Pastor Maldonado

Courtesy of Planet F1 and Tranquility's post in the Belgian PQR thread here's a place to discuss the Williams' No.2

"Is Pastor Maldonado the scariest man in sport? His post-Spa interview was delivered with a stare that could put a weak-hearted man six foot under from a distance of ten yards and culminated in the remarkable, utterly-terrifying announcement that he regards Lewis Hamilton as "a really good friend."

Jeepers.

Just jeepers.

Fear and pray for his enemies."

Pastor started his racing career in Italy in the Formula Renault and F3000. He would have been Formula Renault 3.5 Champion if he hadn't been disqualified from a win at Misano in 2006. Moving on to GP2 Pastor raced for 4 seasons, eventually taking the title in 2010.

With not insubstantial financial backing from Venezuela's national petroleum company, PDVSA, he took Nico Hulkenberg's seat at Williams for 2011 winning his first point last weekend in Belgium.

On a personal level, he is a self proclaimed Socialist and a personal friend of controversial Venezuelan leader Hugo Chavez, which probably explains the backing from PDVSA.... Oh, and he's 26 and is still wearing braces on his teeth.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

You have to view incidents in isolation but you also have to make note of repeat offences. In burglary, assualt and taking and driving away, providing that the crime is not extremely serious an offender is given the benefit of the doubt if they have no previous. It is because in court it could be argued that the actions were out of character. Second time round and the police and courts will throw the book at you. I know this, having been the victim of a pretty bad assault which left me with concussion for a week and a very lumpy head (which had been repeatedly stamped on whilst unconscious) and I actually agree with the way it was handled. They let the guy go with a caution. It took me a while to come round to this way of thinking but as much as the guy could have ruined my life he could potentially have ruined his own. As it turns out we both got another chance. Me to be a fully operational human and him to mend his ways.

There are also such things as suspended sentences, which illustrate the same point. Maldonado should be clean out of chances by now, in my opinion.

 

[Vortex]

Oh get a grip people. Maldonado’s driving in Valencia was fine, in fact better than fine, up till that point it was great, he was having a fantastic race after a fantastic qualifying, completely overshadowing his team mate and could and should have had another podium.

Maldonado’s driving in Valencia was not dangerous, that's just a complete and unfair biased exaggeration based on past mistakes or stupidity (or the fact it was Hamilton it took out). Grosjean made the exact same overtake on the exact same driver (Hamilton) on lap 10 the only difference being Hamilton left more room that time, not much mind but enough. This time Maldonado was forced all 4 wheels off the circuit and the mistake on his part was made trying to rejoin without cutting the corner and going over what looked like speed bumps. I wouldn’t be surprised if he had under steer at that moment too as the kerb was right down the centre of his car.
Hamilton’s tyres were totally shot and had just been overtaken by Raikkonen on the previous lap too so was desperately trying to keep others behind for the two remaining laps, and rightly so, its entertaining but risky.

In hindsight I bet Maldonado wished he’d backed off instead of trying to hold the inside line or Hamilton wished he’d left more room on the left hander for Maldonado to slip through, but hindsight’s a wonderful thing and this all happened in a split moments decision where you don’t get time to have a committee meeting about your next move.

 

[Josh]

Viscount In that video that lewymp4 posted that is Maldonado crashing during a red flag in a training session. The link you posted is the crash F1ang-o was talking about though

 

[GeoffP]

Maldonado would not have made it halfway to F1 if he was as psychotic as some of us, myself included at times, are making out.

At the Australian GP I was impressed with the way he seemed to throw himself off the circuit in order not to hit Alonso who was struggling on fading tyres, but couldn't hide from the fact that it was a serious error in judgement committing himself so strongly behind an unpredictable car on a bend.

However, during Sunday's incident he was all four wheels off the track, on the far side of the circuit markers and had the steering on hard right lock. He was either completely out of control in a car that was essentially stable, or the red mist had descended and he was sub-conciously pointing back at Lewis to attack, maybe expecting Lewis to be driving away with full traction.

You know, I don't really care what the story was, it happened, he's either a liability or a maniac in those circumstances and needs to accept they are happening and address them.

The point is, he doesn't need to air this in public, just solve it. But his competitors and the F1 fans do need to see ever stricter application of the rules on this kind of repeat behaviour as encouragement to resolve, and if he doesn't turn the corner soon then he must get a warning from the Stewards that he is risking his right to race.

 

[Vortex]

on the far side of the circuit markers and had the steering on hard right lock. He was either completely out of control in a car that was essentially stable, or the red mist had descended and he was sub-conciously pointing back at Lewis to attack

Sorry GeoffP but I don’t agree with your version of events, Maldonado was turning right when he was in the right hand corner and trying to get back onto the track ofcourse, but when he was in the left hand corner he was trying to turn left for other than a split seconds counter steer moment at impact. Someone on here posted a picture conveniently at Maldonado’s counter steer moment warping the truth creating the illusion Maldonado was deliberately turning right into Hamilton which some people seem to have fallen for but watch the in car view again. Maldonado was clearly trying to turn left and I believe was possibly under steering on the kerb too.

 

[Porceliamone]

Individual still images capture TINY moments in time and are therfore never representative of a sequence of events when in full motion. Watching the entire moving image indicates several sawwing motions at the wheel by Maldonado just before impact.

Regardless - he still had no control over the kerb whether the steering wheel was pointing left or right. He should never have been there in the first place.

 

[Viscount]

Josh It's definitely not Maldonado crashing in that clip, it was Stefano Proetto crashing at Zolder in 2005.

http://forumserver.zapto.org/NAR/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1161&start=0

Alx Danielsson has been confirmed as suffering a broken ankle in the accident which ended first qualifying for the World Series by Renault event at Zolder.

The Swede was involved in what turned out to be a three-car crash after he hit a Colin Fleming's car in the closing minutes of the session. Danielsson was unsighted immediately before the incident, which occurred when Fleming's car rolled to a halt at the side of the track and the Swede, off-line to allow a faster car to pass, was unable to avoid it.

However, the biggest impact occurred when Stefano Proetto arrived and cannoned into the already stranded cars.

 

[GeoffP]

Vortex I guess we'll have to agree to disagree - in all the footage one thing seems very clear to me - Maldonado did not lose control, just found Hamilton inconveniently positioned.

Since Hamilton had the racing line and Monaldo was off the circuit on a smoothe(ish?) course there are limited alternative choices.

You are obviously correct that Maldonado did not choose to hit Hamilton, but the jury's out on how he casused it to happen.

 

[ExtremeNinja]

Yep. The still-frame with him turning right is very misleading. I suspect he is straightening the car out. F1 cars don't necessarily go where the steering wheel is pointing when you have such a large amount of horsepower at the rear wheels.

That said, He did rejoin the track at a place where it was occupied by another car and that was clearly a choice rather than an inevitability.

 

[KekeTheKing]

and the mistake on his part was made trying to rejoin

You nailed this part of your post Vortex

There isn't a driver in Formula One (excluding Maldo) that doesn't realize that you simply WILL NOT make the turn if you go clambering over the curb. It's down to physics. If your surfing on the curb, you cannot turn the car. Why this knucklehead thought he could make the corner with a car ahead of him already in the apex is beyond me.

You only need to watch one race from the Onboard feed to realize just how often these guys back out of moves. Pastor's antics are about as clumsy as it gets in F1. Bounding over the curb will only ever lead to one outcome. And you seem to know it. Why should that be forgiven?

 

[Mephistopheles]

Pastor made a mistake it happens especially with young drivers to start slagging him off and saying he shouldn't be in F1 is ridiculous, if you are going to use that logic then you would have to apply it to all drivers after all just how many drivers has Lewis crashed into in his F1 career? There must be dozens of incidents that were entirely his fault and quite a few of them happened only last year, why aren't you saying Lewis should be banned from F1.

I think people should put these incidents into perspective and look at the whole picture, before starting out on a witch hunt..

 

[ExtremeNinja]

Mainly because Lewis doesn't go round using his car as battering ram. It was hard to defend Lewis' driving last year and, for the most part, I did the opposite. He has made some over opportunistic moves but I've never seen him do anything malicious or that couldn't be passed off as slightly overzealous racing.

This is in contrast to Maldonado, who incidentally this discussion is about, whose antics and disregard for safety, for his competitors and the rules has been evident on a number of occasions. These are repetitive events and are clear cut. Anyway, the stewards have made their decision, like it or not. All that is left for us to do now is to look to the future, so let's do that.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Yes that fine by me..

 

[KekeTheKing]

Mephistopheles

Only one car has ever retired due to contact with Lewis. That's 1 in 97 GP.

Maldonado's going on four this season. And he had a couple last year. That's at least 6 in 27 GP.

No comparison whatsoever.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Really, I don't believe that, but I'm not getting into that on here...

 

[Il_leone]

20 second penalty for knocking out another driver is somewhat lenient

a DQ would have sent out the message if you are off the track then you better not T- BOne the other driver

 

[KekeTheKing]

I find it hard to believe myself sometimes Mephistopheles

The guy who has taken more shit than anybody in Formula One for being "overly aggressive and reckless" has a nearly spotless record when it comes to actually taking people out. Lewis has been pilloried for years without causing a single high profile incident (He doesn't clash with top drivers). His lone "punt" was when Maldonado (surprise, surprise) decided to close the door after the horse had already bolted. It's seriously embarrassing when people claim he's had "dozens" of incidents over the years. They're letting their blind dislike for the man cloud what has actually transpired in real life. I will recognize the Canada 08 incident as well, but that was not while racing. It was a terrible mistake caused by some strange circumstances, but it had nothing to do with undue aggression on the circuit.

In 2012 alone, we have Pastor Maldonado;

1) diving up the inside at Australia and breaking Grosjeans suspension
2) chopping up Perez which knocked him out of Qualifying at Monaco
3) forgetting to brake into Ste. Devote and smashing de la Rosa out of the race
4) disregarding track limits and curbing, punting Hamilton out of the GP

But hey, I wouldn't want to get into it either if I was so blatantly off base...

 

[Josh]

Josh It's definitely not Maldonado crashing in that clip, it was Stefano Proetto crashing at Zolder in 2005.

http://forumserver.zapto.org/NAR/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1161&start=0

What the commentator says (I'm Dutch) is that it already "went wrong a day before, during the a training session when Pastor Maldonado crashed blablabla". So I'm guessing that was broadcast after the incident in qualifying

 

[Mephistopheles]

Okay but these incidents don't only happen to one driver lets forget Lewis for the moment how about Romain he has taken Schumacher out twice this year and has had several start incidents since his return to F1 and yet nobody is shouting the odds about his driving quite the opposite in fact.

I'm not a Pastor fan but I honestly think that all this hang him from the nearest tree stuff is simply being shouted because it was Lewis he took out and for no other reason.

Even Whitmarsh says Lewis should have let him past, his tyres were finished and the best he could have expected out of the race was probably 6th place, if you want to blame someone blame the team for not pitting him for new tyres, they should have pitted Jenson as well in the last laps he was 4 seconds a lap off the pace Lewis himself said it was like trying to drive on flat rear tyres....

 

[GeoffP]

Maldonado has been punished this season for deliberately hitting Hamilton and Perez.

OK so this one was an accident - wasn't it?