Ferrari Bias

Is there Ferrari bias in F1 at the moment?


  • Total voters
    12

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
I just want to know what other people think about the issue of Ferrari bias in Formula One by the current governing body. I've been wondering if it's just me that thinks that Ferrari are unfairly advantaged when it comes to stewards' decisions.

This is on the back of Ferrari getting a slap on the wrist for nearly throwing Adrian Sutil into the wall at the European Grand Prix. And if they had ended Sutil's race it wouldn't be for the first time this season...
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
I have to say, every time the FIA is handed a perfect opportunity to dispel the allegations of bias towards Ferrari and against McLaren, they refuse to take it and instead add fuel to the fire.

As far as I am aware, under the existing rules and regulations, there were 3 possible penalties that could have been given to Massa once the stewards had decided to penalise him

1. A drive through penalty
2. A stop-go penalty
3. A grid drop at the next race

Instead they hand him a 10,000 Euro fine which is not one of the 3 permissable penalties :s

When you consider Alonso was fined 10,000 Euros for cutting the entry to the pit lane and Hamilton was fined 5,000 Euros for being 90 seconds late for a press conference it makes it all the more bizarre.
 

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
Hamilton was fined €5000 for being late for a press conference? To be fair though, they should fine Raikkonen for turning up at press conferences! "ithinkthecarisworkingwellbutimhavingsomedifficultyinqualifying" - one word it isn't, Kimi!
 

Jake360

Rookie
i dont know what the fuss is all about. Who cares about this stuff. The racing was done on the track, massa won, recieved his prize, and then got his 10000 penalty. Wouldn't you rather that happen than have a boring season and have hamilton run off in the distance. I dont think they are biased, i just think they are bending the rules without breaking them to keep the championship still on fire. Bending the rules for the good of the sport i think. :goodday:
 

Porceliamone

This cost me a tenner, but so L'Oreal.
Contributor
I'm sorry but I just don't agree with the post above.

The FIA categorically had three choices to make regarding the pit lane infringement.
Whether for the good of the sport or not (imo the final decision wasn't anyway) they threw their own rulebook out of the window and essentially influenced the race result in favour of the red cars. Simple as. How anyone can argue differently is beyond me.

They penalised the team not the driver because it was their mistake, not Massa's? That's bull...by definition, the driver being employed by the team IS part of the team and the appropriate penalty should apply.

Wrong decision FIA and a bloody disgrace.
 

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
Porceliamone said:
They penalised the team not the driver because it was their mistake, not Massa's? That's bull...by definition, the driver being employed by the team IS part of the team and the appropriate penalty should apply.
Aah, you know the answer to that don't you, Porceliamone? "We let Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso continue racing for McLaren last season despite McLaren's disqualification for Spygate." Again, an inconsistency. If McLaren were responsible for the actions of Coughlan, their employee in Spygate then Ferrari were responsible for the actions of Stepney, their employee, giving McLaren the data. Therefore, entrappment! And we all know who was dragging it through the courts...
 

Andrea_Moda_Rules

Podium Finisher
Did Massa get released when he shouldn't of done: yes
did he get penalized: yes
should Ferrari/massa have got a racing fine (drive thru/10 place grid drop): possibly
Does this mean FIa are licking the arse of Ferrari: No
Why: because others have done the same with no sort of reprimand at all
so FIA are inconsistent then?: Yes
does FIA hate McLrean: No
why: because they used an car with illegal parts/made with information they wern't supposed to have and were still allowed to contest the drivers champ
why was McLaren fined and Ferrari not when it was two individuals rather then the teams themselfs breaking the rules: because McLaren used the information to their advantage, unwittingly yes but still gained an advantage, Ferrari could not of gained any possible advantage from what happened.

there i think ive covered all points brought up

so thats my opinion FIA are just inconsistent, they do not favor Ferrari, they do not actively seek out to give Mclaren a disadvantage.
and my last point. Just because you disagree with a decision doesn't mean that they are wrong. also its pretty annoying that people want to bring up old ground, if everytime the FIA penalizes someone, people are just going to bring up spygate, to show how FIA are biased to this that and the blooming other, I might just stop watching F1 altogether because for me its just ruining my F1 experience, and thats coming from someone who's been watching F1 for 12/14 years.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
Andrea_Moda_Rules said:
and my last point. Just because you disagree with a decision doesn't mean that they are wrong.
Conversely, just because you agree with a decision, doesn't mean they are right ;)

I think the one thing we can all agree on is the inconsistent approach to applying the rules and regulations is causing more problems than those actually breaking the rules.
 

Jen

Here be dragons.
Contributor
Unlike AMR, I have been watching F1 for the best part of 40 years and the nonsense has only appeared in, maybe, the last 15 years.

I don't actually know if it is bias - although a lawyer could argue it - but there is, certainly, an inconsistancy in regulation.

Is this just human fraility or something more sinister?. I suspect it is a mixture of the two - the difference between F1 now and F1 in the 1990's is quite marked - what happened in the intervening years?
 

cider_and_toast

Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex
Staff member
Premium Contributor
This one dates back to the early 80's and has been reported in several books.

Lotus was developing it's type 86 twin chassis car (the actual race version was the type 88) in response to the FIA ban on sliding skirts. The development work was done in great secrecy and there were many rumours at the time as to what Lotus were up to. One rumour had it that the new car would have no suspension at all. Ferrari immediatly appealed to the FIA about this and a "rule clarification" was issued that remains on the books today the states that all F1 cars must have a suspension system.

It's interesting to note that in the wake of the Type 88 affair Colin Chapman wrote an open letter which stated that if the sport didn't do something to clean up it's act it would disolve in to a myre of petty rule interpretation and plagerism. Something not far short of what we have experienced in the last few years.

One incident that immediatly springs to mind is the Renault Mass damper system. No protest was issued when Ferrari was doing well against this car. The following season when things were different the system is suddenly protested.
 

teabagyokel

#dejavu
Valued Member
I think the Renault Mass Damper system was a good indication of the Ferrari bias operating in F1. As I have already demonstrated, I am not sure about Spygate, and frankly any car with a "tail-fin" should therefore be banned save Red Bull. And any car with wheel covers save Ferrari etc. etc.

The FIA stewards let Massa & Ferrari off the hook (in a sporting sense). If Sutil had hit that wall the race would have to be red-flagged. If that happened the FIA would have had to punish Massa and therefore Hamilton would have won! Although, back at Interlagos 2003 Alonso wasn't punished for going at a ridiculous speed through an SC zone...
 

Andrea_Moda_Rules

Podium Finisher
teabagyokel said:
As I have already demonstrated, I am not sure about Spygate, and frankly any car with a "tail-fin" should therefore be banned save Red Bull. And any car with wheel covers save Ferrari etc. etc.

Teabag
I dunno what your engineering backound is, but looking at what another team has done and desgining your own version and having plans of another teams part are two completely different things. To desgin your your own part or something similar to what someelse has done is a lot harder then having a piece of paper with measurements, materials and using that to copy straight off parts weather its mechanical (if fact even more so) or aerodynamical.

Put it this way, YUsing an extreme example, If i had the plans to a whole McLaren car and a few bob in the bank to get the required equipment and materials to make it, I could Make a Mclrean that runs just has well has the proper one and there be no noticaable differences. To design a McLaren myself would be different, I could make car that possibly resembles a McLaren but in reality unless i found some sort of geniuos inside me didn't know about wouldn't be has good, It wouldn't be has fast, built as well as reliable and in fact a heap of crap compared to the real McLaren
 

Porceliamone

This cost me a tenner, but so L'Oreal.
Contributor
Passing information is JUST as bad as receiving it. End of. So where's the Farcearri fine?
That's like letting the drug dealer walk off free while you punish the 'user' to the absolute full extent of the law - and then deciding to kick them in the nuts as well.
 

Andrea_Moda_Rules

Podium Finisher
Well if what we here from the FIA, press and do on is correct, Ferrari them selfs did nothing wrong. it was one man who decided to throw there toys out of the pram and give the information to McLaren, For Ferrari they gained no advantage in doing this so why punish the team because of the idiocy of one complete and utter selfish moron who tried to sabotage the team.
McLaren however could of gained an advantage from that information. and someone should of realized that there could of been something not kosher on the car (In fact it was proved even with the 2008 car there were parts with Ferrari IP's on them). Also there were people in the team who knew what happened and didn't go straight to the FIA.

but all i say could very much be pointess anyway if we don't have all the info on this, which i very much doubt

and another point theres no real point discussing this now anyway.
Whats done is done and nothing can change it now.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
Another race and another bizarre decision by the Stewards.

Hours after the race had finished LH is penalised 25 seconds therefore demoting him to 3rd and handing Massa the win.

I wonder why I even bother watching anymore....
 

Porceliamone

This cost me a tenner, but so L'Oreal.
Contributor
I wonder why I bother watching too. This is just too much. A absolute farce. In fact there aren't even words invented that can explain how utterly disgusted I am by this abortion of a decision.
 
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