Clip The Xmas 
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johnnoble1990
Guest
So Massa is trying to overtake Webber? I thought a better entry and exit would be wider then cutting under, although i'm no racing expert. I see this as showing Massa obviously spotting Hamilton and cutting across him. If Massa followed Webber's line, because he didn't see Lewis, then it'd end up being an overtake. Surely Massa knew it was going to end badly because Lewis had nowhere to go after he committed.
The only way this is "avoidable" is if Massa leaves a car length round the corner, instead of pushing Lewis across the pavement.
The only way this is "avoidable" is if Massa leaves a car length round the corner, instead of pushing Lewis across the pavement.
Didn't say he was trying to overtake, I said he was trying to stick with him, as Webber had the wider line, Massa tried to take the corner tighter, bu doing so, he would have killed two birds with one stone, closing in on Webber and easily defending Hamilton.
Hamilton thought different.
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johnnoble1990
Guest
Again, it seems a bit clutching at straws, as we both are. A better entry and exit would be to brake earlier and follow the same line with more control. There is nothing right with the line Massa is taking but to defend. Lewis said it himself "he turned in early on purpose".
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johnnoble1990
Guest
I think the best contribution on this matter was whoever said they should rip up the rules and start again. They've got too ambiguous and too subjective. They often seem to be making it up as they go along and it is usually Lewis who provides the precedents for them for trying to be a bit different and creative.
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johnnoble1990
Guest
Yeah but i think we have seen it is possible to overtake at Monaco today, Schumi and Hamilton, i just wish others would take their lead. I guess it is to do with the importance of track position, but i still fail to see how the collision was Lewis fault just because he had a go. He had nearly 4 wheels on the pavement and was still touching Massa. That should give people a clue.
Can we please give this ridiculous argument up now - it's done, the wreckage has been removed and the stewards have had their say - the rest is inconsequential
Did the Maldonado incident even happen? One minute I looked, saw the car there...next minute...where did it go?
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johnnoble1990
Guest
Ouch. Ridiculous is a bit far. It is just an opinion/racing philosophy. Sure it may not matter in the greater scheme of things and on most occasions i tend to sit on the fence about sort of thing, but this is one thing that i feel strongly on. Of course the stewards were going to come to the conclusion they did, because that is the rules, but the rules in F1 haven't always been for the good of the sport. I think the current overtaking ones are a mess, a bit like the overtaking today.
Some rules in every sport are not good for the sport, yet they always will be there
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johnnoble1990
Guest
Some rules in every sport are not good for the sport, yet they always will be there
Hmm...yeah but this one is a vital one. I've watched both incidences over and over and over again and i can't help but see them as just attempts at overtaking and the fact they were ruled illegal for the overtaker makes me die a little inside.
Opinions and philosophies can usually be summarised in a few sentences, without repetition - unless challenged with new and pertinent reasons to rethink one's stance.
Sadly, in all stations of life, rules predominate - for good or ill. There are two options - you accept the rules or you fight the rules. Breaking the rules, however brave and commendable, is not an option unless you are prepared to face the consequences.
Back on topic - F1 rules are anti racing - I wouldn't like to say.
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johnnoble1990
Guest
Yep. I still don't blame Hamilton for his aggression. At the end of the day it works for him more often than not and even today you have to say it did, but for the wrong reasons. The crashes weren't a collision between drivers, it was a collision of driver philosophies and in the end i guess Massa wins the argument because the rules are on his side.
What you seem unable to accept John, is that others have a different opinion to you and constantly harping on a) isn't going to change someone else's opinion and b) isn't going to change the fact that Hamilton has been censured for both attempted passes by the stewards of the race.
I think its best for all on here if you just drop it now as it's repetitive and, shall I suggest, getting a bit boring.
