They had the same strategist, but didn't always go with the same tyres.
I think the events in Budapest put paid to that.
I think the events in Budapest put paid to that.
Head To Head Nico Rosberg vs Lewis Hamilton
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Incubus
Champion Elect
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I think that would be expecting a tad too much there... Presumably they have their own race engineer but it's not really their job to make it more entertaining for us fans. Their job is to determine the fastest race strategy while minimising the risks of failures, be it tyres, engines or incidents. And those compromises are dependent on circumstances.
Mercedes have their one-two and if they do their job properly they're not supposed to care what the order between the two is.
At McLaren they split strategies at every opportunity because in their position it's their only hope that one of their two drivers will get a surprise result. At Mercedes they don't have to because their margin of superiority is too big for them to have any reason to take any unnecessary risks. They're not there to make races entertaining.
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racecub
Champion Elect
F1Brits_90
World Champion
i thought Sunday Mercedes were hiding something because 20 laps on medium is highly unusual considering they did 27 laps on the softs & pirelli dictated 55, Massa managed 41 laps before he the hit cliff & 29 + 41 wouldve taken to 70 (29 as he started 29 after pitstop). So primes wearing faster than options go against logic.
academic obviously as vettel crash meant both mercs wouldve pitted. But I think Lewis should have stayed out but fairs fairs & if boots on the foot I was pretty angry if nico stayed out
Well Incubus it may not be the job of a top team to make F1 entertaining, but , when they are so far ahead that it's boring,they have to let their drivers drive as individuals, or as teams within a team. If they don't, we will all be so bored F1 will die. Their Shareholders won't appreciate that.
Does anyone remember when they pulled Hamilton in for a stop at Monaco but left Rosberg out? Or (and this is an oldie but a goldie) Mclaren pulled Lewis in for an extra stop in Australia 2010 and left JB out?
I thought making sure both drivers were given equal strategy would have been met with open arms.
Personally I think Nico was just on it this weekend and, after partying hard and already having the title wrapped up the week before, Lewis was slightly off form.
I thought making sure both drivers were given equal strategy would have been met with open arms.
Personally I think Nico was just on it this weekend and, after partying hard and already having the title wrapped up the week before, Lewis was slightly off form.
I'd take finishing two seconds behind the winner as being off form any time 
Whoever was leading into the first corner was always going to win the race though (barring accidents and mistakes).
In addition to the "dirty air" problem, and the heat, with the track surface being so green, it was very slippery, so there was little chance of an overtake.
We saw that demonstrated by the fact that Hamilton kept closing to within a second or two, then dropping back to cool the brakes, etc.
Galahad mentioned an interesting statistic in the overtaking thread:
I agree though - I think winning races is much less important now that he has wrapped the title up, although that doesn't mean he won't go for it if he gets the chance.
Whoever was leading into the first corner was always going to win the race though (barring accidents and mistakes).
In addition to the "dirty air" problem, and the heat, with the track surface being so green, it was very slippery, so there was little chance of an overtake.
We saw that demonstrated by the fact that Hamilton kept closing to within a second or two, then dropping back to cool the brakes, etc.
Galahad mentioned an interesting statistic in the overtaking thread:
I agree though - I think winning races is much less important now that he has wrapped the title up, although that doesn't mean he won't go for it if he gets the chance.
I'd take finishing two seconds behind the winner as being off form any time
It was meant as a compliment to Hamilton that I consider him being 'off-form' whenever he is beaten by Rosberg because however good Rosberg can be Lewis is much much better. To me, if Nico wins it usually means Lewis has now been as good as he can be or has decided to settle.
So it couldn't be that there are some circuits and conditions which suit Rosberg and do not suit Hamilton?
It all depends on the scenario Bill Boddy but I think what I'm trying to say is that Rosberg is a very good and steady racing driver but he's not on Hamilton's level. Think Webber to Vettel, think Barrichello to Schumacher, think Berger to Senna, think Patrese to Mansell.
If it came down to real competition and a win was needed then Lewis would come out on top because he can go up a gear that Rosberg can't. I'd bet my bottom dollar that if the title had still be up for grabs this weekend Hamilton would have been far more 'on it' and got the result.
If it came down to real competition and a win was needed then Lewis would come out on top because he can go up a gear that Rosberg can't. I'd bet my bottom dollar that if the title had still be up for grabs this weekend Hamilton would have been far more 'on it' and got the result.
Following Sunday's race it seems to me that Mercedes have a very serious problem with their two drivers. They simply did not look at each other, Hamilton even put the Merc man getting the team trophy between himself and Rosberg for the photos.
If next season starts with Rosberg getting a few more pole positions there could be severe trouble as Hamilton is confident that he is the faster race driver.
If next season starts with Rosberg getting a few more pole positions there could be severe trouble as Hamilton is confident that he is the faster race driver.
Next he'll be claiming Beyoncé should have won, and that Nico should hand the trophy over...
If the gap between Ferrari and Mercedes is narrow next year Mercedes will find it very difficult to maintain equality between their drivers; it might be good for the team but it won't do for the drivers.
I've been of the opinion for a while that Rosberg and Hamilton really despise each other but have been ordered by Merc to play the happy happy PR role. I'm sure when one of them leaves the team we'll get the full story.
As for not talking on the podium or the cool down room, the exact same thing happened in Mexico. I think after the media fluff of 'hat-gate' the team have basically told the drivers not to speak to each other during the process in case things are interpreted wrong.
Match this to the jovial antics of Seb Vettel in the same situation and it makes them look very dull. Am I right in thinking that Vettel very crafterly stole his helemt back from the officials to take on the podium on Sunday? It certainly looked like an official tried to stop him as he ran past and grabbed it.
As for not talking on the podium or the cool down room, the exact same thing happened in Mexico. I think after the media fluff of 'hat-gate' the team have basically told the drivers not to speak to each other during the process in case things are interpreted wrong.
Match this to the jovial antics of Seb Vettel in the same situation and it makes them look very dull. Am I right in thinking that Vettel very crafterly stole his helemt back from the officials to take on the podium on Sunday? It certainly looked like an official tried to stop him as he ran past and grabbed it.
I thought it was fairly clear that they don't like each other (possibly even hate?) and haven't for some time.
I suspect it goes back a long time and the events and comments over the past two years have just been building up.
Hungary 2014 when Hamilton refused to slow down for Rosberg to let him past.
Then there was Monaco and Rosberg's infamous steering wheel shuffle.
The numerous little pushes and nudges, the snide comments before and after races.
Hamilton commenting that Rosberg "did a great job...no mistakes, no gusts of wind".
Rosberg stating that "the better man won".
I can see things getting worse and worse and Mercedes will be powerless to prevent it.
I suspect it goes back a long time and the events and comments over the past two years have just been building up.
Hungary 2014 when Hamilton refused to slow down for Rosberg to let him past.
Then there was Monaco and Rosberg's infamous steering wheel shuffle.
The numerous little pushes and nudges, the snide comments before and after races.
Hamilton commenting that Rosberg "did a great job...no mistakes, no gusts of wind".
Rosberg stating that "the better man won".
I can see things getting worse and worse and Mercedes will be powerless to prevent it.
Spinodontosaurus
Points Scorer
I'm responding to a two-week old comment here (and made my comment way longer than the single paragraph i Originally intended to post - oops), but Rosberg is much closer to Hamilton than Webber was to Vettel or Barrichello was to Schumacher, in fact he is about as close to Hamilton as Button was (much closer in qualifying, equally as close in races but further off in points).
If Hamilton is one of the Top 3 drivers on the grid then Rosberg is surely in the Top 6, there are probably only 4-5 drivers on the grid better than him (Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel, Ricciardo and perhaps Button), which is in stark contrast to Webber who was never more than a mid-grid driver even at his peak.
If Hamilton was really that much better than Rosberg then we would see it in their relative results and pace, like when Kovalainen only scored half of Hamilton's points.
To put it in numbers as I have a habit of doing, over their 3 years together:
Rosberg has outqualified Hamilton 46% of the time (26-30, as in Rosberg has outqualified Hamilton 26 times out of 56 sessions), finished ahead of him in races when neither suffered a mechanical DNF 41% of the time (18-26) and scored 46% of the team's points (785-911).
I should probably compare this to Hamilton's other team mates for context;
Alonso outqualified Hamilton 47% of the time (8-9), finished ahead of him 59% of the time (10-7) and scored 50% of the team's points (109-109). Under the modern points system Alonso still scores 50% of the team's points when rounded, but actually outscores Hamilton by 1 point (266-265; Raikkonen scored 272 points under the modern system for those curious).
Button outqualified Hamilton 24% of the time (14-44), finished ahead of him 43% of the time (20-27) and scored 51% of the team's points (672-657).
Kovalainen outqualified Hamilton 26% of the time (9-26), finished ahead of him 36% of the time (10-18) and scored 34% of the team's points (75-147). Under the modern points system, Kovalainen scores 35% of the team's points (194-367).
From that we can say Alonso/Hamilton > Button/Rosberg >> Kovalainen. Also of note is that the stats actually support common stereotypes about the drivers' strengths; Button is not a great qualifier, Rosberg and arguably Hamilton are stronger in qualifying than in races, Alonso is phenomenal in races.
For fun, here is how Vettel/Webber stack up:
Webber outqualified Vettel 24% of the time (23-73), beat him 24% of the time in races (20-63) and scored 40% of the team's points (949-1410). Under the modern points system, Webber scored 41% of the team's points points (1046-1514).
If Hamilton is one of the Top 3 drivers on the grid then Rosberg is surely in the Top 6, there are probably only 4-5 drivers on the grid better than him (Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel, Ricciardo and perhaps Button), which is in stark contrast to Webber who was never more than a mid-grid driver even at his peak.
If Hamilton was really that much better than Rosberg then we would see it in their relative results and pace, like when Kovalainen only scored half of Hamilton's points.
To put it in numbers as I have a habit of doing, over their 3 years together:
Rosberg has outqualified Hamilton 46% of the time (26-30, as in Rosberg has outqualified Hamilton 26 times out of 56 sessions), finished ahead of him in races when neither suffered a mechanical DNF 41% of the time (18-26) and scored 46% of the team's points (785-911).
I should probably compare this to Hamilton's other team mates for context;
Alonso outqualified Hamilton 47% of the time (8-9), finished ahead of him 59% of the time (10-7) and scored 50% of the team's points (109-109). Under the modern points system Alonso still scores 50% of the team's points when rounded, but actually outscores Hamilton by 1 point (266-265; Raikkonen scored 272 points under the modern system for those curious).
Button outqualified Hamilton 24% of the time (14-44), finished ahead of him 43% of the time (20-27) and scored 51% of the team's points (672-657).
Kovalainen outqualified Hamilton 26% of the time (9-26), finished ahead of him 36% of the time (10-18) and scored 34% of the team's points (75-147). Under the modern points system, Kovalainen scores 35% of the team's points (194-367).
From that we can say Alonso/Hamilton > Button/Rosberg >> Kovalainen. Also of note is that the stats actually support common stereotypes about the drivers' strengths; Button is not a great qualifier, Rosberg and arguably Hamilton are stronger in qualifying than in races, Alonso is phenomenal in races.
For fun, here is how Vettel/Webber stack up:
Webber outqualified Vettel 24% of the time (23-73), beat him 24% of the time in races (20-63) and scored 40% of the team's points (949-1410). Under the modern points system, Webber scored 41% of the team's points points (1046-1514).
Il_leone
World Champion
Nico Rosberg has been described as Prost like in that he thinks and analyses everything through to get the best results although Williams think his brain capacity is not as high as Bottas. Maybe because he over thought or was not focused in the right areas to beat Hamilton.
it seems like he has now been focusing on the right areas.
The press want an inter team rivalry given one team is dominating and it would be good for the sport so much has been made that it is Prost vs Senna v2/3 possibly
Rosberg has had 3 years already in the team before Hamilton so he has been able to maximise that advantage as well.
it seems like he has now been focusing on the right areas.
The press want an inter team rivalry given one team is dominating and it would be good for the sport so much has been made that it is Prost vs Senna v2/3 possibly
Rosberg has had 3 years already in the team before Hamilton so he has been able to maximise that advantage as well.
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