Technical Mercedes GP reinvent F-duct for the Front Wing?

[Galahad]

Wow, a 10 mph gain in a straight line is huge. Yet again, and I shall be tediously repetitive, this is all down to the fact that for some reason that is totally unclear to me, DRS can be used anywhere in qualifying. Can anyone provide any logical explanation?

Yes (apologies to those who've heard it before).

Using DRS in qualifying ensures the teams select a final drive gear ratio that is compatible with the car in DRS-operated mode. If they did not, they would undoubtedly choose a shorter final gear to boost acceleration, this would probably benefit their car overall in the race since DRS will be used seldom, if at all (or at least, unpredictably). So DRS would become much less effective as the cars would be hitting the rev limiter in top gear much earlier on the straight.

 

[Vortex]

Yes I’ve heard that too, but still doesn’t add up to me. If they could use DRS in the zones only it would still be geared perfectly or they’d be bouncing off the limiter all the way through the zones in qually.

 

[Westy]

I agree with Vortex. DRS should be limited all weeked to the DRS zones specified by the FIA. This way the gear ratios can be set at the correct level and take away the dependence on a good DRS system to get a good lap in for qually.

 

[Mezzer]

Yes (apologies to those who've heard it before).

Using DRS in qualifying ensures the teams select a final drive gear ratio that is compatible with the car in DRS-operated mode. If they did not, they would undoubtedly choose a shorter final gear to boost acceleration, this would probably benefit their car overall in the race since DRS will be used seldom, if at all (or at least, unpredictably). So DRS would become much less effective as the cars would be hitting the rev limiter in top gear much earlier on the straight.

Thanks Galahad, I had obviously NOT heard that before. Could it not be argued that DRS should be set in P1/P2 and not allowed in Quali at all, or at best only in the DRS zones, as suggested?

 

[no-FIAt-please]

Thanks Galahad, I had obviously NOT heard that before. Could it not be argued that DRS should be set in P1/P2 and not allowed in Quali at all, or at best only in the DRS zones, as suggested?

What difference does it make? It's just like the teams using the F-duct in 2010, that could only be used where DRS is used now. Also I think many people's objections to DRS is that the defending driver does not have access to it and therefore is it a disadvantage, however in qualifying everyone has access to the device. It's use doesn't bother me in qualifying or in the race much for that matter, the only gripe I have with the system is the way it's implemented (sometimes).

 

[jez101]

Arguably the ducting that runs the length of the car is a "system that uses driver movement as a means of altering the aerodynamic characteristics of the car", and that certainly isn't necessary for the functioning of the DRS.

.

I can't see how ducting using driver movement? The hole leading to the ducts do, but they are part of the drs

 

[Mezzer]

I can't see how ducting using driver movement? The hole leading to the ducts do, but they are part of the drs

I think the argument is that they aren't part of the DRS, they've been added to it. I think its a clever interpretation of the rules, but is clearly not within their spirit. Brawn has stated that it doesn't help them that much, Charlie should call his bluff and ban it and see how hard he cries.

 

[Kewee]

Seems to be a lot of hysteria regarding the Mercedes F-Duct.
A leading F1 journalist has said that Mercedes rear wing activated F-Duct not only gives them a straight line speed advantage but also an advantage through high speed corners. HOW!!!!! It only works in DRS zones. If I can work that out why can't he.

 

[Tacitus]

Seems to be a lot of hysteria regarding the Mercedes F-Duct.
A leading F1 journalist has said that Mercedes rear wing activated F-Duct not only gives them a straight line speed advantage but also an advantage through high speed corners. HOW!!!!! It only works in DRS zones. If I can work that out why can't he.

Sigh, this might help. http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/mercedes-f-duct-front-wing-operated-by-the-rear-wing-drs/

 

[Blog Zbod]

The key is that the FIA draws a distinction between a device's primary function and all its subordinate functions. Lotus' antidive front suspension wasn't banned during the preseason because antidive is illegal, it was banned because the FIA decided its primary benefit was aerodynamic; i.e., controlling front wing height by moderating front suspension squat and extension under braking and acceleration. The operation of the F-Duct wasn't what was banned, it was the method of employment: it was driver-activated, and by means of a control that served no other purpose. As the FIA itself have provided for a driver-operated button to engage the DRS, that function automatically is assumed to be primary. So it is legal for the DRS button also to control any other subordinate functions of the team's choosing, provided the function itself is legal and that specific method of engagement isn't otherwise prohibited by the TR.

Chris Horner is the one doing all the caterwauling about Mercedes' W-Duct. He isn't expecting it to be banned, he's hoping to provoke the FIA into issuing a written clarification as to why it is legal. Once he has that in writing, Horner (and Newey) can proceed with development of the Red Bull countermeasure without fear of one of Dietrick Mateschitz's Berlutis being driven up his bum because he spent extravagantly to develop another aero tweak that will be banned inside of three races.

 

[Kewee]

Sigh, this might help. http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/mercedes-f-duct-front-wing-operated-by-the-rear-wing-drs/

I don't really need the sigh. I understand how the Mercedes system works and the relationship between the rear and front wing, the point I was making was simply that it doesn't work until the DRS is activated and will therefore be of no help on fast corners. I hadn't considered that they are allowed to use it anywhere during qualifying. Humble apologies if that was the reason for your sigh. I would have a guess that if it does give an advantage during qualifying, over and above how it performs during a race the FIA my well change the regulations disallowing its use outside DRS zones during qualifying.

 

[jez101]

I think the argument is that they aren't part of the DRS, they've been added to it. I think its a clever interpretation of the rules, but is clearly not within their spirit. Brawn has stated that it doesn't help them that much, Charlie should call his bluff and ban it and see how hard he cries.

ok, I got it wrong. The holes aren't part of the DRS. They just happen to be behind the piece of the wing that moves when the DRS is activated.

Either way I wish the other teams could just say well done to Mercedes and get on with developing their own versions. I guess it must be difficult to build this in, so they have decided to protest it instead.

 

[RasputinLives]

ok, I got it wrong. The holes aren't part of the DRS. They just happen to be behind the piece of the wing that moves when the DRS is activated.

Either way I wish the other teams could just say well done to Mercedes and get on with developing their own versions. I guess it must be difficult to build this in, so they have decided to protest it instead.

Couldn't agree more Jez and not only should they say well done but have a little giggle that Merc have obviously spent so long devloping that bit of superior technology that they forgot to make the rest of the car match it. Its not exactly helped them has it? Whats the point in gaining 10mph on a straight if your tyres only lasta couple of lpas at a time?

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

ok, I got it wrong. The holes aren't part of the DRS. They just happen to be behind the piece of the wing that moves when the DRS is activated.

Either way I wish the other teams could just say well done to Mercedes and get on with developing their own versions. I guess it must be difficult to build this in, so they have decided to protest it instead.

I'll do it for them. All I'd need would be about five metres of 6mm plastic tubing, an appropriately sized HSS drill bit, a tube of Gripfill and a roll of duct tape. Half an hour per car, job done. Simples!

 

[Mezzer]

Chad, did you go to the Colin Chapman school of engineering?!

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

Chad, did you go to the Colin Chapman school of engineering?!

No, I did an apprenticeship at Bodgett & Skapa Ltd

 

[ExtremeNinja]

No, I did an apprenticeship at Bodgett & Skapa Ltd

Ah, me too. They were called Connem & Leggit back then, though.

 

[Mezzer]

What difference does it make?

The difference it makes is that the qualifying performance is more in line with the race performance.

 

[Viscount]

If it continues to be legal throughout the season, I wonder if anyone will come up with any other innovations that can be activated when the DRS is.

 

[Mezzer]

If it continues to be legal throughout the season, I wonder if anyone will come up with any other innovations that can be activated when the DRS is.

I was thinking the same thing:
Charlie: Ross, that looks very much like a JATO tube to me.
Ross: Charlie, my dear friend, I can easily see how you could think that, but actually its clearly part of the DRS.
Charlie: Ross, it actually says JATO on it, right next to that RAF roundel!
Ross: Again, Charlie, I can easily see how you could be mistaken. However, JATO stands for ... er ... Just Another Tubelike Object. The blue, white and red circles, which I agree are similar to the RAF roundel, are actually ... er ... aerodynamic testing markings. Phew!
Charlie: ...
Ross: ...
Charlie: You said that "Phew" out loud.
Ross: No I didn't.
Charlie: ...
Ross: ...
Charlie: Take. It. Off.
Ross: Absolutely, but first I want to talk to you about Red Bull's exhaust ...