Ask The Apex

[Mephistopheles]

Good point.

 

[FB]

Anyways, what if at the end of the season we had a sort of one-off, non points race with decent amounts of cash on the line for sure, and let F1 drivers race each other in equal cars, like maybe GP2 cars. The location could change every year and it could be a chance to explore new venues as well as let the F1 drivers show who's really quicker in equal machinery.

I give you the M1 Procar Championship from 1979 to 1980:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M1_Procar_Championship

I think the main problem would be that the teams (or their insurers) wouldn't let the drivers take part and I doubt those at the top would run the risk, and embarrassment, of being beaten by some of the lesser lights.

 

[soccerman17]

At the very least we could see how the up and comers compared to some of the young drivers in F1 or even established drivers at the back of the grid. Even if the stars don't come its better than nothing.

EDIT: We could also do something like the BMW M1 Procar Series and have them race in cars nothing like Formula One racecars. Doesn't really give an idea of who is faster in an even car because its so different, but because of that it would be a lot more likely to have the big guns participate.

 

[LifeW12]

Here's a good question:

What was the last F1 year that did not have a team 1-2 finish in a race?

 

[teabagyokel]

- 2005 was the last year the Constructors Champions failed to score a 1-2, although both McLaren and Ferrari did
- 1997 survived to the last race before a 1-2 was recorded

But I have an answer.

1977.

 

[LifeW12]

I was thinking mid 1970's mainly due to frail cars and error prone drivers

 

[teabagyokel]

1997 was very close. It needed Villeneuve's slow down at Jerez to get a one-two there.

 

[Incubus]

LifeW12 Drivers in the 70's any more error-prone than today's?

 

[teabagyokel]

Errors more likely to end in defeat.

 

[Wombcat]

It's not impossible (i'd say it's probable) that Vettel doesn't win a race. The champion not winning a race in the year after his championship has happened before. But has it ever happened that the champion of the previous year didn't win a race, but his teammate has won? I don't think so. Could be another record for Vettel

 

[teabagyokel]

Wombcat - There is one other instance, technically.

Alberto Ascari drove two races in 1954 in a Maserati, who won 2 races. Its a stretch!

So if Vettel doesn't win from now to the end, that is a record.

 

[cider_and_toast]

I was looking at that the other day.

TBY beat me to it.

The only others I could find who came close were Bruce McLaren who managed a best result of 3rd compared to his world champion team mate whose season best result was 4th in 1961 and Carlos Reutemann in 1979 who managed 4 podiums with 2 seconds and 2 thirds compared to Mario Andretti's single 3rd place. A few more have won a race or two but been beaten by their team mates but that's the lot.

 

[teabagyokel]

cider_and_toast - Most notably, of course, Brabham in 1967, Lauda in 1985 and Senna in 1989 whose team-mates won the title. And Raikkonen was bloody close in 2008.

 

[chreden]

This year there are black spots on all of the onboards of Ferrari engine cars (not that you see Marussia or Sauber onboards very often). It seems it only occurs when the driver is on the throttle. I wonder if you could figure out anything useful if you analysed the noise - distribution, frequency, that sort of thing?

It's not much of a question, more thinking out loud.. anyone heard anything about this from tech people?

 

[sushifiesta]

I don't understand what you mean by black spots, but I do believe the teams (or at least the engine manufacturers) analyse the noise from their rivals and can learn quite a lot from it.

 

[chreden]

If you watch an onboard you should be able to see them - here's one. Should be able to see seemingly random black spots appearing on the video. It's easier to see in higher quality videos - by noise I meant this interference.

 

[sushifiesta]

Oh you're literally talking about black spots in the video, I really doubt you could learn anything by analysing that to be honest. I guess there could be some interference coming from the electric recovery systems but I suspect it's more likely to be caused by vibrations etc.

 

[tooncheese]

@chedren, I think it is to do with there not being any turbo housing on the Ferrari engine, compared to the Renault and Mercedes cars. So the Ferrari turbo is spooling at around 125,000 rpm, but there is no 3kg housing protecting the outside world from turbo components flying out, and the rest of the car from the vibrations that sushifiesta alluded to.

That said, I haven't seen it on the Sauber or Marussia, so it could be to do with the packaging of the MGU, but I would have thought that would be the same for all three teams.

 

[chreden]

I've seen it on Sauber and Marussia onboards, so that sounds about right. Kind of hard to find a decent quality onboard but they're out there in the endless sea of rFactor videos.

 

[marksawatsky]

So this isn't really a question but more of an idea, but I don't know where to put it and don't think it deserves its own thread. So if anybody wants to move it make suggestions I won't be offended.

Anyways, what if at the end of the season we had a sort of one-off, non points race with decent amounts of cash on the line for sure, and let F1 drivers race each other in equal cars, like maybe GP2 cars. The location could change every year and it could be a chance to explore new venues as well as let the F1 drivers show who's really quicker in equal machinery.

I had a similar idea where Monaco was a non-points event and there was no post race scrutineering, just prize money. It would be great to see what the Teams would come up with.