Grand Prix 2011 Malaysian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Typical F1.
You wait months for a race and then 2 come along in the space of a few weeks.

This weekend will see the 13th race at the Sepang circuit; will it be unlucky for some?
For a most excellent circuit write-up, see Galahad's musings here, along with enough stat's and data to satisfy the most ardent of nerds: Sepang International Circuit

2009 is remembered for the later start and torrential rain which resulted in the race being red flagged after 33 laps; making it only the fifth race in F1 history to be stopped before 75% of the distance had been completed.

Ferrari and McLaren will no doubt be aiming to make it into Q2 after their amateurish mistakes last year.
With rain forecast for the weekend though, the chances of one or more of the top drivers making a mistake is fairly high.

This race is probably make or break for HRT.
If they don't manage to qualify within 107% of the fastest time in Q1 and are once again stopped from participating in the Grand Prix, then you have to assume it's all over for them.

So, lots to look forward to. Let's hope it's not a Red Bull walkover and qualifying is a lot closer than Australia.

 

[Hamberg]

Are you suggesting by that statement that Lewis comitted any offence at all? (other than just not being quick enough to stop Alonso smacking him up the rear).

I'm sure that Hamberg was referring to Vettel's weaving at the first corner while trying to defend from Lewis.

Yes I was - Vettel wasn't trying to find a space and was clearly defending making 3 or 4 rapid moves in quick succession. I don't like the rule particularly anyway - but the fact that Hamilton's driving was pulled out as a brilliant piece of driving, nobody spotted it, yet Massa's was complained about and Vettel's was very clear (and mentioned on the forum) has to raise the question of consistency - or lack of.

As for the punishments - these things happen in penalties that it may or may not in reality punish a driver. They should never have been given in the first place.

 

[Jen]

However, Alonso's penalty was wrong because he's basically got away scot-free and his crime is a much clearer pen than Lewis'

It was a racing incident and neither should have been penalised. Alonso didn't get away scot free - if you recall he had to pit for a new nose and lost position

 

[Alonso_McLaren]

Haven't Hamilton and Alonso been told that real racing is banned in F1?

 

[Hamberg]

So this is ok in F1?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpDiBXcf-RU

 

[Brogan]

I'd like to refer everyone to this thread: http://cliptheapex.com/threads/interpreting-fia-rules-and-the-consistent-application-of-them.2344/

Same old inconsistent application of the rules.
It's nothing new.

 

[Hamberg]

And I'd like to refer you all to this! http://cliptheapex.com/threads/is-overtaking-overrated.1024/page-3#post-33103

Seriously though, with DRS and KERS how are they meant to race now if slight direction changes are penalised?

 

[Brogan]

Seriously though, with DRS and KERS how are they meant to race now if slight direction changes by some drivers but not others are penalised?

Fixed that for you.

 

[Hamberg]

 

[Brogan]

I wonder who it was who approached the stewards with regards to Hamilton's "weaving"?

I presume it was initiated by Ferrari, as there was no notification during the race that Hamilton was under investigation.

 

[Jen]

I wonder who it was who approached the stewards with regards to Hamilton's "weaving"?

I presume it was initiated by Ferrari, as there was no notification during the race that Hamilton was under investigation.

I have noticed that we get the most ridiculous decisions when the stewards make their own call - I expect they felt that their "talent" had been under-utilised today so decided to remedy it.

Beware the person who feels left out!

 

[teabagyokel]

Can they appeal?

No.

Are you suggesting by that statement that Lewis comitted any offence at all? (other than just not being quick enough to stop Alonso smacking him up the rear).

I'm afraid the law is an ass on this one, but he was against the book, I'm afraid. However, the incident in question was not where he was smacked up the rear by Alonso.

I'm sure that Hamberg was referring to Vettel's weaving at the first corner while trying to defend from Lewis.

Vettel is by no means the only person weaving at the start, practically everyone was weaving to some degree. If you punish the entire field, it all cancels out.

What irritates me is the non-punishment of Alonso, by the book Lewis is bang-to-rights, even if the writer of the book is a jackass.

 

[F1Yorkshire]

If excessive weaving down the start/finish straight isn't allowed why wasn't Vettel reprimanded after his finishing celebrations before the line?

 

[teabagyokel]

If excessive weaving down the start/finish straight isn't allowed why wasn't Vettel reprimanded after his finishing celebrations before the line?

I do hope you're not serious with that question.

 

[Hamberg]

Vettel is by no means the only person weaving at the start, practically everyone was weaving to some degree.

Are you kidding? Everyone else at the start were trying to gain position and get into any available space whilst not hitting anyone.

Vettel had nobody ahead or besides him. His eyes were in his mirrors and blocked Hamilton on at least 3 occasions - at the end of a long start straight.

Also penalties are penalties - 20 seconds is the standard post race penalty. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't. That's a case of poo happens.

 

[Jen]

What irritates me is the non-punishment of Alonso, by the book Lewis is bang-to-rights, even if the writer of the book is a jackass.

I seem to recall that Alonso received a 20 second penalty - a punishment in my book - plus a trip to the pits

What exactly was/is his offence?

Daring to try for an overtake?

Being capable of misjudgement?

Or just being Alonso?

 

[F1Yorkshire]

I do hope you're not serious with that question.

My other half asked the question which got me thinking what is the actual regulation that relates to weaving. If we are following the letter of the law then all incidents should be investigated.

 

[teabagyokel]

I seem to recall that Alonso received a 20 second penalty - a punishment in my book - plus a trip to the pits

What exactly was/is his offence?

Running into the back of someone. But a 20 second penalty, applied after you finish 20 seconds clear of the next man, is no punishment.

 

[EvilWhippet]

But Alonso tried to make a move (if he didnt I'd be annoyed, it's why I watch) and it didn't come off. It was an event in the race, an incident, without incidents we wouldn't watch. The fact that it visibly penalised Alonso much more than anybody else cements my opinion that the stewards should've left it alone.

Nobody would be crying injusticew if Alonso hadn't been given the 20 sec pen. He screwed up his own race with the Hamilton manouver. Why watch F1 if all the incidents are scrutinized and penalised? That's like going to see Frankie Boyle and asking for a refund because it offended you!

 

[Hamberg]

My other half asked the question which got me thinking what is the actual regulation that relates to weaving. If we are following the letter of the law then all incidents should be investigated.

The term weaving is misleading.

The rule is 20.2 Manoeuvres liable to hinder other drivers, such as more than one change of direction to defend a position...are not permitted.

Which is why they can weave all they like if not defending. This is why 'technically' Hamilton was in the wrong, but also why 'technically' so was Vettel at the start and 'technically' so was Massa last race.

 

[Jen]

Running into the back of someone. But a 20 second penalty, applied after you finish 20 seconds clear of the next man, is no punishment.

Perhaps they deemed the resulting damage and consequent grid drop sufficient. They could hardly give Hamilton a 20 second penalty and Alonso more - since neither actually warranted censure.