My point is that no-one cares if a crap car is illegal!
Technical Red Bull's Front Wing (Revisited)
- Thread starter snowy
- Start date
Unless it's unsafe for it to be circulating about the track, why would they care?
If you take a slow car, make some changes that might not be in accordance with the rules, and it's still slow, then what's the point anyway?
Sort of like this exchange we're having. Nothing but speculation and hypothetical's, but hey, that's what the Internets are for right?
If anyone wants me I'll be cowering in the corner!
Ok then, that's settled. 
ATL11
Pole Sitter
So what we are saying is that RBR have a number of wings, which will have different ways of layering the Carbon Fibre. The way they layer the Carbon Fibre still meets the FIA strength test on flexing, but are we speculating that the pattern of the layering will give different flex levels depending on the tracks?
So for China, Malaysia & Spanish they'll go for a stiffer layering as they'll want a more stable wing for the long straights as these are a greater % of the circuit? Where as the likes of Australian, Turkish & Monte Carlo they'll run with a more flexible front wing that will hoover the floor more often with a higher % of corners the hoovering effect gives them?
Shoot me down if I've interpreted it wrong, it is all sheer speculation.
Must admit I've never had a go @ Carbon fibre, but just using the basics and watching this on YT, are what RBR are doing is reducing the amount of cross latticing for the flexing, but ensuring there is this cross latticing where FIA do load the test from?
So for China, Malaysia & Spanish they'll go for a stiffer layering as they'll want a more stable wing for the long straights as these are a greater % of the circuit? Where as the likes of Australian, Turkish & Monte Carlo they'll run with a more flexible front wing that will hoover the floor more often with a higher % of corners the hoovering effect gives them?
Shoot me down if I've interpreted it wrong, it is all sheer speculation.
Must admit I've never had a go @ Carbon fibre, but just using the basics and watching this on YT, are what RBR are doing is reducing the amount of cross latticing for the flexing, but ensuring there is this cross latticing where FIA do load the test from?
Sort of, but I think it's even simpler than that. The FIA test measures lateral deflection, RBR look as though they are exploiting torsional deflection (which the FIA test almost looks custom-designed to test only minimally...).
Front wing test has been changed for 2011 according to F1.com and Red Bull passed again.
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2011/846/846.html
The only other thing I would add is that the performance of the Red Bull is down to far more than just a bendy wing, but you all know that anyway
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2011/846/846.html
The only other thing I would add is that the performance of the Red Bull is down to far more than just a bendy wing, but you all know that anyway
When exactly was it exactly that RBR started a partnership with this aero-elasticity company?
2009 according to the article linked to: http://mccabism.blogspot.com/2011/04/how-red-bull-simulate-front-wing.html
Hmm then I think it's unlikely that RBR's 2008 wing was flexing because of its design... but then again I suppose RBR may have had to do some initial testing themselves just to see even if the technology was worth investing into.
The FIA test is 1000 N (~102 kg); aero loads on each wing at top speed are the equivalent of 300-400 kg (or so Scarbs reckons). Deflection is only measured between the load point and the reference plane. There are more holes in this 'test' than in good emmentaler.
ATL11
Pole Sitter
Okay so what the FIA test does is simply measure the amount of flex up & down to a few hundred kg. What is actually happening to the wing under load is that it is actually twisting. So we see an element of the wing stay rigid (the bit FIA test), but other parts of the wing are twisting down to bring in the hoovering effect & it's this layering of Carbon Fibre that everyone is in a crux about.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torsion_(mechanics)
Think the best way for the other teams to resolve this is basically to copy it.
So are we seeing a shift of specialist resource moving from the Aero team to the Carbon Fibre team?
Didn't RBR front wing in all it's current glory make it's debut @ the British GP last season, when we had the famous 'Not bad for a number 2 driver' quote........
This is what I love about F1, the intrigue & speculation..............
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torsion_(mechanics)
Think the best way for the other teams to resolve this is basically to copy it.
So are we seeing a shift of specialist resource moving from the Aero team to the Carbon Fibre team?
Didn't RBR front wing in all it's current glory make it's debut @ the British GP last season, when we had the famous 'Not bad for a number 2 driver' quote........
This is what I love about F1, the intrigue & speculation..............
Just a few slo-mo replays of the RBR wing today huh?
A topic of discussion during SPEED's broadcast of practice today was the "wiring" that we saw briefly in Turkey when Seb removed the lower portion of his wing. This thread would not be complete without a picture of said "cables".
Telemetry? Or something more sinister?
A topic of discussion during SPEED's broadcast of practice today was the "wiring" that we saw briefly in Turkey when Seb removed the lower portion of his wing. This thread would not be complete without a picture of said "cables".
Telemetry? Or something more sinister?
ATL11
Pole Sitter
They have got to be telemetry, they may even be measuring loops for deflection between the struts and end of the wing so RBR can monitor in their secret bunker somewhere Austria. Don't think there enough to push hydraulics or electric motors to move the set-up of the wing.
Conspiracy theory for you, could the Carbon composite they use for the front wings properties be changed through an electric current being sent through it? Not a chemist or physicist but could they have some sneeky electronics that in a way electrically charges the front wing to change the properties of the Carbon or said exotic composite to make them softer and therefor deflect? Of course this is all switched off for the FIA load test?
Thats should get you scratching your heads!
Conspiracy theory for you, could the Carbon composite they use for the front wings properties be changed through an electric current being sent through it? Not a chemist or physicist but could they have some sneeky electronics that in a way electrically charges the front wing to change the properties of the Carbon or said exotic composite to make them softer and therefor deflect? Of course this is all switched off for the FIA load test?
Thats should get you scratching your heads!
The hoo-haa over RB's flexi wing has all but disappeared recently. Have the other teams (indeed us the fans too!) resigned themselves to it or have they figured it out and are using it themselves now?
Bit of both, I reckon.
Whilst I agree with and am all for innovation, Red Bull seem to find ways of breaking the rules and getting away with it, whilst most other teams tend to find clever ways of innovating within the rules.
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