The Lotus Question

[sportsman]

sportsman,

That looks pretty conclusive on the face of it, so why is it that the fight continues?
If Fernandes knows that he can't use the Team Lotus trademark through non-use, why has he just started using it all over his cars, factory and website a year on from the date of that ruling?
One would think there must be more to it than meets the eye.

Agreed.It looks very odd to say the least.All of my posts on this subject are not my opinion or anyone else's opinion.
They are facts taken directly from the relevant UK Government official websites.
There can be no Bernie intervention or dodgy dealings.

I have absolutely no idea of Fernandes game plan.We will all find out on Monday.

 

[teabagyokel]

I have absolutely no idea of Fernandes game plan.We will all find out on Monday.

I think Fernandes game plan is obvious in reality. Without the Lotus name, Fernandes is afraid that they'll be unable to bring in any sponsors and be sent to the HRT-zone.

Obviously, now 1Malaysia are stuck in a situation where they can't use the Lotus name, but cannot realistically head off and buy the Brabham name either, for example.

As an investor I would see a confident team, much the better of the new teams and ready to challenge STR and the others, but it has to be stressed I don't have enough money to invest in an F1 team.

 

[sportsman]

Fernandes position is far worse than that.If he cannot enter next season as Lotus he will lose something in the order of $60 million in TV rights and appearance money already due to him from FOM. Remember when Honda sold out to Brawn and changed their name.
He can rename the team on the condition that all the other teams agree.
Obviously there is no way that LotusRenault GP would ever agree to him using Lotus in his new name.

Regarding Brabham name out of interest when all of the new teams applied for entry one outfit, forget who tried to use the Brabham name and was vetoed by the Brabham family.
I understand you only chose it just to illustrate a point but interesting bit of info.

 

[FB]

offtopic

What other great names from days of yore could Fernades use?

Vanwall
BRM
Tyrrell
Arrows
Shadow
Surtees
Project 4
Andrea Moda...

 

[sportsman]

I very much doubt that John Surtees OBE would ever agree to that.
I also doubt that Ken Tyrrell's sons would ever allow that

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

Cooper?
ERA?
Forti?
Simtek?

 

[teabagyokel]

I very much doubt that John Surtees OBE would ever agree to that.
I also doubt that Ken Tyrrell's sons would ever allow that

I'm not sure Andrea Moda will be so picky...

 

[fat jez]

I very much doubt that John Surtees OBE would ever agree to that.
I also doubt that Ken Tyrrell's sons would ever allow that

I think FB was being very much tongue in cheek with his suggestion!

 

[sportsman]

offtopic

What other great names from days of yore could Fernades use?

Vanwall
BRM
Tyrrell
Arrows
Shadow
Surtees
Project 4
Andrea Moda...

FB did say great names

 

[JuR3]

Fernandes bought Team Lotus Ventures.ltd from D Hunt, not only rights of the name usage. So that is Team Lotus that raced in 1994. Only problem is that rights have been revoked because not using the name for so long. but now both GL and TL applied for right to use lotus name in F1. And that's it I think, just very simplefied.. There's a lot writen about this on autosport forum
BTW... in Genii Capitals said that Lotus Group dont have any share in renault GP at the moment, so Lotus is ONLY a sponsor.

 

[sportsman]

http://www.genii-capital.com/Genii-Capi ... -and-Media

"The new partnership has been enabled by Renault selling its remaining shares in the team to
Genii Capital. Group Lotus plc will subsequently become a major equity partner in Lotus
Renault GP, which it will co-own with Genii Capital."

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

Perhaps Sportsman, if JuR3 is correct, you have highlighted the wrong words:

"...which it will co-own with Genii Capital."

In any case, the ruling in January last year that you posted earlier relates, if I understand correctly, only to the use of the 'Team Lotus' Trade Mark, not the company itself. Presumably no-one can be barred from using the name of their company, if it is legitimately owned.

 

[JuR3]

http://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/...tm_medium=twitter&utm_source=Nextgen-Auto.com

 

[cider_and_toast]

Well that adds yet another spin on this whole mess.

 

[sportsman]

Thanks JuR3. I had not seen that press report before.

I hope to God that this whole sorry saga is brought to a conclusion on Monday.I don't give a damn who wins or loses.I just want it over.
I checked on the IPO website today regarding the advertised status and if there had been no opposition the decision would have been announced on the 31st December.
Obviously it has been opposed but the time for opposition has now expired so it seem that the IPO have made a decision.

 

[sportsman]

The Lotus court case will go to a full trial on 21st March.

"The row over the use of the Lotus name in Formula 1 will go to a full trial starting on 21 March, a High Court judge decided on Monday.

Mr Justice Peter Smith ruled that the dispute was going on too long and needed a resolution.

He initially said it should be resolved before the F1 season started on 13 March but the two sides eventually agreed to the 21 March date"


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 371721.stm

 

[FB]

Interesting quote on the BBC website:

Aviation tycoon Tony Fernandes said he had rejected a £6m offer to settle the Lotus naming dispute that has embroiled two Formula 1 teams. "Of course I would like to end it but the proposal by Proton would have bankrupted the company. We could not accept it," Fernandes said

Haven't had a chance to serach around for anything to support this.

 

[teabagyokel]

 

[Chad Stewarthill]

Joe Saward's blog on the subject is quite interesting:

http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2011/02/14/rejecting-offers-and-offers-never-made/

 

[sportsman]

Thats from Joe Saward.He is a fervent Fernades supporter.Fernandes said this apparently.True, who the hell knows.

"There was no such thing as an offer," Fernandes told Autosport.com. "There is an understanding that Lotus' involvement with Renault is worth £20 million, which would therefore mean that I was seeking £60 million - which is a complete fabrication. We never got past an initial dinner meeting. Dany Bahar and Riad Asmat [CEO of Team Lotus] met and that was it. No offers were ever exchanged.