Grand Prix 2011 Singapore Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Getting closer and closer

Every time we say that Vettel won't win, he comes up trumps with a flawless performance and Monza was no different, taking pole, won the race and put a smart move on Alonso which won him the race.

Ferrari have pretty much admitted defeat and are stopping development on their frankly dissapointing 2011 car which so far has only taken one win at the rain affected British Grand Prix which was also the only track where the EBD was banned which was negatively affecting McLaren and Red Bull more than it was Ferrari. It means that Fernando Alonso will have gone 5 years without adding to his 2 world championships which he took at Renault in 2005 and 2006 and he will be more determined than ever to fix that soon. Felipe Massa looks to be just going through the motions and is a shadow of his pre 2009 self.

Jenson Button continued his strong second half of the season with a podium at Monza to further assert himself as the number one driver at McLaren, indeed his performances recently have been putting his team mate in the shade and a series of overtakes in Spa and Monza have showed that he has the mantle to be the leading driver at McLaren.

In contrast Lewis Hamilton has been somewhat troubled recently, after a crash in Spa, a spin in Hungary and just 1 podium in 8 races, he was notably less agressive in Monza, particularly when trying to overtake Schumacher who arguably should have been penalised for agressive defending which other drivers have been penalised for recently.

Apart from over agressive defending Schumacher has been driving a lot better recently and has been up at the front on a more consistent basis and surely he must be close to a podium now? Rosberg has been very unlucky recently, a good strategy in Monza was ruined when he was t-boned by the missile that was Liuzzi who was given a penalty for his spin, he claimed that he was pushed off by Kovalainen but this wasn't true and the stewards took a dim view of him.

Toro Rosso have enjoyed a very strong second half to the year with another double points finish in Monza with Alguesari continuing his Lazarus act from near expulsion to take his season total to 16, 3 ahead of his team mate Buemi who took a solitary point in the sister Toro Rosso, both will be looking to get the upper hand on each other as the season draws to a close and Riccardo in the rear view mirrors when the 2012 contracts get drawn up.

Renault showed a resurgance in Monza with Bruno Senna taking his first F1 points in 9th, he might have finished higher but he was caught up in the first corner crash which forced Petrov to retire after both cars had made it into Q3, but with Singapore being a totally different track, it will be a good test on whether the last upgrades for the car have worked.

Singapore is the first night race in F1 but apart from 2008 which was affected by deliebarate crashing and race fixing, the races have been rather dull with little action throughout the race and many fans criticising the circuit despite decent overtaking figures.

For Galahads superb write up, see here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/marina-bay-street-circuit/
 
Great race from Vettel led every lap of the race, good job by Button but where did his late pace come from all of a sudden could McLaren have won the race? Webber...just his usual average, Hamilton well, qualifying may not have been his fault as he only got one run, but I think if he had a good start and didn't get into an incident he could have challenged for the win, that's 9 races without a podium now.

Ferrari have been since the start if the season the 3rd beat team doesn't look like that will change Alonso got the best result possible, Massa's bad luck continues, Schumacher before his incident looked as if he was stronger than Rosberg would have been interesting if he didn't decide to go flying
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average race from Rosberg.

Great race from Di Resta I am still unconvinced over the guy as he got so much hype in the first few grand prixs then he started making mistakes, but solid performance from him on a track that he hasn't raced on before, Perez had a good race too getting Sauber some precious points. Seemed like a good day for the rookies as all of them bet their more experienced team-mates.

No Moose
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in the points :disappointed: but outraced Alguersuari by some margin was over a lap ahead before Alguersuari crashed, Toro Rosso seemed to have slipped back quite a bit, talking about slipping back shocking race from Renault from fighting for the points in Monza to racing for 16th-19th???! Some head scratching must be going on there.

My drivers of the day have to be Di Resta, Vettel, Perez and
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Massa has done several antagonistic things to LH.......

In the race today........it's not like Lewis to drive into anyone....he avoids them....even to the point of hitting the wall in Canada ......instead of hitting Button........(oh that he had Kobied him, & then gone on to win the race.....possible 50 points diff between them?)

Massa just seems to be needling Lewis......
 
Only the WUMS are saying it's favourtism. This time it was luck, Hamilton couldn't do a second run in qualifying and therefore had a bad starting position. This lead to Webber against being stupid and pushing too far wide losing himself two positions. Fifth was the best Hamilton could achieve today really.

He may have made the podiun, if he didn't damage his wing by hitting Massa, and then receiving a drive through penalty.
 
On the BBC news...just now.........they showed the incident with Massa in the press conference
They said... Lewis had told Massa not to touch him.
Then they showed the incident on track...I would like to hear Lewis' take on it.......
Just a touch on the brakes.....

Still he didn't have to pirouette......sorry Piquet
 
I think Massa and Hamilton need to have an off-track discussion and quick - To me it looks like Massa is getting paranoid, and Hamilton is feeling persecuted - a bad mix as they are likely to be racing each other closely for the remainder of the season and beyond. As aggrieved Massa is feeling about (in his mind) continually getting driven into by Hamilton, public altercations and comments about his former manager/father are not helpful, particularly when Felipe considers who is own manager is.
 
With regards to the rest - Seb is flawless at the moment and untouchable. Driving appears so easy at the moment for him, it's hard to see how he can be beaten if Newey and co. conjure up another gem next year. Mark Webber = Carlos Reutemann, had his one chance to win the WC, seemingly didn't fancy it (ok, harsh but you get the idea) and is now forever seeking his mojo. Alonso I'm not sure about - is he getting the most out of the Ferrari, or just biding his time; He seems to be getting overtaken much easier than in the past. Button is surprising me, and really taking on the spirit of Prost. I do wonder why he can only turn the wick up in the last 15 laps though.
Rosberg appears to have the FIA in his pocket (has he found the missing FIA/Ferrari/Schumi documents from 2000-2005?), the FIndias kept out of trouble and got the car home in the points and the rest were, well, pretty anonymous.
 
Unfortunately Lewis seems to be a magnet for trouble right now. He's either stupendous with his overtaking and beating everyone like China and Germany or he's tangling with too many drivers

His race was ruined by Webber's aggressive defence which left him on the backfoot - perfectly okay. Had he cleared Webber maybe with the extra set of tyres he may got onto the podium.
At the moment he's not having the luck at the moment.

The difference between him and Vettel at the moment is that last season when Vettel was making amateurish errors and accidents - Lewis failed to capitalise

This season the boot is on the other foot and Vettel is capitalising and making most of his advantage whilst Hamilton keeps making mistakes and accidents

Before anyone makes some sort of Mclaren conspiracy to drive LEwis out should realise Whitmarsh tried to protect Lewis until he admitted he had a bad race when coaxed. Whitmarsh will also admit Mclaren have made some errors themselves which has not helped either

The only thing I was not happy to see was Lewis ' response to Massa after the race..hopefully he has calmed down talk to Felipe man to man
 
You do know that Button was in clean air the whole race? And you must have noticed that Lewis was almost always behind others on a street circuit? Different races due to tyre management, Button went fast at the end, Lewis had primes at the end, but you knew that

I also know that the difference between soft and supersoft is not 2.3 seconds.
 
Massa has done several antagonistic things to LH.......

In the race today........it's not like Lewis to drive into anyone....he avoids them....even to the point of hitting the wall in Canada ......instead of hitting Button........(oh that he had Kobied him, & then gone on to win the race.....possible 50 points diff between them?)

Massa just seems to be needling Lewis......

My wife is right, we really should get a new television. The one we have keeps on showing Hamilton running into Massa when it is the other way round. It even showed Hamilton's front wheel hitting Button's rear wheel in Canada before hitting the wall.

That Massa man really should be more careful, Monza, Monaco and now Singapore. Tut, tut.
 
Not sure on that one to be honest - usually I'd agree with you but this weekend has been the one weekend Jenson's actually had the legs on Lewis.

If you look at Practice and the early part of qualifying, it was Lewis who was looking like the stronger of the pairing.

But, if you look at my pre-race posts from Saturday (posts #711, 713, 714, 716, 718), you'll gather from those posts that the Q2 puncture gave the tyre advantage to Jenson. And this GP was going to be all about rear tyre degradation.

I looked at my posts and they were basically on the money. Lewis was going into the gun fight with only 2 bullets instead of 3.

I said at that time that it would be a "miracle" if Lewis "out-raced" Jenson in the GP.

What made it worse was McLaren, yet again, not being on top of the situation in Q3. They accidently took fuel out instead of putting fuel in for Lewis's 2nd run.

This error meant Lewis didn't get his second run whilst all the other main guys did with Button, Webber and Alonso improving.

You may say "so what?"...

Well - as I said in post # 729 - Lewis was, as a result, left on the dirty side on Row 2. That's a grid disadvantage he simply did not need, especially when he's going in with 2 bullets whilst the other Gun Slingers are going in with 3.

I said in those posts that Jenson had the advantage over Lewis in this race and I was right.

These aren't excuses. These are factual variables that I pointed out 2 pages ago pre-race.

You know what? It's the little things that matter when you're fighting against the other Aces in what I believe is a very hard driver era...the toughest since Senna/Prost/Mansell/etc.

Perhaps Lewis could have avoided that Q2 puncure (perhaps not)...but one thing is clear is that the McLaren team screwed up his 2nd Q3 run and it was costly.
 
I also know that the difference between soft and supersoft is not 2.3 seconds.
Button was pushing for the win, Hamilton wasn't as there was no way he was going to make up another place before the end of the race.

I would have thought that might have something to do with it.

Until Hamilton's Q3 puncture and refuelling issue, which stopped him going out to set a faster time, Hamilton was ahead of Button and Webber as his first Q3 run was faster than both of them.
 
Penalty my arse! Just watched the race. Bewildered once again.
I've got no issue with the penalty, only with the consistent application of it.

The penalty is "causing a collision" which Hamilton undoubtedly did.
Likewise Alguersuari hit Trulli and he too was penalised.

However, Schumacher and Rosberg also caused collisions and they didn't receive drive through penalties.

I think it's this inconsistency and uncertainty which causes most frustration amongst fans and viewers.
 
I'm sure at several other races, Canada being one that I can think of, a few drivers clips those in-front by accident and didn't get a penalty.

Like you say Brogan, im not fussed with the Penalty as it did effect Massa's race.

This season is just turning from bad to worse for Hamilton. Little things that keep on going wrong, like in qualifying on Saturday are then causing him larger problems in the race, at a time when he really just needs to be in free air and be able to push to the limit, not be messing around getting stuck behind slower cars.

I have no doubt he has lost some confidence and also that certain other drivers are now taking advantage of the fact that he gets punished more than any other driver and therefore they're much harder with him than with another driver. This combined with Hamilton's naturally aggressive style, will inevitably lead to accidents. Massa is a bit of a liability on track at the moment because he has nothing to lose and is very frustrated, therefore, I sometimes feel if he were in a situation with Hamilton he would be pretty wreckless at the drop of a hat. If you remember at Spa, he nearly had Hamilton off the track and the commentators said that was border-line and any more it would have been out of order.
 
Yeah, bit hard to penalise Schumacher as he crashed out and Perez (was it?) was amazingly unaffected where as Hamilton affected Massa’s race quite badly. But I do agree that Hamilton seems to be on the receiving end of the penalties quite a bit more often or the consistency of the penalties is bizarre and have worked against him either by coincidence or bad luck.

But its not only him, remember at Malaysia where I think it was Alonso who accidently clipped the rear of Hamilton’s tyre in a slip stream only damaging his own (Alonso’s) car and un-effecting Hamilton yet Alonso bizarrely got a penalty when losing his front wing seemed penalty enough.

I’m 70 -30 in favour of no whether he should have got a penalty, yes because the damage to Massa but no because it was such a minor mistake, pity it gave Massa a puncture, then id be 100% no.

Remember Brazil 2006, Schumacher v Alonso for the championship at the last round of the season. Fisichella (Alonso’s team mate) accidentally gave Schumacher a puncture with his front wing wrecking Schumacher’s race and championship chances putting him to last on the first lap, he got no penalty, and rightly so. This example looks more deserving of a penalty because it effected the championship and people could have though it was planned to help Alonso, it wasn’t, it was just a mistake. Mistakes happen.
 
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