Grand Prix 2014 Austrian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

F1 is back In Speilberg, Austria for the first time in 11 years.

The Speilberg race track has a long history in F1. The original track was know as the Osterrelchring. The track was built in 1969 to replace the Zeltweg airfield circuit, and first debuted in F1 in 1970. It was a very fast circuit with every corner a fast sweeping spectacle meaning drivers never had to drop below 3rd gear. However large sections of the track had little run off and some sections including the start finish straight were very narrow. Mark Donohue’s death in 1975 resulted in alterations to the Vost-Hugel Kurve and in 1977 the Hella-Licht chicane was added. After that Allan Prost pushed for larger run off’s rather than more track alterations. These followed in some, but not all corners.

The Osterrelchring was a regular offering until 1987 when the turbo era pushed engine power up to 1400 bhp in quailfying. The speeds achieved approaching the Bosch Kurve were well over 200mph, a corner still with little run off. Other corners were also very fast and the track was considered to be dangerous and having out grown F1’s in its new faster era.

But the real crunch came after two restarts were required in 1987 due to crashes caused by the narrow start finish straight. With the cars now over 6 feet wide, the straight was not wide enough to get much more than 2 cars side by side. F1 had had enough, and Austria was dropped in favour of Budapest.

The track gradually fell into disrepair until the Austrian Telephone Company paid for it’s revamping by Herman Tilke in return for it being renamed the A1-Ring. The A1-Ring returned to the calendar in 1997. Most of the fast corners had gone in favour of 3 tight corners introduced to give more overtaking opportunities. It was also much shorter, down from 3.67 miles too just 2.68 miles. The A1 Ring enjoyed a 7 year run until it was again dropped after 2003.

In 2004 the pit buildings and grandstands were demolished in anticipation of building new facilities. Then the money ran out. This rendered the track unusable for any motorsport. It lay abandoned until Red Bull started 70million Euro renovation works in 2008. The track reopened in 2011 as the renamed Red Bull Ring.

And now we’re back.

We are now past 1/3rd distance in the season. In the Constructors Championship the Mercedes looks more or less unbeatable barring double ERS failures. It seems unlikey anyone will find 1-2 second a lap over them in the next few races in order to amount a challenge. I think it is more likely it will be the end of the season before things close up.

However Mercedes ‘no number 1’ policy is giving us a great battle between Lewis and Nico for the World Drivers Championship. With Nico now 22 points clear following Lewis's 2nd DNF of the year, Lewis really has a challenge on now to catch Rosberg. I'm sure he is hoping for a good luck, bad luck switch with his team mate.

Great to see Dan taking his first win, and with The Red Bull Ring being Red Bulls home track who knows we may see him on the top step again.

Somehow I think this ain't over by a long shot.

Here is the debacle that was 1987.
1987 start 1 crash
1987 start 2 crash
 
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The teams have been told by Charlie Whiting that they must not go out of the lines marked for the pit lane when pitting. Putting the pit lane entry on the fastest curve on the circuit may not have been the brightest idea ever.
 
I've noticed the cars are getting punished for going out wide! Nice to see mistakes are being paid for!
 
There is ne real need for white lines around the circuits, just have the tarmac with slippery grass outside it then more tarmac outside the grass. Then if a driver goes off circuit he loses time but has a fair chance of getting back on.

No grass in the desert? Quicksand should do the job. :D
 
Charlie is trying a different approach to get his message across ... has enlisted a band to play Friday night .... drivers mandatory attendance ...

DD WL.jpg
 
Jorneyman Alonso is fast as he usually is on Fridays and leads the rest of the pack (1 seconds behind the Mercedes' boys). Teammate Raikkonen is 11th.
 
Nico seemed to be very grumpy at the end of P2, and in a very agitated tone with his engineer said, " well tell me the next time." I couldn't understand what he was saying at the begining to his engineer....... What was he complaining about?
 
Having spent the week in a demeaning and frankly embarrassing "employability" course :tumbleweed:(compulsory due to being long term unemployed) I was about to dip into another depression. This is after only just pulling out of the last low! Sky F1 has just saved me as I am currently watching replays of Friday practice.

"How did F1 practice save Fender's?" I hear you ask. Well, having been demoralised and questioning my sanity, skills and abilities :facepalm:, it has been great hearing various people from drivers and engineers to even LMP legend in the making Antony Davidson, reflecting my personal thoughts on the trickiness of the Red Bull Ring. Even having to pretty well reverse my opinion on the Perez/Massa Canada incident - having seen some overhead footage for the first time - thanks to Ted's reporting ( :o ) didn't hurt my feelings about my earlier analysis on that one.

Many thanks also to all the fellow Clip-pers who have hit the "like" button on my analytical posts because seeing those "likes" have been a seriously uplifting boost.

So, replay of P2 has just started and I'll save further comment for later but I can't stop without telling you that I have been scratching my head about how poorly Red Bull fared in P1. The car looks terrible and it's almost as if their whole advantage last season was down to the EBD. What happened to their down-force and traction?

More later. Thanks again fender-fans wherever you are LOL:goodday:
 
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I've just seen this post: http://cliptheapex.com/threads/2014...fying-race-discussion.6852/reply?quote=245201

Windsor's analysis is pretty close to what I was thinking about when I posted this one: http://cliptheapex.com/threads/2014...fying-race-discussion.6876/reply?quote=245675

In my post above this one I said I had changed my mind. However, I don't always concur with PW but I have decided to volte face again as I think he is spot on about the Massa/Perez prang. I think Sergio and his team shot themselves in the foot by stating that he was within his rights to defend his position, since that took the onus off of Massa to admit or accept any responsibility for failing to make adequate space for himself.

The main issue I have with the Stewards decisions is that the braking area referred to in the rule book is not defined. We understand that the penalty decision has been upheld because Perez changed his line in this so called braking area. As very well evidenced in Canada a braking area isn't a distinct zone that is the same for everyone. An overhead shot confirms that Sergio's line did change but, having listened to Windsor and watched it all yet again, it seems to me like he was returning to a reasonable line for the corner.

Hang on ... but he is entitled to do that is he not? Wasn't the rule introduced to prevent "Lewis Hamilton inspired" cunning weaves? When did it get to be about making it easy for the bloke behind to pass without sharing responsibility to take due care and attention? Sorry, I digress ...

Even without the variables thrown in by the effects of ERS, DRS and other gadgets, the characteristics of every car is different due to set ups and driver preferences. Include in the calculations the gizmo's, and the states of the cars and tyres at the time, and the braking distances for two competitors can easily differ by a couple of metres. Just for good measure throw in the weather and variable track conditions and hey presto we have the recipe for disaster.

All this is very relevant to this weekend due to the topographical characteristics of the Red Bull Ring. As I alluded to in an earlier post, braking distances in the steep downhill entries to turns will be a fair bit longer especially on worn tyres than the guys are used to. We have seen throughout P1 and P2 that, as predicted, some teams are struggling to get the set ups right with drivers having a tough time getting their braking right. So, we may well see an incident or two like in Canada where guys on fresher tyres get caught out by chaps on tired or degraded boots braking early.

Thinking back to how Massa and Hamilton were crash magnets a while ago it would not surprise me if Felipe runs into Sergio's rear again on raceday. He didn't learn with Lewis and now, with his own view of the Canada crash supported by the Stewards, he will not have learned from that.
 
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The main issue I have with the Stewards decisions is that the braking area referred to in the rule book is not defined. We understand that the penalty decision has been upheld because Perez changed his line in this so called braking area. As very well evidenced in Canada a braking area isn't a distinct zone that is the same for everyone.
I'd say the braking zone is quite easy to define. If a driver is braking he is in the braking zone. Perez is braking, so he is in the braking zone, so he's supposed to keep his usual line. Which he didn't.
But shouldn't this be in the canadian thread?
 
Quite agree in those terms Wombcat . I was querying a definition in the rule book.

Regarding my placing of the post in this thread, please refer to the last two paragraghs in my post above .
 
What brilliant result. Williams 1-2. So happy for Massa, mojo is back 'for sure'.

Why Lewis didn't do 2 flying laps in his final run is beyond me. The cracks are growing.

Seb 13th as well. Wow.

This should be a good race if qually was anything to go by. Bring it on.
 
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