Felipe Massa

Brilliant driver on his day but is he championship material?

In 2008 he proved he was but thats only one occassion, plus that season the Ferrari TBH was a bit quicker and won more races that season. In 2009 he nearly suffered a career ending head-injury and since coming to back to the grid he hasn't really shown that promise he did in 2008.

Don't get me wrong he's a driver i very much like, but i do wonder if he'll be a title challenger again for Ferrari season in season out or if he'll stay at Ferrari much longer?

Whats your thoughts on Massa?

 

[Slyboogy]

When did Perez qualify in the top 10, then qualify in the shootout with hard tyres?

What I am surprised that no team has done, only Red Bull with Webber in China to an 'extent', is to start with the hard tyres just for a few laps then pit and go on the softs for the rest of the race. Worked for Webber in China, you would be at least 1 second faster than those on the harder compound.

 

[Sarinaide]

When did Perez qualify in the top 10, then qualify in the shootout with hard tyres?

What I am surprised that no team has done, only Red Bull with Webber in China to an 'extent', is to start with the hard tyres just for a few laps then pit and go on the softs for the rest of the race. Worked for Webber in China, you would be at least 1 second faster than those on the harder compound.

I think you misconstrued the post, I said maybe Massa should try start a race on Hards, that would mean getting a lower grid position in the top 10, then start on a long stint up front saving the new(er) soft options for the latter stints. Perez started Valencia on Hard primes and when some said he was going slow, by virtue of using primes in hotter conditions was able to save primes for latter in the race where he made up all the ground. Essentially the point being, try something different.

It seems to be a policy adopted by the challenging teams in the case like Webber was in China where he needed to go longer, I am just saying that maybe Massa must try Q3 on Primes or not run at all in Q3, sometimes starting in the 4th or 4th row is actually good as it gives you the oportunity to react.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

Massa on the World Championship (for 2011):

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/93147

Now...my question to all of you is this: Why would he bother mentioning the championship? It's not if he's going to be the Ferrari title challenger, is it? And so why even talk up the other driver's (Alonso's) chances by implication?

Honestly, Massa should just shut his mouth and try to win some races...and if by any chance he's ahead of Alonso for a race victory then just tell the team to stuff it cause he ain't movin' over!

Yes?

 

[Slyboogy]

It's not his fault that he gets asked these questions is it?

It's true what he says...it isn't over and anyone that isn't mathematically out are in contention.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

...it isn't over and anyone that isn't mathematically out are in contention.

He's 6 entire wins behind Vettel! Even Hunt wasn't that far behind Lauda in 1976!!!

Massa would be better off answering any question like this: "Right now i'm concentrating on winning Grand Prix races. That's the objective. Whatever else happens after that will take care of itself."

At least that way he's implying racing for himself as opposed to talking up the possibility of an Alonso title.

Massa is like a jellyfish now. Webber's got a backbone. Massa needs to take a chapter from Webber's book and think about wins.

 

[Slyboogy]

Massa would be better off answering any question like this: "Right now i'm concentrating on winning Grand Prix races. That's the objective. Whatever else happens after that will take care of itself."

And if he said the above...I am sure he would have got ridiculed.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

And if he said the above...I am sure he would have got ridiculed.

Why? He is a Grand Prix winner for Ferrari. I think he's legitimately won about 10 Grand Prix for Ferrari (against the likes of Schumacher and Raikkonen)...plus he was in line to win the German Grand Prix at Hockenheim (from Alonso) last year...and he was also the lead Ferrari driver in China (ran as high as 2nd I think) and in Canada (also ran as high as 2nd I think) this year. Plus the Ferrari has come good in the last several races, so why shouldn't he be able to win a Grand Prix or two? Alonso's not always going to finish ahead of the guy. The 'Law Of Averages' would suggest that Button outqualifies Hamilton and beats him in some races, Webber outqualifies Vettel/beats him...so it's the same with Felipe and Nando.

I would bet against Alonso finishing ahead of Massa in all 11 of the remaining races. That's not anything to do with me...that's just the Law Of Averages.

 

[Sarinaide]

I really don't know what the big fuss is about Massa, he is a number 2 and slowly starting to realise that. He was brought to Ferrari to replace another Number 2, ala Rubens without any objection, he was then expected to be Kimi's Goose(Top Gun) and somewhat got a inflated reputation due to 2008. Along comes Alonso and only because there is a perception of Alonso being a spoilt don't work hard brat everyone feels sorry for Massa. At the end of the day Massa is not competing for team number 1 with any micky mouse driver, and the fact that he is being easily out done by a more talented team mate is really no crying shame.

I guess you can look at all the teams particularly contenders and deduse from them that there is a defacto number 1 and number 2 driver, as mentioned before, McLaren is the least obvious due to Lewis' more maverick approach over Button's more Ice man approach, the latter is more carefree and less prone to driving error, plus is a good driving strategist. Other than that Webber is being beaten fair and square by Vettel in that Massa is being beaten fair and square by Alonso.

 

[RasputinLives]

Now...my question to all of you is this: Why would he bother mentioning the championship? It's not if he's going to be the Ferrari title challenger, is it? And so why even talk up the other driver's (Alonso's) chances by implication?

I remember people saying the same thing before 2008 - was Ferrari's number 2 then as well wasn't he?

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

I remember people saying the same thing before 2008 - was Ferrari's number 2 then as well wasn't he?

The difference is that they were all within one win of each other. In fact, I think the Top 4 at this stage (Raikkonen, Hamilton, Massa and Kubica) were either tied on points or were within a few points of each other.

Alonso is about 4 wins behind Vettel...and Massa's a further 2 wins behind that. Massa's will need Vettel, Webber, Alonso, Hamilton and Button to completely implode. Not merely one or two guys...but 5 guys!

 

[RasputinLives]

So only drivers who have a realistic chance of winning the championship can talk about it in interviews? Would you be equally as upset if Mark Webber was talking about the championship as we now know he won't be allowed to win it either?

To be honest Ray I'm not sure where the issue is - nowhere in the interview does he say he's going to win the world championship - infact for most of it he's talking about Ferrari's chance of winning the constructors championship and that they still have a chance.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

Ok if you think he's merely talking about the WCC then that's different.

My take on it - and I could be comlpetely off the mark - was that he was talking about the WDC.

Cheers.

 

[Sarinaide]

From what I gathered he seems to infer more about Ferrari coming strong and possibly making a late season charge. If you construe certain passagers by inferance he suggests Alonso more than himself in respect of the WDC.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

If you construe certain passagers by inferance he suggests Alonso...in respect of the WDC.

That's what I did. I'd like Felipe' to be a bit more like Webber and think about himself. He's not selfish enough these days. He's more Nando's DataPig than a proper Grand Prix driver these days.

 

[Sarinaide]

That's what I did. I'd like Felipe' to be a bit more like Webber and think about himself. He's not selfish enough these days. He's more Nando's DataPig than a proper Grand Prix driver these days.

Apart from Germany 2010 he has been somewhat whipped into a state of complience, he cannot beat Alonso, even when he is quick, and is resigned to the fact of what he is, and why he was brought to Ferrari.....to be an aces, wingman.

 

[teabagyokel]

Someone has to do it. He's paid by the team, is he not?

Half the time its about not putting two top drivers together, half the time its about the #2 speeding up!

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

He's paid by the team, is he not? Half the time its about not putting two top drivers together...

Yes but Ferrari have played it badly if they want to win the WDC. Here's why:

They gutted Massa to such an extent that he was virtually invisible after Germany 2010 and wasn't able to take points big points off eventual WDC Vettel. Had he taken points off Vettel at Hungary and Singapore where the Ferrari was fast enough, it would have been different.

This year, Alonso will need Massa to finish in between himself and Vettel to have any hope because if Vettel keeps finishing 2nd, he'll be WDC before they go to Abu Dhabi.

It does Alonso no good to have a Number 2 who's broken and battered. And that's what Ferrari are doing to Massa. Did you see how the Brazilian was left out to hang at Silverstone for his final tyre stop?

 

[teabagyokel]

Ferrari would never win a WDC with a broken and battered Brazilian #2 driver. It is inconceivable.

 

[RayInTorontoCanada]

Ferrari would never win a WDC with a broken and battered Brazilian #2 driver. It is inconceivable.

I don't know if that's sarcasm or not, TBY...

You gotta admit that - failing Vettel DNFs - Alonso needs cars to finish between himself and Vettel. If the McLarens aren't up for it, that means Massa needs to be fast enough to finish ahead of Vettel and shave points from the German. No?

If you destroy Massa's confidence when the car is good enough, he'll be useless at taking positions from Vettel.

 

[Sarinaide]

It switched from "Massa's plight is Alonso" to "Massa's plight is Ferrari". Well for starters Massa joined Ferrari knowingly going to be a number 2, and despite the heroics of 2008 he is quintisentially a number 2 by trade, give him the faster car and first dibs at pit stops and Alonso will still beat him regardless.

Alonso doesn't need Massa to help him win the WDC any more than he needs the other major players to assist, Ferrari do however need Massa to help Alonso if Ferrari are to win the WCC.