Current McLaren

Arguably one of the big teams in Formula One but lately they don't seem to be able to get the basics right.
Some of their strategy and decisions in the last few years has left more than a few observers scratching their heads.

Just a few for starters:

• Leaving Kimi out on a badly flat-spotted tyre, resulting in it exploding on the last lap.
• Leaving Hamilton out on tyres so badly worn they were down to the canvas; Bridgestone themselves demanded that McLaren bring him in and McLaren refused, keeping him out for a few more laps. That decision arguably cost Hamilton the first rookie WDC and is one which will haunt him and McLaren for the rest of their days.
• Not sending Button and Hamilton out to get banker laps in during Q1.
• Sending Hamilton out on used tyres in Q3, with rain forecast, meaning it would be impossible to set a fast lap time on his second attempt on new tyres.

Their major updates seem to send them further down the grid, instead of challenging for pole positions and wins. As the season progresses they tend to get worse before getting better, by which time it is generally too late.

It's often said of them "write them off at your peril", but is this necessarily true?

The last time they won the WCC was in 1998 and their last WDC was 2008, before that 1999.
Their days of regularly winning championships seem to be well and truly behind them.

It's all well and good coming up with reasons why they haven't won championships.
The fact remains though, they have won just one WDC in the last 12 years.

So where to now for McLaren?

(I wrote this in rather a hurry so I will flesh it out when I have more time.)

 

[Incubus]

I might have missed something there but where exactly in the link did Dennis say he wanted Button out? He mostly said it would be normal for Button to feel under pressure from a young fast team-mate and sure, he certainly knows how to apply pressure on his own driver in what he thinks of as a way of getting the best out of him, whether it's misplaced on not, but that's a very different thing to actually suggesting he's blaming him for the team's poor form is?... We're getting close to taking thing things totally out of context here.

I mean, I'm certainly not Ron's biggest fan but an arse he certainly ain't.

You don't take over a team that's on the verge of going under and go on to win 10 WDC's and 7 WCC's during your time in charge if you're an arse.

 

[teabagyokel]

You don't take over a team that's on the verge of going under and go on to win 10 WDC's and 7 WCC's during your time in charge if you're an arse.

Being successful certainly doesn't preclude your being an arse. (c.f. Ecclestone, B.)

 

[siffert_fan]

Extremeninja:

Is your friend one of the two ladies on the right in the opening frame

 

[FB]

For those that have watched Ron's pearls of wisdom here's an article which give a little more detail than my summary:

http://www.auto123.com/en/racing-news/f1-ron-dennis-tells-jenson-button-to-try-harder?artid=168962

 

[Mephistopheles]

I summarize the whole thing in this statement.

"Do I want him (Button) to try harder? Of course I do," Ron Dennis insisted. "He's a highly paid grand prix driver, and yes, we're not giving him the best car, but he could do his bit, and Kevin's got to make it as difficult for him as possible."

Specifically.

He's a highly paid grand prix driver,

Meaning.

It's contract time if Button wants to stay with McLaren then he is going to have to accept a pay cut...

Didn't he say exactly the same thing but in different wording to Lewis just before Hamilton pissed off to Merc?

 

[The Artist.....]

.... Not least because McLaren STILL haven't got a title sponsor!

 

[Titch]

I have to disagree with this :

...."but an arse he certainly ain't." ..... IMO RD is an arse.

 

[Il_leone]

I like Button's response " Its a team effort and everyone has to put in 100% and he is doing his bit"

If you are Ron and want everyone to know Mclaren still want to be a considered amongst the big 4 teams then he needs to say he wants to best drivers available " Vettel, Hamilton and Alonso"

Now realistically only Hamilton would consider returning to Mclaren, Alonso might be unhappy at Ferrari but he knows Ron will not give him undisputed No 1 role

Vettel - I don't see his reasons to go unless he was offered a lot of money and similar status plus he 's going to have race a really fast youngster

Hamilton - despite what he says I think he would consider returning if he felt marginalised at Mercedes but again he is going to give up being in a championship car
----------------------

So far Honda have not had influence on driver decision but one would expect someone very marketable with reputation

-----------------------------------

Someone mentioned Kimi - not sure giving his indifferent Ferrari form at the moment why Mclaren want him over Button AND he is going to cost a lot more

 

[Bill Boddy]

Maybe Vettel will go to McLaren next season following his being replaced by Kvyat.

 

[Mephistopheles]

So how much stock is Vettel losing that his only choice of a drive is McLaren? For a four times world champion that is so sad..

 

[Il_leone]

Is Vettel marketable in Japan for Honda??

As World champion x 4 he fits Ron's mould of a world class driver unless your name was Nigel Mansell

I think Vettel loses stock the fact he could not beat Ricciardo but his credentials and reputation as world champion still remain

 

[Dizzi]

Surely the Japanese would much prefer Jenson given his links to the country?
I doubt if they would want Vettel as he has been known to be less than polite on interviews etc & the Japanese I know have always been very respectful. Probably better not have Hamilton either then - or Kimi!
Kamui to McLaren??!

 

[RasputinLives]

When has Vettel been less than polite in interviews? Must have missed those.

I have no dpunt in my mind that if Honda were pushing on the driver stakes (we have no evidence that they are) that Jenson would be in there plans due to the fact he was heavily linked with Honda, he's a world champion, his girlfriends Japanese, he's amazingly popular over there and (and heres the kicker) he already has a contract with the team they are supplying and they wouldn't have to help Mclaren pay stupid money to get him.

I'm sure they'd love Vettel too but he won't go there for 2015.

Thing is though Honda don"t make the driver decisions. That some guy called Ron Dennis and his point of view is often very odd.

 

[Il_leone]

Thing is though Honda don"t make the driver decisions.


I guess we will not expect to see a Japanese driver at Mclaren then?

 

[FB]

I suspect whoever gets the second Honda engine deal will have a Japanese driver.

 

[RasputinLives]

Il_leone - can you name me a Japanese driver who has come from a Toyota stable that they would even consider putting in at Mclaren.

Plus the whole time they had a Merc engine they never ran a German driver. The whole time they had Honda previously they never had a Japanese driver.

I think you're adding 2 + 2 and getting 5 on the whole Honda influence if I'm honest.

 

[Incubus]

When has Vettel been less than polite in interviews? Must have missed those.

---------------------------------------

Abu Dhabi 2012, podium interviews, and Coulthard subsequently apologising to viewers and spectators for Kimi and Seb's four letter-worded answers?

 

[RasputinLives]

But when Kimi does it then its part of his 'cool don't care' attitude that so many people seem to love?

As I hear constantly in the media what a lovely chatty guy Vettel is (even by those who don't ratw his driving) so suggesting that he is 'less polite' in interviews and he may be rejected by a potential sponsor due to his 'attitude' seems some what the work of pure fantasy.

 

[Incubus]

To be honest I think it's a bit of a misplaced notion anyway that Honda would particularly value drivers' "politeness" all that much. They're far more interested in winning.

We should know that from experience, when Piquet and then Senna formed close relationships with Honda. Senna in particular was very close to Honda's hierarchy. I'm pretty sure they valued his winning ways rather more than whether he was a civil interviewee.

 

[Il_leone]

Il_leone - can you name me a Japanese driver who has come from a Toyota stable that they would even consider putting in at Mclaren.

Plus the whole time they had a Merc engine they never ran a German driver. The whole time they had Honda previously they never had a Japanese driver.

I think you're adding 2 + 2 and getting 5 on the whole Honda influence if I'm honest.

-

the closest Mclaren got to running a German driver were Nick Heidfeld being the test driver until Ron thought Kimi was better
and on other possibilities Nico Rosberg...

When Mclaren had Honda engines before they could get away with it because they were successful and they worshipped Senna like a God

They were a front running team so success was almost guaranteed.. they are not in the same bargaining position as previously - I presume Mclaren then do not need to pay for the engines which would be $15m a year or so .which is was they got Perez last year

The difference between the Honda team back in 1980's and 1990's to the disastrous flop of 2000's were the former bosses wanted to show the pinnacle of their technology that Honda could achieve whereas the latter bosses was more interested in increasing the sales of road cars

Mclaren had better hope it was the former