps]
6} Robert Kubica(Renault F1), 1:37.716 sec[17 laps]
7} Vitaly Petrov(Renault F1), 1:37.745 sec[25 laps]
8} Mark Webber(Red Bull/Renault), 1:37.980 sec[17 laps]
9} Adrian Sutil(Force India F1), 1:38.008 sec[13 laps]
10} Felipe Massa(Scuderia Ferrari), 1:38.098 sec[19 laps]
11} Jaime Alguersauri(Scuderia Toro Rosso), 1:38.161 sec[19 laps]
12} Kamui Kobayashi(BMW Sauber-Ferrari), 1:38.375 sec[21 laps]
13} Pedro de la Rosa(BMW Sauber-Ferrari), 1:38.421 sec[19 laps]
14} Nico Hulkenburg(AT&T Williams), 1:38.569 sec[20 laps]
15} Paul di Resta(Force India F1), 1:38.618 sec[26 laps]
16} Rubens Barrichello(AT&T Williams), 1:38.678 sec[17 laps]
17} Sebastien Buemi(Scuderia Toro Rosso), 1:39.939 sec[5 laps]
18} Jarno Trulli(Lotus Racing), 1:41.531 sec[22 laps]
19} Heikki Kovalainen(Lotus Racing), 1:41.779 sec[23 laps]
20} Timo Glock(Virgin Racing), 1:41.830 sec[20 laps]
21} Lucas di Grassi(Virgin Racing), 1:42.181 sec[27 laps]
22} Bruno Senna(HRT F1 Team), 1:43.875 sec[23 laps]
23} Karun Chandok(HRT F1 Team), 1:43.949 sec[20 laps]
24} Fernando Alonso(Scuderia Ferrari), no posted time[6 laps]

Fastest Sector Times..................
S1: Hamilton, 25.4[gap, P1-P24, 1.8 sec]
S2: Rosberg, 28.5[gap, P1-P24, 2.8 sec]
S3: Button, 42.1[gap, P1-P24, 3.3 sec]

Fastest Sector & Trap Speeds....................
S1: Hamilton, 284kph
S2: Hamilton, 277kph
S3: Button, 262kph
Trap: Massa, 316kph

Although the first practice session on Fridays' is considered a bit of a "throwaway" session, there are still a few things to be gleaned...............
----Mercedes appears dominant for the moment w/both McLaren-Mercedes and Mercedes GP at the top of the timesheets
----Ferrari appears fastest in terms of straight-line speeds(Massa posted the fastest trap speed at 316kph, Alonso 2nd-quick w/a 315kph) yet Ferrari ended the session in P10[Massa] and P24[Alonso]. Not a good way to start for the red cars this weekend.............
----both Red Bull/Renault and Renault F1 appear strong early in the weekend(both Renaults placed in the top-7 while Sebby V was 5th-quickest and Webbo 8th-quickest)
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

That Buemi accident was possibly the most disturbing thing ive ever seen in F1!

As Buemi approached the the braking Zone for the longest straight He hit the brakes and both front suspensions shattered like glass. He scraped along the outside barrier and came to a halt fortunately not hitting anything too hard.

It is also worth noting that one of the wheels came off with such force it ended up going over the safety net. The camera man had to take avoiding action.

An 'expert' who texted into the BBC mentioned that on a slow mo replay, both front wheels appeared to 'turn inwards' just before the suspension exploded, suggesting steering column failure

I personally saw the front left wheel appear to go inward but did not see the right.

Antony Davidson said he thought it was 'finger problems' meaning that a mechanic did not fit something properly too the car or had 'too much hydraulics' to the brakes. Torro Rosso were fixing the inside of the front of the car before Buemi's accident with (irrc) a hydraulic leak.


News from Torro Rosso is that the right hand upright failed, When this happened the load was too much for the left hand side to take and failed also. The tethers apparently did not work because they are attached to the part of the upright that failed.
Torro Rosso will use a previous design used car for the rest of second practice and presumably for the rest of the GP weekend.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Having seen Buemi's accident on the Speed broadcast, all I can say is..................un-real. :o :o :o :o :o

How you could have both the left and right-side suspensions fail at once is a mystery; heck, even Speed's Steve Matchett couldn't quite explain it. It looked, for all the world, as though the left wishbone broke, then both suspensions went 'kablammo' and sent Buemi into the kitty litter. I'm really surprised, however, that the wheel tethers on both the left and right-front tires failed. If I'm not mistaken, the wheel tethers are very similar to what is used in the IndyCar Series here in the States' and ever since they were installed in mid-1999, there hasn't been a single failure of any SWEMS tether in use. Assuming the FIA use the same standard for wheel tethers as the IRL does, the odds of one tether failing are in the tens', if not hundreds' of thousands...................for two, they don't frankly exist.

Like I said in an earlier post, I suspect that both Toro Rosso and the FIA stewards will be taking a very, very close look at their cars the remainder of the weekend.

BTW, here's a little bit of info on the SWEMS wheel tether system the IndyCar Series uses.............
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Session 2 has come and gone from Shanghai; 23 cars took to the track and here's how they stand at the end of the session.......................

1} Lewis Hamilton(Vodafone McLaren/Mercedes), 1:35.217 sec[26 laps]
2} Nico Rosberg(Mercedes GP), 1:35.465 sec[22 laps]
3} Jenson Button(Vodafone McLaren/Mercedes), 1:35.593 sec[26 laps]
4} Michael Schumacher(Mercedes GP), 1:35.602 sec[28 laps]
5} Sebastian Vettel(Red Bull/Renault), 1:35.791 sec[30 laps]
6} Mark Webber(Red Bull/Renault), 1:35.995 sec[29 laps]
7} Adrian Sutil(Force India F1), 1:36.254 sec[31 laps]
8} Jaime Alguersauri(Scuderia Toro Rosso), 1:36.377 sec[43 laps]
9} Robert Kubica(Renault F1), 1:36.389 sec[29 laps]
10} Fernando Alonso(Scuderia Ferrari), 1:36.604 sec[33 laps]
11} Felipe Massa(Scuderia Ferrari), 1:36.944 sec[36 laps]
12} Vitaly Petrov(Renault F1), 1:36.986 sec[27 laps]
13} Pedro de la Rosa(BMW Sauber-Ferrari), 1:37.421 sec[32 laps]
14} Kamui Kobayashi(BMW Sauber-Ferrari), 1:37.431 sec[33 laps]
15} Rubens Barrichello(AT&T Williams), 1:37.657 sec[30 laps]
16} Vitantonio Liuzzi(Force India F1), 1:37.804 sec[31 laps]
17} Nico Hulkenburg(AT&T Williams), 1:37.867 sec[29 laps]
18} Jarno Trulli(Lotus Racing), 1:39.624 sec[35 laps]
19} Heikki Kovalainen(Lotus Racing), 1:39.947 sec[30 laps]
20} Timo Glock(Virgin Racing), 1:40.233 sec[27 laps]
21} Karun Chandok(HRT F1 Team), 1:41.008 sec[31 laps]
22} Lucas di Grassi(Virgin Racing), 1:41.107 sec[28 laps]
23} Bruno Senna(HRT F1 Team), 1:41.345 sec[32 laps]
24} Sebastien Buemi(Scuderia Toro Rosso), no posted time

Fastest Sector Times...............
S1: Hamilton, 25.0[gap, P1-P24, 1.6 sec]
S2: Hamilton & Schumacher, 28.2[gap, P1-P24, 2.3 sec]
S3: Hamilton, Rosberg & Button, 41.8 sec[gap, P1-P24, 2.3 sec]

Fastest Sector & Trap Speeds....................
S1: Button, 287kph
S2: Hamilton, 280kph
S3: Hamilton & Button, 263kph
Trap: Kobayashi, Hamilton, Button & Sutil, 312kph

----As in session 1, Mercedes appears dominant through both McLaren/Mercedes & Mercedes GP
----McLaren also appears to be the fastest so far as Button & Hamilton held fast speeds through all three sectors and the speed trap; could they be running a lower-downforce setting than the other teams this weekend?
----Ferrari OTOH appeared to go backwards in session 2 as both Massa and Alonso seem mired in mid-pack(Alonso P10, Massa P11) but it could be more a case of doing race-prep in the session rather than working on qualifying setups
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Well I dont know much about tethers or how similar/different they are to indy car but a couple of things i picked up from commentary etc. is:

The load they can take is something like 50,000 kg or something like that cannot remember the exact unit of measurement. And that supposedly the tethers 'failed' because technically had nothing to hold on to because are attached to the uprights, dunno how true it is but that sounds dodgy to me i always thought they were connected to the block in the middle of the monocoque that the suspension/axle is held onto.

But that crash is the oddest ive ever seen. Never seen anything like that just truly and utterly bizarre and scary.

The reason Torro Rosso gave doesn't quite seem to stack up, but im no scientist here but i remember Kimi's failure a few years ago when a 50 pence piece of a tyre vibrated so much cause the suspension to shatter. Then the other side did not go, but suppose it could be different loads, the reason for the accident was different so might be barking up wrong tree.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Qualifying for this race should reveal once and for all if Red Bull were using a ride hieght control mechanism. In the commentary it ws mentioned that Christian Horner has been discussing Ferrari's ratchet system! :dunno:

If both Red Bull and Ferrari run in qualifying with the ride hieght they will start the race with then both McLaren and Mercedes stand a far better chance of front row qualifying. This may be the best opportunity thus far of determining if any one car does have an advantage.

My feeling is that which ever car that gets into the lead makes the others look ordinary thanks to the effects dirty air and field spread. I'm praying for a far more level playing field in qualifying and a dry race, even if it means it is boring! I just need to know how fast these cars really are relative to one another!
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion


I've merged your thread with this one Alex as it's already being discussed here :)
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

So it is, I'm late to the party. :whistle:

If that happened on the finishing straight and the wheel overtook someone ahead, would the Toro Rosso take the place? :D
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Bernie has had the gall to blame poor attendance of the Chinese GP on "poor promotional efforts by the Shanghai organisers."

Perhaps he should be looking a little closer to home?
China has never been a big F1 country so why did he award them the contract in the first place?*

* Rhetorical question, replies not necessary.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Brogan said:
Perhaps he should be looking a little closer to home?
China has never been a big F1 country so why did he award them the contract in the first place?*

Because he :censored: 50 monkeys with :censored: and the Central Committee of the Chinese Communist Party's :censored: in the Forbidden City.

And he doesn't seem to mind not selling tickets!
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Just watched Seb's 2 wheeled wagon and that's got to be some of the craziest :censored: I've seen in a long time.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Speshal said:
Just watched Buemi's 2 wheeled wagon and that's got to be some of the craziest :censored: I've seen in a long time.

Definately a bizarre one and i can't remember seeing anything like it. I think what was more disconcerting was the failure of the tether's and where the wheels ended up! Kudos to the cameraman down there i would have let the camera go too given that looking from the onboard the right wheel appears to be heading straight at him before clipping the tyre barrier which deflected it over the catch fencing.
Re: 2010 Chinese GP Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Andrea_Moda_Rules: the exact figure is 5,000kg (5 metric tonnes) for each tether.
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