Grand Prix 2011 Korean Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Party time has officially begun... if you are Red Bull anyway

So, its now over, Sebastian Vettel is the 2011 world champion after finishing third behind Fernando Alonso and winner Jenson Button. Vettel is not only the youngest ever world champion, but the youngest person to defend his championship after walking to the championship with (so far) a podium in every race bar one and a phenomenal record in qualifying with pole in near enough every single race.

The RB7 has no doubt been the best car of the season and has been night and day quicker than anything else on wheels. Adrian Newey must now be known as the scourge of F1 as he has designed yet another car that has won the championship but surely this has to be one of if not the best car he has ever designed as the RB7 doesn't have the fragility that has struck Newey designed cars.

For Mclaren they have finally found the winning formula again after winning a track that everyone thought Red Bull would walk, however , like in 2010 and 2009, it has come too late and has cost them a shot at the title, but Mclaren really have been Red Bulls only consistent challenger this year due to the surprise lack of speed from the Ferraris.

It hasn't been a great season for Ferrari, in pre season all the signs pointed towards a very strong year for the Scuderia, but it was apparent early on that they were only the third fastest team behind Mclaren (whose pre season was shocking in comparison). After an early season shuffle and because of new regulations they were able to win in Silverstone but that has been the only highlight for Fernando Alonso and as for Massa it has been even worse.

Going into Korea we go into the real unknown as it is unclear who has the best package suited to Korea as the only race we've had at the circuit was severely rain affected so it should be a jump into the darkness, although it will be an even bigger jump when we go to India in the not too distant future.

So congratulations Seb, who is starting to rewrite the record books almost with the ease that Schumacher did in his pomp. Eight world championships for Seb by the time he's finished?

For Galahads brilliant circuit write up, see here http://cliptheapex.com/pages/korean-international-circuit/

 

[tooncheese]

Why did they put DRS there of all places. It should be on the second straight as there are a couple of lines through T3, and how could it ever be good to open the wing when they're all ready in 6th gear? Better placed DRS would have given us a battle and not a whimper at the end.

 

[Brogan]

Excellent defending by Hamilton for something like 10 laps?
I was convinced he was going to end up in 5th the way he was struggling to keep Mark behind.

This race more than any though just underlines the dominance of the RB7.

For a few brief laps I thought that Hamilton may have had a chance but that quickly evaporated once Vettel started to pull away each lap.

Congratulations to Red Bull for doing the double double.

 

[Brogan]

One thing I didn't notice (probably due to fast forwarding through the "race"...) was whether Petrov was penalised for trying to merge his car with Schumacher's.

I don't recall seeing anything about it, despite Schumacher being taken out of the race and Petrov managing to continue.

Edit: Just seen the FIA site, he has been given a 5 place grid drop at the next race.

 

[no-FIAt-please]

I think they both pitted around lap 35 for soft tyres, so (if I'm right) Hamilton defended for 20 laps. Looks like McLaren compromised their race pace for qualifying. Clearly Red Bull have both, McLaren havn't realised to set the car up for good race pace, (barring unforseen circumstances) they'd qualify on the 2nd row and beat the Red Bulls on pace.

One thing I didn't notice (probably due to fast forwarding through the "race"...) was whether Senna was penalised for trying to merge his car with Schumacher's.

I don't recall seeing anything about it, despite Schumacher being taken out of the race and Senna managing to continue.

That was Petrov and he's recieved a 5 place grid penalty for India and a reprimand.

 

[Brogan]

Yeah, I just edited my post after checking the FIA site.

 

[Bullet190]

Like the Schumi/Perez incident recently it was a racing incident. The punishments should have been the same for both these incidents, even Schumi said it was just a racing incident. FIA at it's best again.

 

[Vortex]

I think their logic being Schumacher didn’t take Perez out of the race but Petrov did take someone out.

 

[tranquility2k9]

Excellent defending by Hamilton for something like 10 laps?
I was convinced he was going to end up in 5th the way he was struggling to keep Mark behind.

This race more than any though just underlines the dominance of the RB7.

For a few brief laps I thought that Hamilton may have had a chance but that quickly evaporated once Vettel started to pull away each lap.

Congratulations to Red Bull for doing the double double.

It was actually much more than 10 laps - just looked at this document:- http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/f1_media/Documents/kor-race-history.pdf

From lap 27 on-wards Webber was within a second or less of Hamilton for pretty much the rest of the race, so 28 laps (over half the race).

I also thought Hamilton would end up 5th or have to pit again. I thought his tyres had gone off but it turns out they hadn't as he set his fastest lap on lap 54, however, he clearly wasn't happy with the car setup, as also with Jenson.

Hopefully now they've got a pole they'll focus more on the race at India because up till recently McLaren were always behind in qualifying but faster in the race, whereas now the exact opposite is happening.

 

[no-FIAt-please]

I think their logic being Schumacher didn’t take Perez out of the race but Petrov did take someone out.

Yes but the actual term is "casuing an avoidable collision" not ruining another driver's race. Both Schumacher and Petrov ploughed into the back of a competitor and hence both should recieve the same treatment. Great stewarding again.

 

[racecub]

But Alonso was freshly on new soft tyres at the end. Thats why his pace was so much quicker than Massa's at that point. When they were together they were either close or massa was pulling a gap. Not keen on Massa's recent behaviour but pleased to see him out there fighting. Thats what he needs to keep doing.

 

[tranquility2k9]

Very interesting. It has transpired that Lewis was losing "a significant amount of down force from his front-wing" from debris rubber and also Jenson the same, but less so, due to a rock damaging his front wing. It goes some way to explaining his poor pace compared to Vettel, but gives hope to McLaren being able to challenge at the next race.

It's also nice to see Martin Whitmarsh praising Lewis on his fantastic drive, he deserves that praise for the drive he did, especially now it transpires his car was near undrivable!

"Martin Whitmarsh, McLaren team principal
“I think Lewis’ drive today was utterly inspirational. He may be downplaying it, because he’s a perfectionist and he wanted to win, but to withstand such enormous pressure, for lap after lap, from a faster car, was a drive absolutely worthy of the great champions.

“His finishing position may only go down in the history books as another second place, but, make no mistake, this was a fantastic drive; beautifully assured and perfectly judged.

“To cap it all, the data showed that he was losing a significant amount of downforce from his front wing. After the race, we inspected Lewis’s front-wing and discovered that the left-hand slot-gap had become filled with congealed tyre rubber, doubtless a result of the marbles on the track.

“As a result, he was suffering with masses of understeer, which further hurts the tyres. In the circumstances, his was an absolutely fantastic drive because it would have been all too easy to have gone backwards when faced with such massive, and constant, pressure.

“Equally, Jenson posted another brilliant, measured drive. On Jenson’s car, too, we discovered after the race that he was also hurting from damage to his car - caused by a rock hitting the front-win. The resulting understeer doubtless also impaired Jenson’s ability to close down Mark in the track’s final sector, and therefore meant he was unable to mount a sustained attack in the DRS zone and secure third.

“Nevertheless, today showed that we have a very good racing car. But, more importantly, it showed that we have two brilliant racing drivers, who will fight from the start of the race to the end and who will never give up.

“Their spirited drives today are a just reward for the whole Vodafone McLaren Mercedes team, who have spent the last fortnight away from their homes, families and friends. While we must all acknowledge the great achievement of Red Bull Racing in securing the constructors’ championship today, I also want to pay tribute to the efforts and sacrifices made by our whole team over these past two weeks. They enabled us to score 65 world championship points in the last two races - a total that now consolidates our position in the constructors’ championship. So, after two fantastic races in Japan and Korea, I want to say a heartfelt ‘thank-you’ to the whole team. There are three races remaining in 2011 - and I know I speak for everyone when I say we want to win all three.”"

 

[Fenderman]

Hmm, he's been reading Clip and hearing fans in his nightmares. and, I agree with everything he's said. I hope he says all that behind the scenes as well not just to the media.

 

[Jos the Boss]

If it wasnt for Petrov my prediction would of been right

 

[tranquility2k9]

How much is 10 points of downforce worth time wise?

Whitmarsh: " "Whether that is damage or debris or something else caught in the front wing, so Lewis lost about 10 points of downforce, which meant it was a bit of a handful."

 

[Vortex]

Well its not as bad as 11 but its worse than 9, hope that clears it up for you.

 

[tranquility2k9]

Hmm, I've seen Whitmarsh say earlier in the season that 30 points of down force is worth around a second a lap, so 10 points would be 3 or 4 tenths, but in Hamilton's case, seeming as the down force loss was all in one area, rather than over the car as a whole, he could have been losing even more time because of it.

It probably means that without those issues, Hamilton could have taken the fight to Vettel. Even just 0.3 sec per lap over a 55 lap race equates to 16.5 seconds.

 

[riskitall]

seems like lewis was struggling with understeer,which we all know he doesnt like.it'll be interesting to see if he has the same problem in the next race.if so then it looks like they are making changes to suit jenson more,because jenson does like understeer.

 

[Bill Boddy]

It seems that everyone is assuming that Hamilton was the only one to have tyre debris caught up in their wing. I would be surprised if that were to be true given the amount of marbles all the way round the trap. Maybe the teams should put chicken wire around the front of the wing.

I wonder what time the patent office opens....

 

[The Artist.....]

It seems that everyone is assuming that Hamilton was the only one to have tyre debris caught up in their wing. I would be surprised if that were to be true given the amount of marbles all the way round the trap. Maybe the teams should put chicken wire around the front of the wing.

I wonder what time the patent office opens....

.... Ah but would that really help? Or would it just give huge 70's style front wings made completely out of tyre marbles???

 

[Il_leone]

Petrov rightly got punished because that was amateurish to run into Schumacher

A bit different with Schumacher/ Perez because they were racing each other at the point of contact but Perez did not lose anything in the end and Schumacher was out of the race

Here Petrov took Schumacher out who was clear in front of him to see so deserves punishment