Pirelli 2012 compounds?

Sarinaide

Banned
I have a question relating to Pirelli's 'hard' compound tyre. Do they have to restructure it in the off season to provide a better level of natural grip?

I haven't seen any team really command the compound well and it seems like sides are adopting the "we have to" approach to the usage of the "hard compound", could it be modified to provide a little better grip level at perhaps the sacrifice of durability?
 

Sarinaide

Banned
I don't know or/and can't find statistics but I am interested to know the passing stats on Hard vs Softer compounds and particularly when other cars are running similar age/newish hard vs hard strategies.
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
I don't know or/and can't find statistics but I am interested to know the passing stats on Hard vs Softer compounds and particularly when other cars are running similar age/newish hard vs hard strategies.

That could be interesting. I'll have a go, but it will take a while.
 

Brogan

šŸ¦¶ Leg end
Staff Member
That could be interesting. I'll have a go, but it will take a while.
I've just sent Mike Seymour of GP Update a message to ask him where the links are to all of his tyre charts.
I figured those in conjunction with the overtaking breakdown would be all that's required?
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
I've just sent Mike Seymour of GP Update a message to ask him where the links are to all of his tyre charts.
I figured those in conjunction with the overtaking breakdown would be all that's required?

We have a volunteer! :D

No, seriously, if you get a link let me have it Bro and I'll do it.
 

Brogan

šŸ¦¶ Leg end
Staff Member
LOL

Here's the Spain one: http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/260562/in-depth-tyre-analysis-barcelona/

http://photos.gpupdate.net/documents/2011/GPUpdate.net_InDepthTyreAnalysis_Barcelona_2011.gif



Just waiting for Mike to reply for links to all the others.
 

Sarinaide

Banned
Well it does suggest that there is a point which the Primes (hard) come to life, I think the best stints for Hard are open track stints or if you are in front with nothing but space ahead, I also think the track temperature has a lot to do with it, in the middle of a GP it is likely to be at its hottest, cars are laying down a lot lf rubber and the Hards perhaps respond better in the earlier stints.

would anyone think that the level of grip of hards, on a heavily rubbered racing line, doesnt quite bite as the softer options do in the course of the weekend. (ie: don't grip the tarmac nor bind like the soft compounds. I base this on the Barcelona data, 33 degrees centigrade, eats up the options at the start then the primes struggled later, I think Barce was a case of prime then options, the degradation may have been significantly reduced.

I wonder if Pirelli will asses this next season, giving the Hards a little more play.
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
OK, in Spain, of the 90 passes:

56 (62%) were Soft passing Soft,
24 (27%) were Soft passing Hard,
6 (7%) were Hard passing Soft and
4 (4%) were Hard passing Hard.

Only 4 of the passes came with the passing car on older tyres than the car being passed, these were:
L18 Sutil (Soft=3) passed Kovalainen (Soft=1)
L32 Kobayashi (Soft=6) passed Trulli (Soft=2)
L36 Heidfeld (Soft=14) passed Alguersuari (Soft=11)
L45 Heidfeld (Soft=8) passed Petrov (Hard=3)

11 passes were between cars whose tyres had done the same number of race laps, while 75 were passes by cars with younger tyres.

The breakdown is under the spoiler button:
LapPasserPasser comp.Tyre agePassedPassed comp.Tyre ageComp. splitAge split
2BarrichelloHard1LiuzziSoft1Hard/Soft1/1
4ButtonSoft3BuemiSoft3Soft/Soft3/3
6D'AmbrosioSoft5KarthikeyanSoft5Soft/Soft5/5
8LiuzziSoft7PĆ©rez Soft7Soft/Soft7/7
8PĆ©rez Soft7LiuzziSoft7Soft/Soft7/7
10VettelSoft0ButtonSoft9Soft/Soft0/9
10VettelSoft0MassaSoft9Soft/Soft0/9
10MaldonadoSoft1BarrichelloHard9Soft/Hard1/9
11VettelSoft1RosbergSoft10Soft/Soft1/10
11ButtonSoft10MassaSoft10Soft/Soft10/10
11WebberSoft0MassaSoft10Soft/Soft0/10
11MaldonadoSoft2SutilHard10Soft/Hard2/10
12WebberSoft1ButtonSoft11Soft/Soft1/11
12SchumacherSoft1KovalainenSoft11Soft/Soft1/11
12SchumacherSoft1TrulliSoft11Soft/Soft1/11
12MassaSoft0HeidfeldHard11Soft/Hard0/11
12KobayashiHard10KarthikeyanSoft11Hard/Soft10/11
13PetrovSoft1KovalainenSoft12Soft/Soft1/12
13PetrovSoft1TrulliSoft12Soft/Soft1/12
13RosbergSoft1KovalainenSoft12Soft/Soft1/12
13MassaSoft1KovalainenSoft12Soft/Soft1/12
13BuemiSoft3HeidfeldHard12Soft/Hard3/12
13KobayashiHard11D'AmbrosioSoft12Hard/Soft11/12
13KobayashiHard11GlockSoft12Hard/Soft11/12
14RosbergSoft2TrulliSoft13Soft/Soft2/13
14MassaSoft2TrulliSoft13Soft/Soft2/13
14SutilSoft0KarthikeyanSoft13Soft/Soft0/13
14BarrichelloSoft2KarthikeyanSoft13Soft/Soft2/13
14SutilSoft0D'AmbrosioSoft13Soft/Soft0/13
15BuemiSoft5KovalainenSoft14Soft/Soft5/14
15KobayashiHard13LiuzziSoft14Hard/Soft13/14
15SutilSoft1GlockSoft14Soft/Soft1/14
15BarrichelloSoft3D'AmbrosioSoft14Soft/Soft3/14
16ButtonSoft1SchumacherSoft5Soft/Soft1/5
16RosbergSoft4PetrovSoft4Soft/Soft4/4
16MaldonadoSoft7HeidfeldHard15Soft/Hard7/15
16AlguersuariSoft4HeidfeldHard15Soft/Hard4/15
16MaldonadoSoft7KovalainenSoft15Soft/Soft7/15
16AlguersuariSoft4KovalainenSoft15Soft/Soft4/15
16SutilSoft2LiuzziSoft15Soft/Soft2/15
16BarrichelloSoft4GlockSoft15Soft/Soft4/15
17di RestaSoft1HeidfeldHard16Soft/Hard1/16
18SutilSoft3KovalainenSoft1Soft/Soft3/1
19SutilSoft4KobayashiHard17Soft/Hard4/17
21PĆ©rez Hard13HeidfeldHard20Hard/Hard13/20
23di RestaSoft7AlguersuariSoft11Soft/Soft7/11
23MassaSoft1AlguersuariSoft11Soft/Soft1/11
24MassaSoft2di RestaSoft8Soft/Soft2/8
25MaldonadoSoft4SutilSoft11Soft/Soft4/11
25HeidfeldSoft3KovalainenSoft8Soft/Soft3/8
25HeidfeldSoft3KobayashiHard23Soft/Hard3/23
26GlockSoft9LiuzziSoft9Soft/Soft9/9
28MaldonadoSoft7TrulliSoft12Soft/Soft7/12
28BuemiSoft2TrulliSoft12Soft/Soft2/12
28AlguersuariSoft3SutilSoft14Soft/Soft3/14
29MaldonadoSoft8PĆ©rez Hard21Soft/Hard8/21
29BuemiSoft3PĆ©rez Hard21Soft/Hard3/21
30RosbergSoft2di RestaSoft14Soft/Soft2/14
32PetrovSoft5di RestaSoft16Soft/Soft5/16
32KobayashiSoft6TrulliSoft2Soft/Soft6/2
34KobayashiSoft8BarrichelloSoft10Soft/Soft8/10
35WebberHard5AlonsoHard5Hard/Hard5/5
35AlonsoHard5WebberHard5Hard/Hard5/5
36ButtonSoft5WebberHard6Soft/Hard5/6
36ButtonSoft5AlonsoHard6Soft/Hard5/6
36HeidfeldSoft14AlguersuariSoft11Soft/Soft14/11
36di RestaSoft3AlguersuariSoft11Soft/Soft3/11
36PĆ©rez Soft6AlguersuariSoft11Soft/Soft6/11
37SutilSoft6TrulliSoft7Soft/Soft6/7
37HeidfeldSoft0TrulliSoft7Soft/Soft0/7
38HeidfeldSoft1SutilSoft7Soft/Soft1/7
41HeidfeldSoft4MaldonadoHard4Soft/Hard4/4
41BarrichelloHard5KovalainenSoft12Hard/Soft5/12
42di RestaSoft9BuemiSoft16Soft/Soft9/16
42PĆ©rez Soft12BuemiSoft16Soft/Soft12/16
42PetrovSoft15BuemiSoft16Soft/Soft15/16
43HeidfeldSoft6KobayashiSoft17Soft/Soft6/17
45HeidfeldSoft8PetrovHard3Soft/Hard8/3
46KobayashiSoft1AlguersuariHard9Soft/Hard1/9
48KobayashiSoft3BuemiHard5Soft/Hard3/5
50PĆ©rez Soft2MaldonadoHard13Soft/Hard2/13
52KobayashiSoft7MaldonadoHard15Soft/Hard7/15
52HeidfeldSoft1MaldonadoHard15Soft/Hard1/15
54AlguersuariHard3BarrichelloHard18Hard/Hard3/18
55PĆ©rez Soft7PetrovHard13Soft/Hard7/13
55HeidfeldSoft4KobayashiSoft10Soft/Soft4/10
56HeidfeldSoft5PetrovHard14Soft/Hard5/14
57KobayashiSoft12PetrovHard15Soft/Hard12/15
60HeidfeldSoft9PĆ©rez Soft12Soft/Soft9/12
63SutilSoft14BuemiHard20Soft/Hard14/20
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
Strategy-wise, the only reason to run the Hard would be to save yourself a pitstop (perhaps even two) - you are always going to be vulnerable on track to those running a faster, less durable tyre, but would hope to make those positions back when your rivals hit the pits.

Unfortunately when the Hard tyres are up to 2s per lap slower, there's no way that making fewer pitstops can outweigh the performance disadvantage. On a 60-lap race, if you want to save 30s in the pitlane you need your tyres to be no more than 0.5s/lap slower than the opposition.
 

FB

Not my cup of cake
Valued Member
I wonder if anyone will do what Vettel did in Italy last year and pit 1 or 2 laps from the end of a race just to conform to the FIA "two compound" requirement? S'pose this means they need to keep enough of the softer compound to go most of the race distance and as they burn these in qualie it might not be possible.
 

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
I wonder if anyone will do what Vettel did in Italy last year and pit 1 or 2 laps from the end of a race just to conform to the FIA "two compound" requirement? S'pose this means they need to keep enough of the softer compound to go most of the race distance and as they burn these in qualie it might not be possible.

Pirelli probably have a "combust" button in their motorhome brand centre to prevent such a thing from happening!
 

f1fansp

Points Scorer
I wonder if anyone will do what Vettel did in Italy last year and pit 1 or 2 laps from the end of a race just to conform to the FIA "two compound" requirement?

That's the crucial difference between the Pirelli and Bridgestone tyres; last year, degradation was minimal, so the reducing fuel loads meant decreasing lap times, affording Vettel the choice to keep running the same tyre. This year, times are essentially static during thr working phase of the tyre, simplistically due to decreasing fuel load being counteracted by degradation.

Unfortunately when the Hard tyres are up to 2s per lap slower, there's no way that making fewer pitstops can outweigh the performance disadvantage. On a 60-lap race, if you want to save 30s in the pitlane you need your tyres to be no more than 0.5s/lap slower than the opposition.

Although, if over a 60 lap race driver A goes for 3 stops (lap 15/30/45 using Option/Option/Option/Prime) and driver B goes for 2 stops (laps 20/40 using Option/Option/Prime), driver B is only on the less favoured tyres for 5 laps extra, meaning a 10s loss if it's 2s/lap vs a 20-30s pitstop (granted I've ignored the fact that he's on used tyres for an extra 5 laps each stint).

I think you need a decent step in performance between Option and Prime of >1s to give drivers/teams the ability to use different strategies.

One thing that has been making the Primes a necessary punishment thusfar (barring Monaco) is that they don't seem to last much longer than the Options.
 

Galahad

Not a Moderator
Valued Member
True, but personally I'd like to see Option/Prime/Prime become a genuine possibility.

I guess you can't have it all, and what we have now is still an improvement on the past.
 
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