Head To Head Nico Rosberg vs Lewis Hamilton

[cider_and_toast]

I can think of no other sport in the world where team mates are supposed to work together and yet at the same time compete with each other for an indivdual title. Perhaps the closest is road cycling but even then, most pro cycle teams have selected the rider they think will have the best chance of winning and the remainder of the team are there to support him.

I don't know if Mercedes race strategy is contrived, covertly or overtly. Having the advantage of not giving the fury crack of a rats bum which of their two drivers wins the world title helps in that respect. At the end of the day, until someone, somewhere, please....... is able to step up and push the Mercedes cars, they are free to run around at the head of the field doing what ever the hell they like. A cynic would say that Austria is currently the closest that Mercedes have to a home GP given that Germany is now off the list so having a German driver win would do nicely. Some might say that Hamilton just doesn't like the track and can't get on with it, after all, he wasn't running well all weekend. The constructors trophy may just as well have Mercedes engraved on it now to save time.

 

[sobriety]

What's the earliest Mercedes can win the constructors? Hopefully they'll get it wrapped up and the gloves can come off for the drivers championship.

 

[Brogan]

I think Japan would be the earliest if Mercedes were to finish 1-2 and Ferrari 3-4 at the next 6 races.

 

[Il_leone]

cider_and_toast You do get it sometimes in Athletics in distance running ... the African nations runners seems to all work together to break the opposition then they concentrate on their own race near the end

Pro cycling there is a lot of animosity between riders as only one can claim glory whilst the others could not within the same team like Armstrong and COntador and Froome and Wiggins.

MotoGP to much lesser extent because they don't talk about constructors or manufacturer's title as much

Yes the team concept is flawed. I'd very much doubt Senna or Prost would have been happy with the tactics employed

 

[FB]

The rules Merc have imposed on their drivers appear to be fairly transparent and seem pretty fair to me. Both appear to get any and all upgrades at the same time, both have to use the same tyre strategy in qualie, whoever is leading the race gets first call on pit stop strategy. It would appear that there is some discrepancy in drivers personal preference on things like the clutch and brakes where the team makes the choice, although Lewis did have a couple of incidents when using his preferred options on brakes last year so you can understand why the team insisted on one supplier over another.

The issue about controlling the "launch" and programming of the clutch bite and revs just does my nut in. These things appear to have about as much driver input as a roller coaster these days. I'm sure barrelling through a corner at 3 or 4 G is physically demanding but I can get that at Disneyland.

 

[sobriety]

I think Japan would be the earliest

Well that would at least give us 5 proper races between them, here's hoping...

 

[Brogan]

What makes you believe they haven't been "proper races" so far?

I'm with FB - as far as I can tell, both drivers are treated equally and there is no bias nor favouritism from the team, meaning races are won or lost based on the drivers themselves*.



* Other than when Mercedes screw up.

 

[cider_and_toast]

I agree.

Mercedes can't win, they're buggered if they try and keep it equal, they're given grief for not favouring one driver over another.

I still think on a normal race weekend, Hamilton is the quicker of the two but it appears that I may have underestimated Rosberg's title chances. The real issue sits in the fact that there's no one able to challenge the Mercs and force the team on to the back foot.

 

[Il_leone]

Brogan - I remember there was always a supposedly conspiracy at Mclaren when Button managed to beat Hamilton or Button is crap when Hamilton beat him when the same topic was discussed that they were given equal treatment


Yes other than the Monaco screwjob the championship position reflects the gulf between the two drivers

cider_and_toast Why should Mercedes favour one driver over the other ? The opposition are not consistently putting up a stern challenge. They are not Ferrari who always look after driver No 1 even when there is no competition

 

[cider_and_toast]

Il_leone I'm not saying they should. Far from it. There are though, some people who say they should favour the driver most likely to win the title at certain points of the season. We had all the talk last year of the team supporting Hamilton more in the wake of the Spa incident etc.

I think they have tried to the point of near OCD to ensure that things within the team have remained fair and even. I don't envy the job they've had to do.

 

[Il_leone]

cider_and_toast

Spa last year that was Rosberg's fault so it would have made Nico feel small and suddenly momentum shifted to Hamilton

I think the win in Spain was critical for Rosberg's mindset because I could see Mercedes wanting to favour one driver then but the situation has changed from Monaco and last Sunday where it is a battle between the two Merc drivers

Mercedes have generally employed open and fair racing amongst its drivers

 

[cider_and_toast]

Il_leone that's my point, Mercedes have strived to ensure equal racing between their drivers but they face accusations of favouritism, bias or criticism for not favouring a driver, which ever way they try and run things. You've said yoursel in your post above that you could see Mercedes wanting to favour one driver after just four races into the season. I would ask you the same question, why? As has been proven, and with my bold statement in the run up to the Austrian GP, Rosberg is, on certain days on certain tracks, more than able to beat Hamilton. I still think there are fewer of those days and tracks than Hamilton has in the bank to beat Rosberg on.

I see no need for Mercedes to change their current policy. As long as Rosberg and Hamilton continue to bank points, take wins and podiums and run well clear of the chasing Ferrari's.

 

[Il_leone]

the team concept is always flawed in F1 because a driver is always measured by the results he delivers against his teammate

 

[sobriety]

I guess what I meant was races with no lead driver pit prioity/sharing of information (yes I know at least half of that is wishful thinking). I'm kinda hoping they put a wall up...

 

[Il_leone]

cider_and_toast I much prefer the way Mercedes do things currently and let the drivers race each other. I always feel aggrieved when the team have decided before a race started which driver wins unless you're Eddie Irvine off course who was happy to accept his millions and a Ferrari in return to be No 2

 

[cider_and_toast]

Il_leone

I agree. I've always agreed with the way Mercedes have tried to let their drivers race each other.

 

[snowy]

Mercedes drivers race each other on the Saturday, and into turn one, they rarely race each other after that. It can sometimes appear that they are racing. But because their strategy is planned and manipulated by a single strategist, who is more often than not obsessing about fairness, it is actually a crock of shit.

 

[Il_leone]

maybe then they should what Rossi and Lorenzo do at Yamaha in Moto GP have a divided wall in the garage and their own race strategists

 

[Il_leone]

snowy

That definitely was not the case with Senna and Prost then especially Ayrton who wanted to always prove he was faster

 

[snowy]

maybe then they should what Rossi and Lorenzo do at Yamaha in Moto GP have a divided wall in the garage and their own race strategists

That is exactly what they should do.

The FIA ought to encourage inter-team battles in the top teams, allowing for extra pit crews so both cars in a team can pit simultaneously.