Alonso Interview On Hamilton And Vettel

[Mephistopheles]

I would say that if Button was the best driver, then in the second best car he should have almost matched, or even beaten Seb in the best car

He did non of this in fact he was not even able to get a pole whereas his team mate did, and won an equal amount of races even though he had more dnfs

Would have expected the best driver in F1 to have been much much closer to Seb and quali would be a big part of this

Who said Button was the best driver in F1?

Hamilton's pole came at the expense of race set up, he was nowhere in that race, it was simply a case of McLaren not wanting to let Red Bull have all the poles for the season, and Lewis was their best bet as there is no doubt he is the quickest over a single lap.

 

[Cookinflatsix]

On the occasions the camera went to the McLaren pits during the race, it was full of rappers from the music industry and others from who knows where. I don't think I've ever seen a teams pit area full of so many hangers on, dare I say it, people that Lewis would have loved to impress, but ultimately would have been a huge distraction. Did that contribute to his collision with Jenson? If he was trying to impress his friends by showing his "superior" skills, maybe.

Lewis always drives the same way, no holding back, take track position as soon as possible, I have heard many criticise him for being too 'route one'

Every single time Jenson ends up ahead Lewis has always attempted to take the place as soon as possible (and normally does with impunity) forcing Jenson to dive into the pits or gamble on strategy

This time Jenson stuck him in the wall and then went on to do Alonso also, he finally stopped yielding and asked to be taken seriously

Lewis overtaking to impress some x factor singers?

IMHO thats a little hard to believe

 

[Kewee]

Button looked in his left mirror. Twice.

Doesn't mean he could see him and if he could, was he able to judge his distance and speed? The point I'm making is Jenson wasn't doing the overtaking so it was not his responsibility to second guess what was happening behind him, which is why that basic rule applies. The onus is always on the overtaking driver to complete his pass safely.
A similar rule applies to all of us on the road. Crash into a car from behind then try passing the blame onto the driver of the car you hit. You won't get far. I know its a different situation but the fundamentals are the same, hit a car from behind and it's your fault.

 

[Brogan]

Stats mean nothing without comparing the situation of the individuals concerned, as I'm sure you know.

Indeed.

I was just responding to and disproving the claim.

 

[Mephistopheles]

I know Bro

 

[Brogan]

Crash into a car from behind then try passing the blame onto the driver of the car you hit. You won't get far.

I'm not going to get into a protracted argument with you but Hamilton didn't hit Button from behind.
Button moved across into Hamilton and squeezed him into the wall.

I'm betting that if it was an incident on the road, the driver doing the squeezing may have found themselves in trouble,

 

[Kewee]

Since 2007, in 90 starts Hamilton has scored 1 WDC, 17 wins, 42 podiums, 19 pole positions, 11 fastest laps.

In his whole career, in 208 starts Button has scored 1 WDC, 12 wins, 43 podiums, 7 pole positions, 6 fastest laps.

Brogen I don't mean to be rude but your statistics are the most meaningless I've ever read.
2007 and 2008 were nothing years for Button. He was driving for a team that was being run by a committee in Japan. He wasn't even in a position to do any meaningful development work. After his year with Brawn he then had a settling in year with McLaren and was not that far away from Hamilton, then in his second year with them he was runner-up in the Championship. His results from Brawn on speak for themselves. Based on these more recent years the score is in Buttons favor.

 

[Bill Boddy]

When Hamilton moves over into a driver who has drawn level with him it is because Hamilton cannot see the other driver because of vibration shaking the mirrors. But when Button is in the same position with the added disadvantage that it is pouring down with a large plume of spray he is expected to be able to see exactly where the drivers behind him are.

Does this imply that Button has Superman vision?

 

[Mephistopheles]

Lewis always drives the same way, no holding back, take track position as soon as possible, I have heard many criticise him for being too 'route one'

Every single time Jenson ends up ahead Lewis has always attempted to take the place as soon as possible (and normally does with impunity) forcing Jenson to dive into the pits or gamble on strategy

This time Jenson stuck him in the wall and then went on to do Alonso also, he finally stopped yielding and asked to be taken seriously

Lewis overtaking to impress some x factor singers?

IMHO thats a little hard to believe

That is compete nonsense cook think back to Hungary! who was forced into the pits there?

They have only made contact once and Lewis came of worse get over it I have..

I like Lewis but he had more contact with other drivers as an individual than anyone else last season.

And in Canada neither Lewis or Alonso blamed Jenson for their retirements neither did the stewards or commentators or anyone else that wasn't a devout Lewis fan.

 

[Mephistopheles]

Brogen I don't mean to be rude but your statistics are the most meaningless I've ever read.
2007 and 2008 were nothing years for Button. He was driving for a team that was being run by a committee in Japan. He wasn't even in a position to do any meaningful development work. After his year with Brawn he then had a settling in year with McLaren and was not that far away from Hamilton, then in his second year with them he was runner-up in the Championship. His results from Brawn on speak for themselves. Based on these more recent years the score is in Buttons favor.

Brogan knows this I already pointed it out and I was wrong to do so..

 

[Kewee]

I'm not going to get into a protracted argument with you but Hamilton didn't hit Button from behind.
Button moved across into Hamilton and squeezed him into the wall.

I'm betting that if it was an incident on the road, the driver doing the squeezing may have found themselves in trouble,

I'm not arguing Brogen but your still missing the point. Hamilton was the overtaking driver and needed to allow for the conditions and the fact that Button may not have been able to judge his distance or speed. He didn't but should have. I'll say it again, the onus was on Lewis. Don't forget Button needed to concentrate on what was in front of him also, as did all the drivers. Surely your not suggesting Button intentionally squeezed him into the wall. Why would he, especially so early in the race, if at all. That type of aggression has never been a part of his style. A bit odd for people to suggest that when they're usually accusing him of not being aggressive enough.

 

[Mephistopheles]

I'm not going to get into a protracted argument with you but Hamilton didn't hit Button from behind.
Button moved across into Hamilton and squeezed him into the wall.

I'm betting that if it was an incident on the road, the driver doing the squeezing may have found themselves in trouble,

Sorry bro I don't agree Button took the racing line as could be seen from Schumacher who was in front, and why are we discussing this?

Road rules state that the driver behind is usually in the wrong.

It was pissing down with rain!!

 

[Mephistopheles]

Lets not get all Lewis v Button over this, I hate that shit..

 

[Brogan]

Brogen I don't mean to be rude but your statistics are the most meaningless I've ever read.

Perhaps you should think before posting then.

You said, and I quote:

Whether one's better than the other will be judged by results they achieve since Lewis came into the sport and they've both been on track competing at the same time. At present the scores in Jensons favor.

I merely pointed out how your summation of the situation was inaccurate.

If you want to take it over the last two years instead:
Hamilton: wins 6, podiums 15, poles 2, fastest laps 8
Button: wins 5, podiums 19, poles 0, fastest laps 4

Whichever way you look at it, your claim that "At present the scores in Jensons favor." is incorrect.

Based on these more recent years the score is in Buttons favor.

Not if it's just when both drivers driving for McLaren it isn't, as I have proven.

If you're going to include Button's championship winning year then you also need to include Hamilton's championship winning year.
Anything else would just be selective criteria and inaccurate.

 

[Kewee]

Lets not get all Lewis v Button over this, I hate that shit..

But I was just starting to have fun! Whoops too much popcorn.

 

[johnnoble1990]

I don't understand the arguments many are making here. Lewis was better in 2010, Jenson much better in 2011, but if you had to put even money on one for 2012 it'll surely have to be Hamilton? It is not a slight on Jenson. The gap isn't that big, but people seem to have forgotten everything that happened prior to 2011.

*sorry to Mephistopheles. Didn't see your post.

 

[Kewee]

I don't understand the arguments many are making here. Lewis was better in 2010, Jenson much better in 2011, but if you had to put even money on one for 2012 it'll surely have to be Hamilton? It is not a slight on Jenson. The gap isn't that big, but people seem to have forgotten everything that happened prior to 2011.

*sorry to Mephistopheles. Didn't see your post.

None of us understand anything, haven't you worked that out yet.

 

[no-FIAt-please]

Way I see it is the incident in Canada was 50/50, Hamilton was unfortunate in the situation while Button was fortunate but they were both to blame.

As for comparing them, does it not make the most sense to compare them in the 2 seasons they have spent in the same machinery? Hamilton has scored 667 points during those 2 seasons, Button scored 684. Statistically Button has performed slightly better than Hamilton since 2010. However other factors such as reliability and being taken out by no fault of their own come into account, hence can we not just judge that these are two excellent drivers and is little to choose between them.

 

[Cookinflatsix]

Don't forget Button needed to concentrate on what was in front of him also, as did all the drivers. Surely your not suggesting Button intentionally squeezed him into the wall. Why would he, especially so early in the race, if at all. That type of aggression has never been a part of his style. .

He wasn't concentrating so hard that he forgot to look in the mirror, we saw him look in the mirror and then act

That type of aggression wasn't in his style, neither was standing up to Lewis and Alonso instead of holding back and cruising and collecting

This point was fundamental in Buttons season and set the path to beating Hamilton and Alonso

He had a good car and made the best out of it, he surprised a lot of people, the question is whether he can beat Lewis when Lewis is not merged with the wall or having other problems, wether he can beat Alonso if Alonso has a good car and no problems

 

[snowy]

I wish I hadn't mentioned it now...