Interlagos 2009

[GeoffP]

Re: Yas Marina Circuit is open for business

Both Bernie and the boss of the Yas Marina circuit have said the would "like it" if Jenson didn't win the title in Brazil...... I wonder what's going to happen to his car/penalties he will suffer at the weekend

Worrying isn't it, I would love Jenson to win this weekend, if just to see how he races once the pressure is off. I would love one last race in these cars with no WDC or WCC at stake, I think it would answer a lot of questions.

But for Bernie, maybe it would reduce profit opportunity, but since everyone would expect a genuine race at a sold out track, I can't see that big a difference.

 

[teabagyokel]

Re: Yas Marina Circuit is open for business

Both Bernie and the boss of the Yas Marina circuit have said the would "like it" if Jenson didn't win the title in Brazil

And we've said we'd "like it" if that clown spent his retirement at an Old Folks Home, but life isn't about what we'd like, is it?

I can't see JB winning it this weekend. My prediction:

• Q1: Brawn 1&2; everyone happy
• Q2: Button on the edge, qualifies 13th, blames setup/backmarkers/ghost of Ayrton Senna
• Q3: "Big opportunity for Barrichello" - qualifies 8th. Vettel pole with Hamilton 2nd.
• Start: Hamilton jumps Vettel to lead into turn 1, Romain Grosjean hits someone (probably Kobayashi)
• Button gets into 8th early on with banzai move past Kovalainen at Curva do Sol
• Brawns run 7th/8th for first stint
• Vettel nose-to-tails Hamilton; passes him at first stop; wins race
• Brawn finish 5th/6th after better strategy than (say) Trulli & Alonso.
• Vettel vs Button in Abu Dhabi

That, or something more realistic. Or rain!

 

[Brogan]

Don't forget the Toyota's and their synchronised slowing after being given a backhander

I'd like to see both championships settled this weekend just so we can see some proper racing at Abu Dhabi instead of the percentage game that Jenson has said he's playing at the minute.

P.S. I've moved the last few posts to this thread.

 

[Brogan]

The current forecast looks like it could be a wet one at Interlagos again.

Is that going to favour the Red Bulls over the Brawns?

 

[fat jez]

The current forecast looks like it could be a wet one at Interlagos again.

Is that going to favour the Red Bulls over the Brawns?

Before this season, some of Button's best drives were in the wet - his maiden victory for example.

 

[Brogan]

I meant in terms of the cars more so than the drivers.

Do Brawn still have the supposed cold/wet weather issues they had earlier in the season or have they managed to resolve them now?

 

[fat jez]

I meant in terms of the cars more so than the drivers.

Do Brawn still have the supposed cold/wet weather issues they had earlier in the season or have they managed to resolve them now?

I think they still have problems getting heat into their tyres. Whether that applies to intermediates or full wets, I don't know. Don't intermediates operate at a lower temperature than slicks? Hence people driving through the puddles on drying tracks.

 

[Brogan]

Jenson says he's going to adopt a "cautious" approach to this race.

He will be WDC by Sunday if...

• He finishes 3rd or better OR
• Vettel finishes lower than 2nd and Barrichello finishes lower than 4th OR
• He outscores Barrichello by 4 points

Brawn just need 1 point to become WCC, well a 1/2 point actually if there's another race abandoned.

Not long to go now before Friday P1 starts

 

[BlackCountryBob]

A question for the more technical minds, how much of an advantage will KERS be? I was thinking that with the altitude sapping engine power and the nature of the topography of the track, will KERS be a really huge benefit, even more so than at other tracks?

Will Renault or BMW be bringing back there KERS for the weekend?

 

[Brogan]

According to Williams:

"Interlagos is positioned at a high altitude and has ambient air pressures around 930mbar which causes an 8% reduction in downforce, drag and engine power compared to when we race at circuits at sea level."
http://www.williamsf1.com/news/view/760

And then this from Heikki:

"and using KERS Hybrid – particularly up that long hill out of the final corner – should be a considerable benefit both in qualifying and the race."
http://www.mclaren.com/f1season/2009/brazil/preview.php

So yes, it looks like KERS will be quite useful here.

The reduction in power could be a big problem for Vettel as he is using old engines now, isn't he?

Driver 	AU  	MA  	CN  	BA  	SP  	MO  	TU  	GB  	GE  	HU  	EU  	BE  	IT  	SI  	JP  	BR  	AD

LH 	1 	1 	2 	2 	2 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	7 	7 	7 	  	 

HK 	1 	1 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	7 	7 	7 	  	 

FM/GF 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	4 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	  	 

KR 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	  	 

RK 	1 	2 	3 	3 	4 	4 	4 	5,6 	6 	6 	6 	6 	7 	8 	8 	  	 

NH 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	7 	8,9 	9 	  	 

FA 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	5 	5 	5 	5 	6 	6 	6 	7 	  	 

NP/RG 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	5 	5 	5 	5 	6 	6 	6 	7 	  	 

JT 	1 	2 	2 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	5 	6 	7 	7 	7 	8 	  	 

TG 	1 	2 	2 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	5 	6 	7 	7 	7 	8 	  	 

SB/JA 	1 	1(2) 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	  	 

SBu 	1 	1(2) 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	  	 

MW 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	5 	5 	5 	5 	6,7 	7 	7 	8 	  	 

SV 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	7 	8 	8 	8 	  	 

NR 	1 	2 	2 	3 	4 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	8 	  	 

KN 	1 	2 	2 	2 	3 	3 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	8 	  	 

GF/LI 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	7 	  	 

AS 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	7 	  	 

JB 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	6 	6 	7 	7 	7 	  	 

RB 	1 	2 	2 	3 	3 	3 	4 	4 	5 	5 	5 	6 	7 	7 	7

 

[BlackCountryBob]

I would imagine that Vettel would have more of a power drop off from the older engine but with the lower air pressure the engine should be less likely to go boom than if it were being used at a normal atmospheric pressure track.

 

[fat jez]

I would imagine that Vettel would have more of a power drop off from the older engine but with the lower air pressure the engine should be less likely to go boom than if it were being used at a normal atmospheric pressure track.

if he's had a power drop off, won't his inclination be to rev it harder to try and get the acceleration he is used to? So more chance of it going boom.

 

[GeoffP]

I would imagine that Vettel would have more of a power drop off from the older engine but with the lower air pressure the engine should be less likely to go boom than if it were being used at a normal atmospheric pressure track.

if he's had a power drop off, won't his inclination be to rev it harder to try and get the acceleration he is used to? So more chance of it going boom.

I'm really starting to feel Vettel is merely incidental to the WDC, the bits I've seen about Yas seem to imply there's every chance it's an engine killer, Brogan's chart shows the Vettel's about to start his 4th race on his 8th engine, and Jenson needs four points from two races to beat him.

If there's any threat to Jenson it's coming from Rubens, so my guess is that Jenson playing it safe is going to involve him simply following Rubens around like a lap dog.

So let's hope Rubens is first or second at Interlagos so we can see some genuine racing for a change!

 

[Brogan]

Brogan's chart shows the Vettel's about to start his 4th race on his 8th engine

Don't forget though that he can re-use any one of his 8 engines so he does have some options, although I'm not sure which ones are dead now.

 

[fat jez]

did Vettel have engine 6&7 blow up? I can't remember...

 

[GeoffP]

I can't remember whether it was 5 & 6 that blew or 6 & 7, but I don't think there's a lot of faith in his older engines as Christian Horner was quoted as saying:

“[We’ve had] Four engine failures with Vettel, it’s almost inevitable that we will have an engine penalty somewhere, which is very frustrating,” he told reporters.

So things are still unclear with Vettel, although he's certainly doing rather well with the mind games aspect of setting up the stress for Button. I just don't think Brawn will be taking him too seriously right now.

http://www.itv-f1.com/news_article.aspx?id=46685

 

[GeoffP]

Although I've now found this:

Red Bull, though, has downplayed concerns, saying they believe Vettel's two new engines, together with two already used power units, should see him through to the end of the Championship.

But this will still leave him with two lower power units on two tracks where that will be a noticeable disadvantage.

http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954, ... 98,00.html

 

[fat jez]

Red bull need good points finishes (1-2 I think) to win the WCC (and 2 DNF's each race from Brawn), never mind the WDC, so they may gamble on not turning down the wick on his engines and tell him to go for it - if the engine fails then so be it. It would save them wondering what might have been if he had pushed harder.

 

[Brogan]

Engines and gearboxes are about the only thing I didn't track this year in the various standings and other threads so I'll remedy that for next year.

 

[GeoffP]

Engines and gearboxes are about the only thing I didn't track this year in the various standings and other threads so I'll remedy that for next year.

Should keep you out of trouble