Sebastian Vettel

Lots of threads have alluded to having a discussion about the current world champion so lets get it all off our collective chests (oooeer!)

Lots has been has been written about this young man from his testing debut with BMW Sauber in 2006 aged just 19 - he then progressed to the the toro rosso team for his first full race season in 2008 - the memorable race being his drive in the wet at Fuji where he managed to rear end his future team mate Mark Webber who said ""It's kids isn't it... kids with not enough experience – they do a good job and then they fuck it all up." - Little was Mark to know he would be paired with the "Kid" just 2 years later.

His maiden win came at the 2008 Italian GP where he qualified up from, the race started under the safety car in the rain and the young German led from start to finish in the Toro Rosso - becoming the youngest winner of a grand prix ever.

Then we enter the era of the Red Bull. In 2009 he joined the Red Bull team, which got off to a torrid start as he managed to crash into Kubika in Australia, a feat he would go on to repeat during the 09 season.

Last year needs no mention........

So to the crux of the matter. Is Sebastian Vettel?

the real deal, the baby schumi, the new pretender - a genuine racer? - aka Wunderkind

or

A very quick driver, who lucked into a very fast car and can bang it on pole and lead from lights to flag and be the quickest pilot of a car, yet can't overtake for toffee? aka WunOrAother

 

[F1Brits_90]

Fia Said he had to attend nobody said anything about being sober & most entertaining most entertaining prize giving been in years

 

[Angel]

Any event where there's free vodka or ice cream and Kimi is up for being there.

A Ferrari fact, apparently Ferrari were the only team to have both drivers in Q3 in all the races in 2018. That's no mean feat.

 

[Titch]

A little quizzical smile from Kimi there.

 

[Izumi]

Seb is inspecting his 2019 office, meeting with new TP and probably having decent Italian lunch as well. This is a week before car launch.

 

[Izumi]

"Enemy" in my kitchen? Sebastian's brother Fabian signed up with Mercedes. Blasphemy.

I am looking forward to a meeting several years down the road when Fabian Vettel and Mick Schumacher meet on the same race track. Mick for now seems to have better grooming for higher league. Fabian needs help, but Seb has no time for him. Not now.

Sebastian Vettel's younger brother joins Mercedes

 

[Angel]

Maybe it's a sign of things to come. Perhaps Seb will swap Ferrari red for Mercedes grey at some point, who knows?

 

[Izumi]

Maybe it's a sign of things to come. Perhaps Seb will swap Ferrari red for Mercedes grey at some point, who knows?

I cannot overcome my feeling that if Leclerc drives well, Sebastian's contract is not going to be renewed. I am not going to drag this subject much further, since all is just speculation on my part, however if you have even very basic knowledge how to read body language, go back to unveiling of this year car. You could cut air with a desert knife. Pressure from (primarily Italian) media to replace Vettel I think was such, that Mr. Binotto felt necessary to make statement about teams's priorities and throw their support behind Sebastian quite early. Where Seb would go if he gets pushed out?
Not sure, but I think early retirement would be at the top on his short list. With Hamilton in the team Mr. Wolff has no desire to have two Alpha-males on the same team. I think he already stated that much. Dr. Marko is of similar opinion, and as long Verstappen is on the RBR team, Seb will not be re-hired by them. I would give about 2% chance that they would change their mind.

 

[Angel]

I think if young Charles does well Seb might decide to retire early, he's suggested he might do that before. Unless he and Hamilton do a seat swap, Seb is good friends with Toto Wolff as I understand it and they probably would like a German in their car. I don't know, it's all just theories right now isn't it?

I didn't see the Ferrari presentation, just a couple of pictures and did have to play where's Seb. I didn't take that too seriously though but you could be right. Only time will tell on that I guess.

 

[Izumi]

I think if young Charles does well Seb might decide to retire early, he's suggested he might do that before. Unless he and Hamilton do a seat swap, Seb is good friends with Toto Wolff as I understand it and they probably would like a German in their car. I don't know, it's all just theories right now isn't it?

I didn't see the Ferrari presentation, just a couple of pictures and did have to play where's Seb. I didn't take that too seriously though but you could be right. Only time will tell on that I guess.

Don't forget that Vettel is by several media outlets being made responsible for loss of WDC over past two years. That charge, right or wrong, Ferrari cannot ignore forever. There is still an Italian race on the calendar and seats need to be filled. I had only machine translation of several articles from Italian newspapers, and tone was harsh if not downright nasty. I thought Arrivabene might have performed better job than he has done in PR arena.

 

[vintly]

I’ve said before that Hammy and Seb could swap one day. Makes sense to me.

 

[RasputinLives]

Never gonna happen vintly hoping you are keeping that twenty warm for me.

 

[vintly]

You wish it was twenty RasputinLives We're at £50 mate.

 

[RasputinLives]

So we are! Even more rain for me to make when you have to pay up.

 

[RasputinLives]

I was quite wise it seems on the Kimi bet!

 

[Angel]

I’ve said before that Hammy and Seb could swap one day. Makes sense to me.

Great minds and all that

 

[Izumi]

I’ve said before that Hammy and Seb could swap one day. Makes sense to me.

In one recent interview with Sebastian I acquired understanding that he is no mood to ever drive for Mercedes. I gather then if he decide to switch teams, it will be a decision of his rather spontaneous in nature and in last moment. Perhaps Fabian might nudge him.

 

[vintly]

I was quite wise it seems on the Kimi bet!

That was an easy one

 

[vintly]

So we are! Even more rain for me to make when you have to pay up.

Could be. I’ll pretend to like rain though.

 

[Il_leone]

Izumi
Before we start any spying row between Ferrari, Mercedes and the Vettel brothers. I wonder if Vettel jnr has got a non disclosure clause in his contract from Merc

Judging by pre season testing Le Clerc will definitely push Vettel harder than Kimi. Vettel needs to start well to establish his status or he is going to face the situation Alonso did at Mclaren when Hamilton was rapid from the beginning and it will be much more difficult for him to be the team leader

Vettel's get out hope if he fails at Ferrari is get himself into Mercedes where the hierarchy yearn for a German world champion still even after Rosberg quit. That depends how the board will allow Toto run the team.. will it be alongside Hamilton ... I don't think he has choice if Ferrari give him the boot which is hypothetical at this point

Better for Vettel would be to replace Hamilton but then his likely teammate would be Ocon unless Bottas has a storming season which I remain unconvinced

 

[Izumi]

Izumi
Before we start any spying row between Ferrari, Mercedes and the Vettel brothers. I wonder if Vettel jnr has got a non disclosure clause in his contract from Merc

Judging by pre season testing Le Clerc will definitely push Vettel harder than Kimi. Vettel needs to start well to establish his status or he is going to face the situation Alonso did at Mclaren when Hamilton was rapid from the beginning and it will be much more difficult for him to be the team leader

Vettel's get out hope if he fails at Ferrari is get himself into Mercedes where the hierarchy yearn for a German world champion still even after Rosberg quit. That depends how the board will allow Toto run the team.. will it be alongside Hamilton ... I don't think he has choice if Ferrari give him the boot which is hypothetical at this point

Better for Vettel would be to replace Hamilton but then his likely teammate would be Ocon unless Bottas has a storming season which I remain unconvinced

I am in agreement with general acceptance of notion, that Leclerc is youthfully more aggressive than old Kimi is, thus I find plausible all predictions that Sebastian will have to fight his wars on his own. Hamilton, despite Mr. Wolff's crocodile tears, will receive support from meek Bottas, as we witnessed in the past. I am stretching my memory, yet I am failing to recall a single case in past decade when Vettel would receive track assistance from his teammate similarly Bottas was helping Hamilton in recent races. For one reason or another, it has never come to fruition. Leclerc will look after his own future. For now they chatting offtrack about car characteristics, and that's where it will probably end.

I neither accept or want to hear about someone being "a leader" in a team. What even that means and how is it exhibited in environment in which drivers compete agaist each other?

Mt. Lauda, who still hold his role within Mercedes AMG hierarchy was strongly opposed to team up Hamilton with another Alpha male. "Its not worth the trouble", said he. I am unable to rationalize this argument, but I have difficulty to envision Seb driving for Mercedes. I could be however wrong, if the job is offered, and at home his partner, brother Fabian, and neighbor (Mr. Wolff) try to convince him. Anything can happen then.