Sebastian Vettel

Lots of threads have alluded to having a discussion about the current world champion so lets get it all off our collective chests (oooeer!)

Lots has been has been written about this young man from his testing debut with BMW Sauber in 2006 aged just 19 - he then progressed to the the toro rosso team for his first full race season in 2008 - the memorable race being his drive in the wet at Fuji where he managed to rear end his future team mate Mark Webber who said ""It's kids isn't it... kids with not enough experience – they do a good job and then they fuck it all up." - Little was Mark to know he would be paired with the "Kid" just 2 years later.

His maiden win came at the 2008 Italian GP where he qualified up from, the race started under the safety car in the rain and the young German led from start to finish in the Toro Rosso - becoming the youngest winner of a grand prix ever.

Then we enter the era of the Red Bull. In 2009 he joined the Red Bull team, which got off to a torrid start as he managed to crash into Kubika in Australia, a feat he would go on to repeat during the 09 season.

Last year needs no mention........

So to the crux of the matter. Is Sebastian Vettel?

the real deal, the baby schumi, the new pretender - a genuine racer? - aka Wunderkind

or

A very quick driver, who lucked into a very fast car and can bang it on pole and lead from lights to flag and be the quickest pilot of a car, yet can't overtake for toffee? aka WunOrAother

 

[Fenderman]

I shall like that only once.

 

[Bushi]

I think that Alonso said the exact same thing when he was at Renault.

 

[Brogan]

Vettel has extended his contract at Red Bull until the end of 2015.

 

[Fenderman]

Brogan Surely that's for the non-news thread, isn't it?

 

[F1ang-o]

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1...future-to-Red-Bull-with-extended-deal-to-2015
Wonder if Adrian Newey has renewed his.........

 

[siffert_fan]

Why should Newey go elsewhere, when he has arguably the best current driver at the wheel of his creation right now?

 

[Mephistopheles]

Actually if ypu read the article he doesn't say he might retire in 5 years he says he doesn't know where he'll be orvwhat he'll be doing and that for all he knows he'll have lost his passion for the sport and not be in it anymore but that doesn't make such a good headline.

That's exactly what he said, and whoever asked that question is a dick-ed..

 

[RasputinLives]

Rumour has it (it is planet F1 after all) that Vettel has extended his contract at Red Bull for another year and will be there until 2015 at least. Who can blame him at the moment eh?

http://planetf1.com/driver/18227/8771767/Vettel-extends-Red-Bull-contract

No news on that Mark Webber extension but he is being nice and well behaved at mo though so maybe Seb....I mean Red Bull will offer him one.

 

[LifeW12]

Vettel just seems to be having an easy time right now. Everyone says he's a great driver, I disagree. The best drivers drive the worst cars the best. Vettel hasn't had won a championship or multiple races against far superior cars.

Prost: 1986 McLaren, beats the superior Williams Hondas straight up

Senna: 1993 McLaren, 5 wins against the almightly Williams Renaults. Led the championship for the first part of the season till the car ran out of steam.

Schumacher: 1996 Ferrari, 3 wins in a car that shouldn't have even been up there. Also 1998 where the McLaren was the best car all year yet Schumacher drove the life out of it in Hungary to win with Brawn's brilliance.

Alonso: 2012 Ferrari, nearly won a championship in a car that wasn't really up to it. Also 2005 where the McLaren was clearly the faster car but he still managed to win straight up.

Vettel: Every Red Bull he's driven has been the best car. Hasn't really had to fight too hard. Even 2009 once they got to mid season, he was unbeatable. Wait to he's got a bad car, then we'll see how he compares to the 4 drivers above. That 2008 Monza race wasn't against far superior cars, he just had the track position imho. It was pretty much a Red Bull car with some different stickers and a different engine.

I really think that Vettel is a bit like Nelson Piquet, seems to be brilliantly fast and breezing off into the distance when everything works but struggles when in traffic or the car isn't hooked up. And is also amazingly lucky. Piquet really lucked into 1981 because Reutemann didn't realize that he had to race in Vegas, 1983 where Prost blew up so many times and 1987 where Mansell DNF'ed too much then crashed.

 

[Brogan]

It's not a rumour: http://cliptheapex.com/threads/sebastian-vettel.2464/page-47#post-202930

 

[RasputinLives]

Note to self: read thread before posting.

 

[RasputinLives]

Shouldn't that be on the Vettel thread? Couldn't disagree with you more by the way. In all my time watching F1 I've never seen a driver as skilled as Vettel in being able to judge and match his rivals pace. He constantly pulls out that 2 second gap on the first lap, over and over again he'll let a rival get within a certain distance of him and then suddenly jump straight on to their pace or faster and his has enough awareness about him to go for fastest laps for fun.

Can't believe thats all the car. Sorry.

 

[Incubus]

LifeW12 While I get the gist of what you're saying, it's not Vettel's fault he's got the best car! All drivers want to drive the fastest car around it's hard to imagine what more could Vettel have done in the past couple of years. Plus it seems to me he has seriously upped his game in the last 2 years. Certainly nothing wrong with his overtakes nor his abilities to slice through traffic when out of sequence.

As for the championship battles of old you are referring to Prost in 1983 only had two retirements due to mechanical failures. Piquet had actually more failures that season. He was driving a more technologically advanced car with the more powerful engine but was also less reliable than the Renault.

Similarly the McLaren was certainly faster than the Renault in 2005 but it was equally certainly far less reliable.

 

[Brogan]

Webber drives the same car.

 

[FB]

Now you've opened a hoary old chestnut!

 

[Brogan]

Do we need a Vettel vs Webber thread?

 

[Incubus]

Now you've opened a hoary old chestnut!

-------------------------------------------------------

Which one and how old?
For a second I thought you were referring to the last part of my own comment. Referring to BMW's "special" fuel in 1983. But then that wouldn't just have been the wrong topic, it would have been the wrong century.

 

[FB]

Do we need a Vettel vs Webber thread?

I really don't think we need one do we? Game, set and match to the German.

Incubus - I was meaning Brogan's post, cue lots of stuff about how Vettel is given the better parts, tyres, seat on the team bus, underwear etc.

 

[Incubus]

Well, to be fair I have heard "insider" rumours that Vettel's underwear is frequently set-up with less drag than Webber's, thus ensuring less downforce but better penetration.
Just a rumour but it makes you think doesn't it?
Well not me personally but you know what I mean.

 

[RasputinLives]

Do we need a Vettel vs Webber thread?

They've been team mates at Red Bull for 82 races now. Both cars have made it to the end of 65 of these. The current score stands at Vettel 49 Webber 16. Webber has not beat Vettel in a Grand Prix since Silverstone last year.

No need for a thread I reckon.