Second race in a row that fastest driver gets kicked back down the grid

[P1]

Once again the wrong guy is first on the grid.

This race would have been way more interesting with the right man on pole, just as the last race would have been.

Unfortunately the FIA feels the grid is an arranged seating arrangement so once again we put up with this shit.

 

[chris1981]

I do think its a shame that a penalty is carried from one race to the next. What would be the alternative though? I don't like the sound of taking points away.

 

[P1]

I would prefer points deduction or fine. I just don't like messing with the running order.

 

[mjo]

Schumacher went into qualifying knowing that he had a 5 place grid penalty. The rules are the rules. Perhaps Schumacher shouldn't have been so silly in Spain.

 

[mjo]

Grid penalties for he next race have been around for a number of years now. The drivers are fully aware of this, the specators are fully aware of this, and the stewards are free to award this penalty. For an F1 driver a fine is pittance and championship points being docked is way too severe for the crime committed by Schumacher. Taking points away is messing around with the order, and the recipient of the penalty can't change it - this truly penalises the spectator. At least Schumacher can do something about a grid penalty.

 

[P1]

Schumacher can do nothing about a grid penalty. I am astonished you believe that grid penalties don't affect race outcomes and points.

The only difference is that with a points penalty you still get to see racing based on a proper grid sorted by competitiveness.

 

[mjo]

You misread me, he has a chance of salvaging a decent position from the grid penalty, unlike is points were deducted, where he wouldn't be able to salvage anything at all.

 

[EvilWhippet]

Would we watch a race if nothing happened?
No. That's Bahrain 2010. God no.

Did Schumacher gain an advantage from hitting Senna?
No.

Did Schumacher do it on purpose?
No.

Did the incident punish itself?
Yes.

What I'm getting at here is there was never a need to penalise Michael. As far as I could see Hamilton (or, to be precise Mclaren) messed up and failed scrutineering. The penalty for this is being sent to the back of the grid, so the rules are rules in that case. If the stewards were only brought in when it's actually necessary the right man would be on pole for this GP. Just my two cents.

 

[gethinceri]

Well, the penalty was awarded, and that was discussed in Clip The Apex as if people were sitting around watching a pot of each others piss boiling.
Move on.

 

[mjo]

Yes, but it ended Senna's race, and he was plainly blameless. It was obviously Schumacher's fault, so he deserved the penalty. Not every incident can be attributed as a racing incident. Some require penalties to be given (although there are far to many cases of penalties being applied where there was no need), but Schumacher deserved his penalty.

In reply to EvilWhippet.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Before qualifying Schumi stated he would get pole and start from 6th on the grid and that is what he has done after quali he has stated that he will win the race from 6th on the grid, I like his style and I hope he does just that.

Win Schumi win....

 

[siffert_fan]

Well, the penalty led to the MS-Grosjean contact, and, I suspect, Schumacher's ultimate elimination from the race. I hope the stewards are satisfied.

 

[P1]

At Monaco of all places, there is increased accident risk from starting people out of order of speed. The penalty was clearly a contributing factor to that accident today.

 

[Mephistopheles]

I honestly think that the fact that Schumacher was out of the race in Spain due to an ACCIDENT was penalty enough. there was no need to carry the pain into Monaco....

 

[Fenderman]

What goes around comes around, I guess.

 

[EvilWhippet]

Yes, but it ended Senna's race, and he was plainly blameless. It was obviously Schumacher's fault, so he deserved the penalty. Not every incident can be attributed as a racing incident. Some require penalties to be given (although there are far to many cases of penalties being applied where there was no need), but Schumacher deserved his penalty.

In reply to EvilWhippet.

I understand your point of view - and you explained it well - I just don't agree with it at all. As far as I'm concerned, in a sport like this, shit will happen. I wouldn't watch if it didn't!

 

[Slyboogy]

Yes, but it ended Senna's race, and he was plainly blameless.

Wouldn't see that he "plainly" blameless.

A racing incident in my opinion, Senna was already making contact with cars, and fighting as if his life was dependent on it on a car much slower, very dangerous, a bit like Kovalainen in Monaco, but neither get a penalty for that.

 

[mjo]

He wasn't unnaturally moving in the braking area, and he wasn't taking any risks when it came to braking, it was entirely Schumacher's fault for misjudging his braking and running into the back of him. I can see why people would attribute that as a racing incident, but it is just my opinion that the incident was entirely Schumacher's fault.

At Monaco of all places, there is increased accident risk from starting people out of order of speed. The penalty was clearly a contributing factor to that accident today.

Yes, the marked difference in speed from Schumacher going into the first corner plainly caused the accident. I mean, he was like 5 seconds faster than anyone else in qualifying, wasn't he?

 

[Mephistopheles]

I understand your point of view - and you explained it well - I just don't agree with it at all. As far as I'm concerned, in a sport like this, shit will happen. I wouldn't watch if it didn't!

That's why I didn't like the Monaco race because shit didn't happen....

 

[Harry]

He wasn't unnaturally moving in the braking area, and he wasn't taking any risks when it came to braking, it was entirely Schumacher's fault for misjudging his braking and running into the back of him. I can see why people would attribute that as a racing incident, but it is just my opinion that the incident was entirely Schumacher's fault.

the overhead video clearly showed Senna jink back to the left after Schumacher commits to that side, which caused Schumacher's reaction back to the right and subsequent crash. Furthermore, Senna himself said he had to brake early because of the condition of his tyres.

Yes, the marked difference in speed from Schumacher going into the first corner plainly caused the accident. I mean, he was like 5 seconds faster than anyone else in qualifying, wasn't he?

the "marked difference in speed" was obviously caused by the Merc having used DRS etc and not having to brake as early as Senna. What qualifying lap times has to do with their relative speeds at the end of the straight on that particular lap is the thing that should have people rolling their eyes..