2020 Silly Season

RasputinLives

So Goodbye Yellow Brick Road
Contributor
Again I'll say it. We've seen Vettel frustrated and angry. He doesn't look like that out of the car this season. He just looks bored.
 

siffert_fan

Too old to watch the Asian races live.
Contributor
I really find the double standards applied to Vettel vs Hamilton interesting.

The idea that Vettel COULD have lost to a teammate outweighs Hamilton ACTUALLY losing to 2 teammates. Vettel winning titles in a dominant car tarnishes his titles, while Hamilton winning more titles in an even MORE dominant one does not.

Claims that Vettel must win another title to prove he can win a title in a non-dominant car, while the same isn't said of Hamilton.

Amazing how one's likes and dislikes changes people's perceptions.
 

Ruslan

Podium Finisher
Hamilton has teamed with three world champions at the height of their ability (Alonso, Button and Rosberg) and has matched or outperformed them. There is no doubt that he is truly a top driver.
Let me just back this statement up with some data:

Hamilton vs Alonso

...............Qual.....On Track.....Points..........Wins.....Poles.....FL
2007.....9-8.........6-9...............109-109.....4-4.......6-2........2-3

Hamilton vs Button

...............Qual.....On Track.....Points..........Wins.....Poles.....FL
2010......14-5.....10-3..............240-214.......3-2.......1-0........5-1
2011......13-6.......7-7...............227-270.....3-3.......1-0.......3-3
2012......17-3.......7-3...............190-188........4-3.......7-1......1-2
Total......44-14....24-13...........657-672......10-8......9-1......9-6

Hamilton vs Rosberg

...............Qual.....On Track.....Points...........Wins.......Poles.....FL
2013......11-8.......7-8...............189-171.......1-2..........5-3.........1-0
2014.......7-12....10-4...............384-317.......11-5.......7-11.......7-5
2015......12-7.....10-6...............381-322.......10-6......11-7........8-5
2016......12-9.....10-9...............380-385.....10-9......12-8........3-6
Total......42-36...37-27..........1334-1195....32-22...35-29...19-16

All three opponents were world champions at the top of their game. He has spent eight seasons racing against three different world champions. This is probably some kind of record.
 
Hamilton vs Rosberg

...............Qual.....On Track.....Points...........Wins.......Poles.....FL
2013......11-8.......7-8...............189-171.......1-2..........5-3.........1-0
2014.......7-12....10-4...............384-317.......11-5.......7-11.......7-5
2015......12-7.....10-6...............381-322.......10-6......11-7........8-5
2016......12-9.....10-9...............380-385.....10-9......12-8........3-6
Total......42-36...37-27..........1334-1195....32-22...35-29...19-16

All three opponents were world champions at the top of their game. He has spent eight seasons racing against three different world champions. This is probably some kind of record.
I think that Hamilton is a better driver than Rosberg but after Spa 2014 Rosberg was put in a very difficult position by his team, IMHO Rosberg deserved to be WDC in 2014. In 2015 Rosberg was a broken man because IMHO he was treated really unfairly. So factoring in such circumstances the battle between Hamilton and Rosberg from 2013 to 2016 to me looks much more even
 

Izumi

Banned
I really find the double standards applied to Vettel vs Hamilton interesting.

The idea that Vettel COULD have lost to a teammate outweighs Hamilton ACTUALLY losing to 2 teammates. Vettel winning titles in a dominant car tarnishes his titles, while Hamilton winning more titles in an even MORE dominant one does not.

Claims that Vettel must win another title to prove he can win a title in a non-dominant car, while the same isn't said of Hamilton.

Amazing how one's likes and dislikes changes people's perceptions.
Exactly right. Take recent off Hamilton had, smashing his car, yet try to find a single article in which word (his) error would appear, and then compare to Vettel's cases. BBC and others really enjoying to take him down. I also think Seb had enough of it; recently he reall told them what's on his mind.
 
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Ruslan

Podium Finisher
I think that Hamilton is a better driver than Rosberg but after Spa 2014 Rosberg was put in a very difficult position by his team, IMHO Rosberg deserved to be WDC in 2014. In 2015 Rosberg was a broken man because IMHO he was treated really unfairly. So factoring in such circumstances the battle between Hamilton and Rosberg from 2013 to 2016 to me looks much more even
We have this discussion before. Still, re-examining the stats, it really does show just how good Rosberg was. In 2014 he outqualified Hamilton 11 poles to 7! There were parts of each season where he clearly had the edge....but he just could not maintain that edge all year (even in the year he won the championship).
 
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Izumi

Banned
Yeah but Hamilton did his in a practice session - Vettel tends to do his in races
Doesn't matter when, where or why it happens. It doesn't makes much difference for some of those people. Being nasty, rude and not always fair never stopped nasty, rude and unfair individuals.
 

Il_leone

Champion Elect
If anyone has snippets of the Italian press please share the delirium of Le Clerc to the savage condemnation of Vettel
 

Il_leone

Champion Elect
siffert_fan Its not double standards Vettel has always wanted to be the preferred No 1 in the team and the fact is the last 4 years with Kimi has not delivered Ferrari the title and if anything it has made him let his standards slip. He got in a comfort zone and now finds himself in a position he has never been before seriously outperformed by Le Clerc

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RasputinLives Ferrari are the only team in F1 I know that tend to make daft decisions with regards to drivers like sacking Prost because he told the truth in 1991 that the team is a mess. Paying Kimi $50m a year and then dropping him and paying him $28m to be redundant

I know Alonso is a long shot and there are still people at Ferrari who do not like him around. He has snookered himself with the enemies and poison he creates that is no doubt

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Red Bull have 1 seat for 2020 and interesting that Horner said they would consider drivers outside their ranks ..so that could be anyone and no doubt Vettel and Alonso's name would be thrown in but neither are an option unless both take a pay cut . Then they will have to deal with Verstappen who certainly will not respect them

The other thing apparently Vettel has no get out clause like he did with Red Bull in 2014 so what are the odds he might retire or be fired by Ferrari by the end of season if his form is like this

I was not aware but he is 3 pts away from a race ban as well :o
 
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Il_leone

Champion Elect
I just don't see how Vettel can be at Ferrari unless he storms back and takes 2nd in the championship which must be his target now
 

siffert_fan

Too old to watch the Asian races live.
Contributor
Il_leone

Are you saying that Hamilton doesn't insist on being the number 1 in the team? If he doesn't, why did Merc bring on Bottas, a mid-mid-tier driver rather than an upper-mid-tier one like Rosberg? And why did they extend Botta's contract, except for the fact that he made a good doormat for Hamilton?
 

Izumi

Banned
For Izumi?


Merkel in a kimono :)
I don't know what is Angela wearing, but I have seen kimono, and I would not call that a kimono. Funny thing is, Angela has one real doctorate, and 17 (if not more) honorable doctorate degrees bestowed on her by various institutions from Harvard to Leipzig, yet her sense for fashion is lost on me. Michael Schumacher was the same case as "fashionista" when seen in public, which merely offers signs that you could be brilliant in your craft, yet stand outside of mainstream in other aspects of life.
 

F1Brits_90

Race Winner
If anyone has snippets of the Italian press please share the delirium of Le Clerc to the savage condemnation of Vettel
ive put the Italian newspapers on italian gp thread. if you like to see
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a continuation of the hamilton chat Ruslan i get that could be negotiating tactic because if he praises ferrari. then they will most likely just lowball him if he ever decides to join but Lewis says he career would be complete. but he can't seriously say that he saw that with leclerc & not want a piece of that
 

F1Brits_90

Race Winner
I really find the double standards applied to Vettel vs Hamilton interesting.

The idea that Vettel COULD have lost to a teammate outweighs Hamilton ACTUALLY losing to 2 teammates. Vettel winning titles in a dominant car tarnishes his titles, while Hamilton winning more titles in an even MORE dominant one does not.

Claims that Vettel must win another title to prove he can win a title in a non-dominant car, while the same isn't said of Hamilton.

Amazing how one's likes and dislikes changes people's perceptions.
ive mentioned before that vettel is a 4 time world champion so he is judged to a higher standard than everyone bar lewis on that grid, because in historybooks he will be compared to Schumacher, Prost, Fangio & Hamilton. you expect that the elite drivers they can adapt they can be great in every car or different set of that they drive. as the 4 named above have proved or are proving. lewis as mentioned has won a race in every season he has been in F1, be It McLaren or Mercedes, aero or hybrid eras, or cars of 2002-2008, 2009-2013, 2014-16, 2017/18 & 2019 -. he's able to adapt his style & get best the out of the car. Vettel is currently going to be winless in 3 seasons (unfair to count 2007, so didn't) Vettel as is proving he was world class in cars of 2009 - 2013 undoubtedly But F1 isn't a spec series & rules/cars always evolve. you adapt or get left behind. his fellow driver who have won 4 or more world titles Schumacher, Prost, Fangio & Hamilton. shown that. vettel needs too


Are you saying that Hamilton doesn't insist on being the number 1 in the team? If he doesn't, why did Merc bring on Bottas, a mid-mid-tier driver rather than an upper-mid-tier one like Rosberg? And why did they extend Botta's contract, except for the fact that he made a good doormat for Hamilton?
this one because as much as I have berate bottas, he is 2nd in championship with 2 wins 11 podiums & wolff is thinking would ocon be any better than that & if it aint broke don't fix it. Ocon if he impresses at Renault still has a chance later on, talking of contradictions this is Vettel who left when Riccardio was beating him in 2014 & rumoured to demanding Kimi overstayed his welcome at Ferrari in 2017 2018 & privately unhappy Leclerc was given kimi seat for 2019. when everyone sane could see Leclerc had to have that seat
 

Ruslan

Podium Finisher
ive put the Italian newspapers on italian gp thread. if you like to see
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a continuation of the hamilton chat Ruslan i get that could be negotiating tactic because if he praises ferrari. then they will most likely just lowball him if he ever decides to join but Lewis says he career would be complete. but he can't seriously say that he saw that with leclerc & not want a piece of that
Well, I suspect that is part of it. It never hurts the driver to say good things about other teams.
 
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