Current Fernando Alonso

Suprised there's no thread (although I had one for his blogs), so i'll start off:

A double world championship vs Raikkonen and then Schumacher in 2005 and 2006 respectively elevated Alonso's status but, apparently, no one told his rookie teammate at his brand new team of a theoretical 'pecking order' the following season ... and the Spaniard was 'seen off' by the young Englishman, Hamilton, into two years of Wilderness while both Hamilton and an even younger Vettel began to make their mark through '08 and '09.

Arguably, Alonso was in the Top 3 of all the Formula One 'Aces' in the 2000s following Hakkinen's retirement - up there with either Schumacher/Raikkonen and, then, Raikkonen/Hamilton - and remains so in the early 2010s along with Hamilton/Vettel...with only Kubica knocking on the door until the Pole's horrible Rallying accident.

A question mark initially over 2004 during which Trulli lead him in the standing until the Italian fell out with ex-manager and team boss Flavio Briatore (Alonso's then business manager) under dubious circumstances after the French Grand Prix.

Another question mark is...Who has progressed more since the end of 2007: Hamilton or Alonso?

A fan. Then came the unfortunate blackmail allegations against McLaren boss Ron Dennis on the morning of the 2007 Hungarian GP which came to light at the highly costly FIA 'Spy-Gate' hearings before Spa...followed by the odour of the deliberate crashing of the Number 2 Renault car at Singapore in 2008 which lead to Alonso finishing 1st in the event and ended in the banning of Briatore and Pat Symmonds a year later.

2009 was a poor year with 'Nando's' mind likely on the prospect of Santander paving the way to better prospects at Maranello one year earlier.

2010 was a fresh start at Ferrari (who no longer had Schumacher walking through the premises regularly) but first half season mistakes ultimately cost him a title inspite of being infamously aided by a Team Orders switch w Massa at Hockenheim (which lead to more world-wide criticism).

Relatively fast, relatively consistent but prone to mistakes and a possible insecurity complex (*) based on wanting sole focus from a team and being only happy with a Number 2 in the other car running behind him. Anything else and it seemingly rattles him.

(*) This is my own personal opinion.

..and so to 2011...

He's underperformed only at Malaysia (hit Hamilton) and China (invisible while Massa challenged McLarens and Red Bulls) and, arguably, Canada...but has maximized his chances in the other 6 races culminating in the British GP win.

He said in his post-Monaco blog that 'Silverstone would be the WDC cut-off'...and so, after some major upgrades, the Ferrari looks a winner again. It might be too late for 2011 given Vettel's finishing rate...but the 2012 regs means they should keep the hammer down at Maranello.

He's signed on through to 2016...So hopes are high of a WDC at some juncture...but not yet.

 

[Incubus]

That's a remarkable statistic but also something of a double-edged thing. I can't remember the last time he was forced to retire by a car failure (Malaysia 2010?). Does that indicate Ferrari have remained over-cautious at the design stage? They might have built an indestructible car but the performance hasn't always been there these past few years has it?

 

[Olivier]

The Minardi thread reminded me of one of Alonso's greatest displays of brilliance. GP of Japan 2001 at Suzuka Circuit. He put in a great qualifying lap and took 18th place, ahead of Thomas Enge's Prost, both Arrows and his own teammate. Then came the race and the only way to described it was as Paul Stoddart put it; "53 laps of qualifying ". A wonderful yet pointless exercise but immensely demonstrative feat that was the prelude of things to come.

 

[Kewee]

That's a remarkable statistic but also something of a double-edged thing. I can't remember the last time he was forced to retire by a car failure (Malaysia 2010?). Does that indicate Ferrari have remained over-cautious at the design stage? They might have built an indestructible car but the performance hasn't always been there these past few years has it?

I think Ferrari deserve far more credit than your giving them. Just a few points. The team underwent numerous personal changes when Schumacher retired. Massa was the only mainstay on the driver front and as much as I like him and despite the fact he very nearly won the championship in 2008, he's not really top draw. Raikkonen was never going to provide the leadership qualities in testing and development that would inspire the team the way Alonso has. Ferrari simply had to play a waiting game before they could bring Alonso into the team. No one should forget that were it not for a terrible tactical decision Alonso would have won his third title in his first year with Ferrari. Last year no one was able to match Red Bull simply because no one optimized the EBD the way Red Bull did. This year Ferrari started the year with a brand new car and was always going to take time to develop it. The position they're in now indicates there's not too much wrong with their design department. They still have a way to go but they've made huge gains and I would suggest they'll make more during the last part of the season. A new car usually reaches it best during it's second year of development so Ferrari should be very strong next year. Alonso has played a huge part in their fortunes since joining them and my guess is he will win the title this year and defend it successfully next year also. 2014 is anyones guess with all the regulation changes.

 

[teabagyokel]

I think Ferrari deserve far more credit than your giving them. Just a few points. The team underwent numerous personal changes when Schumacher retired. [...] Ferrari simply had to play a waiting game before they could bring Alonso into the team.

I believe they won 3 championships (of the 4) from 2 years in 2007-08.

 

[Kewee]

teabagyokel......True, but one of those championships was gifted when McLaren lost all its constructors points. It's also worth remembering that although Ferrari value the constructors championship they value the drivers title even more, hence my comment they were playing a waiting game before they could bring Alonso into the team. Two constructors titles, one gifted, and one drivers title since 2005 is not success in Ferrari's terms. They're hoping for a lot more with Alonso and believe he will deliver.

 

[Galahad]

No one should forget that were it not for a terrible tactical decision Alonso would have won his third title in his first year with Ferrari.

I know events in final races are always seized upon as the reasons for titles being won or lost, but more often you can point to an unforced error somewhere else. In '86 Mansell lost the title in Mexico, not Australia. In 2010 Webber lost it in Korea, not Abu Dhabi, and likewise Alonso's practice crash in Monaco was the most heinous crime of the lot.

Back on topic - Ferrari have been there or thereabouts but probably have underperformed relative to their resources (money and talent). Unfortunately they're always going to be compared to the 2000-05 period, and they can't possibly replicate that degree of dominance. They've tried many times to sign Newey, and he isn't interested. McLaren suffer in a similar way from comparison to the Lauda-Prost-Senna years.

 

[Kewee]

Galahad.....My comment regarding Alonso's near miss needed to be taken in context with the rest of my posting. I was just making the point that statistics don't tell the whole story. Your quite right, Ferrari's period of dominance will be very hard to replicate though they are aiming to dominate again. With their current structure they may get close again and I'm not just referring to Alonso though he will play a major part I'm sure.

 

[teabagyokel]

Kewee - I think Ferrari need more credit than you're giving them. You seem to be giving the entire credit for any Ferrari success since 2010 to Alonso and saying that they were playing a waiting game since 2006. They haven't failed to win a race in any year in the period since 2006, and in 2009 they were caught out by a rule change and the fact that Red Bull, and particularly Honda, had the luxury of completely ignoring 2008. They won more titles in the three "Massa/Raikkonen" years than they will in the first three "Alonso/Massa" years.

 

[Olivier]

An interesting stat: Alonso is the only driver this year who has won a race not starting from the front row.

 

[Kewee]

teabagyokel......You appear to have misunderstood me. I started a previous posting exactly as you did saying people don't give Ferrari enough credit. Maybe you should read what I say more carefully. I have been almost a lone voice on this site from the beginning of the season, pointing out that the new Ferrari would take some time to develop due to the fact they had to find a baseline to work from. While others were criticizing Ferrari I was praising them and it's fair to say, so far I've been proved right.
Where we appear to disagree is on Alonso's importance. All successful teams need a driving force pushing the team forward. Sometimes its the driver, sometimes the designer, and sometimes an inspirational team principle. In Ferraris case there's no doubt that person is Alonso. He shows it in his work ethic off the track and inspirational drives on the track. His efforts inspire the staff back in Italy to push even harder and the results are beginning to show. My comment that Ferrari were playing a waiting game before they could bring Alonso into the team is supported by the fact they continued to pay Raikkonen NOT to race for them so they could bring Alonso into the team a year earlier than intended. I would suggest they got tired of waiting. My belief is Alonso will bring multiple drivers titles to Ferrari before he retires and they'll be titles earned in the factory in Italy as well as on track. I also believe he'll be hungry enough to continue for another five years minimum.

 

[Hamberg]

teabagyokel......All successful teams need a driving force pushing the team forward.

Yes and for Ferrari that's Montezemolo.

They chose Alonso because he has a certain attitude combined with a lot of skill that suits Ferrari the way Schumacher did.

 

[racecub]

I will state up front that this info comes from a Mark Hughes article last week. But that said, I agree with much of it and have thought for a while that the Ferrari is a lot better than they're talking it to be.
Anyway Hughes states that excellent though Alonso's season has been, its nothing to get carried away about and there are other reasons for his championship advantage. I'll try to preci..presie precee(another damn difficult word to spell!!). I'll try to be brief about his ideas.
There is a perception Alonso has transcended the car, but its not bourne out by analysis.
Though Ferrari keep pointing out they dont have the fastest car; They do have the most consistent, and have had since the beginning of the European races,with front running pace in hot, cool, dry, wet and different tyre compounds.
In the 4 early fly away races weather and variable form from competitors allowed Alonso to keep in touch when his car was at a disadvantage. Alonso's performance was no more outstanding than his competitors.
Alonso has been aided by hamilton's fuel and pitstop cock-ups, Kimi throwing away the next best time to hamiltons at Spain,alternator failures in the Renaults and fortuitous safety car(Valencia).
Despite these 'gifts' Hughes acknowledges that Alonso has taken full use of what was offered and put in some brilliant performances. But they alone are not the reason he is leading the championship. Hughes puts his lead down to his excellent driving, a car which suits this mixed up season, inconsistency in competitors,and no threat from his team mate.

 

[RasputinLives]

I think its easy to say someone is only doing well because of this and because of that. As much as his other competitors have on times cocked things up you have to admitt Fernando has always made sure he was in the right place at the right time to profit from it. Very much like he did in his championship years of 05 and 06 and can you think of any errors he's made this season?

Yes if this happened and that has happened then it might be different - but the fact is it hasn't and with the conditions thrown at him Fernando has driven better than everyone else this year and you can see that by the fact he leads the drivers championship.

 

[racecub]

Yes I cant dispute that Fernando has taken every advantage given to him, but he's had the car capable of doing so.I wouldnt say he's driven better than his main competitors.

 

[teabagyokel]

There is a perception Alonso has transcended the car, but its not bourne out by analysis.

The only way Alonso hasn't transcended the car is in the wider sense that no-one has. And, bear in mind his team-mate came within a single point of the title in 2008 besting Kimi Raikkonen in the same car.

He's 40 points clear in the Championship. He's got more than 6 times the points his team-mate has; and his team-mate is not Toranasuke Takagi by any means. There are no whys or wherefores, he's been class.

 

[The Artist.....]

but he's had the car capable of doing so.

This is one of the more spurious posts I've seen on here for a while! This year, the Ferrari has not been the class of the field - and is undoubtedly not in the same class as the Red Bulls... On the whole, I would suggest that, based on overall results, the Ferrari has been the fourth best car... Alonso has, however, taken advantage of circumstances to come out as the winner - in Malaysia and in Valencia, it is extremely hard to argue that Alonso had the machinery to win - yet he still took advantage of circumstances to get the wins! I'm no Alonso fan, but his performance this season has put everyone else in the shade!

 

[racecub]

Its not been the fastest car, but its been the most consistent top runner, which in this mixed up season where consistency pays dividends is a big advantage.It's been thereabouts in all conditions.It certainly isnt fourth. And the ones ahead of it have yo-yoed. One week a mcLaren, then Mclaren are down in 10th or lower, next week a Lotus, then the Lotus have problems.And all the while Ferrari are thereabouts. Im not trying to put Alonso down, he's right up there undoubtedly,and I agree, he's taken advantage of all his opportunities, in fact I said that; but I agree with Mark Hughes, its not as 'all down to Alonso' as it appears.
He drove superbly at Valencia but without the Mclaren pitstop drama, the two renault alternator failures and the lucky safety car, where would he have finished, even with his brilliant drive? 5th or 6th.Would it have been picked out so much then? the drive itself could have been just as brilliant. Malaysia, he certainly didnt have the best machinary, but then it rained. McLaren, red bull and lotus couldnt heat their tyres. Alonso took advantage, but it wasnt a stand out drive.

 

[teabagyokel]

McLaren have had one car in Q3 for every Grand Prix, so I'm not sure when exactly they were 10th or lower, and the same goes for Lotus and Red Bull. Ferrari have had two Grands Prix where neither car has qualified for Q3.

As for Alonso/Ferrari taking advantage of all their opportunities, bluntly they haven't. There was the tactical cock-up that cost them 3 places in Canada, for example.

And if the Ferrari is such a good car, why has Massa struggled so much? Ferrari finished 1st and 16th in Europe and 1st and 12th in Germany. Silverstone aside, Massa has been poor.

In fact, he's been as poor as Fisichella in 2006-07, and as poor as Piquet in 2008-09, and as poor as Grosjean in the dying days of 2009. Yes, thats a selected sample of examples, but a pattern is emerging somewhat in my book...

 

[Olivier]

Ferrari was eight tenths from pole position last race, the car has improved throughout the season so what it has really been consistent from day 1 is Alonso's performance.

 

[Brogan]

And if the Ferrari is such a good car, why has Massa struggled so much?

Because he's not very good?