Grand Prix 2012 Italian Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

After a long summer break, F1 has it's second race in a week as the circus rolls onto Monza for the last European race of the season and the season is finely poised as Championship protagonists Alonso and Hamilton failed to score after a lap one crash in Belgium. McLaren team-mate Button took his second win of the season to keep alive his Championship hopes and is 'only' just over 60 points behind Alonso and 16 points behind Hamilton.

Just as Spa is famous as a historical track, Monza is similar. Monza is the definition of speed and is one of the most famous tracks in history. But it's a track that has seen as much tragedy as success with several drivers losing their lives at the circuit, notably Ronnie Petersen and Jochen Rindt. This led to modifications in the circuit with the banking sections no longer used and chicanes added in to slow the cars down with the last change being in 2000 with a change to the first corner. However, drivers are still at full throttle for the majority of the lap and it presents a major challenge to the driver, even if overtaking isn't the easiest.

Going into the Italian Grand Prix, McLaren seem to be in the best form after taking 2 victories in the last two races but were very Jekyll and Hyde as in Hungary, Hamilton won as Button struggled, and in Belgium Button won while Hamilton crashed, but we will never know how Hamilton would have got on in the race but he was certainly not the happiest after believing a wrong rear choice hampered him in qualifying as he was eight tenths behind his team mate who took his first pole position since the Monaco Grand Prix in 2009.

Alonso's DNF played into the hands of Red Bull and especially Vettel who nearly halved the deficit to Alonso despite not making Q3 he took advantage of the carnage at the start, allied with some strong overtaking, notably at the last chicane to finish second and reduce the gap to less than a race victory. Webber also benefited despite not finishing on the podium as he reduced the gap to 32 points and only 8 points behind his team-mate. A race win in Ferrari's home territory for either Webber or Vettel would really strike home at Maranello and reduce the gap to almost nothing and would be a major psychological boost, just as it would if a McLaren driver takes the flag on Sunday.

The big disappointment of Belgium was Lotus, many expected them to be fighting for the win and had said that they had the best package going into the weekend, but their only produce was a third for Raikkonen, some way off the leaders after spending much of the first half of the race fighting with Schumacher. Team mate Grosjean caused a huge crash at turn one and as a result is banned from this weekends race as punishment. Lotus will be extremely disappointed not to have turned a very strong car and good performances into a win with 2nd place being the highest they've finished so far this season and a few times both drivers have been on the podium but the top step has been elusive. They won't be too confident of changing that in Monza as the track doesn't suit their strengths and they could well be behind McLaren, Red Bull and Ferrari in terms of raw pace. However, just like in 2003, Raikkonen's consistency and abilty to bring the car home in the points means he's 4th in the Championship and is a major part of the championship despite having yet to win a race.

Mercedes certainly have the quickest car in a straight line and that will make them very competitive, as shown in 2011, but they suffer from very poor rear tyre wear which affects their traction and with slow chicanes that will cost them on Sunday but they could act as the joker in the pack with a strong qualifying performance and it was this that compromised Hamilton's race in 2011 as he was stuck behind Schumacher for the early part.

For Galahad's write up on the circuit - http://cliptheapex.com/pages/autodromo-nazionale-monza/
 
Anyone else think that Maldonado getting a grid drop is wrong?
No!!! He could hardly have been given a drive through at Spa could he? He was out of the race, and he wasn't out of the race because of his jump start he was out because of his inability to not crash into other drivers, I used to defend him but really, he has gone beyond the pale now, he needs to be taught a lesson.

In my opinion he too should have had been given race ban...
 
If Maldonado hadn't jumped the start the drivers around him, including Hamilton, would have reacted differently; Grosjean may then have been a foot or two further back relative to Hamilton, would have seen him on his right hand side and the whole thing may never have happened.
 
Chad Stewarthill.....Thats true Chad, but in saying that drivers at this level should also be able to control their own reactions without allowing their emotions to compound what had in this case, developed into a dangerous situation. It's expecting a lot but should be a part of the reactive skills at this level. In reality Grosjean when he saw Maldonado's jumped start, his instinctive reaction should have computed going when the lights turn red knowing Maldonado would get a penalty instead of reacting to it and trying to make up ground on someone he knew would be penalized.
 
Chad Stewarthill that type of speculation is impossible to prove or disprove and so by it's very nature is completely moot, all I saw was Romain swerve violently to his right without any rhyme nor reason, what I didn't see is Pastors jump start having anything to do with his actions.

What happened, happened and that is all the stewards (And I.) are interested in, speculating on alternate outcomes is a completely pointless exercise.
 
Have McLaren developed Double DRS over the Summer?
In Monza:
mcla-butt-monz-2012-2-886x590.webp

In Belgium:
mcla-butt-spaf-20121-886x590.webp

In Hungary:
mcla-hami-hung-2012-21.webp
 
Kewee and Mephistopheles, in athletics it is common that a false start by one competitor will directly trigger movement by another (or others). That's why reaction times are now used to identify the offender and why the rule is strictly enforced. There is also a false start rule in NFL football. A mere twitch by one offensive lineman before the snap can trigger movement by a colleague or an opponent, or both. It's nothing to do with level of skill, but rather an involuntary reaction, to be affected by a false start around you.

At Spa, the commentators mentioned at the time that Maldonado's jump would have more than likely had an effect on Hamilton's getaway. Unlike athletics or football, if a false start happens in F1 the race continues rather than being stopped and re-started, so the chain reaction continues to affect the race.

While not excusing Grosjean's actions in any way, as he clearly shouldn't have pushed Hamilton onto the grass and his one race ban was perfectly justified in my view, all those around and behind Maldonado will have been affected by his premature movement, so I do believe that he caused a chain reaction which had more than a little to do with the calamity that followed.

Anyway, as this thread is about the Italian Grand Prix not the Belgian one, I'll stop now and just finish by saying I'm glad that neither Grosjean nor Maldonado (hopefully, given the pace of the Mclaren in practice) will be anywhere near Jenson or Lewis on Sunday's grid.
 
Abnash24 great pictures, but can you give us a clue as to what we're meant to be looking for?

I wouldn't be surprised if Mclaren have put their DDRS on for Monza, as they are known to have been developing it. Didn't they say they weren't racing it at Spa because all the wet practice had prevented them from testing it?
 
Interesting talk on McLaren pit radio. Hamilton's engineer telling him that Alonso ran really wide after Ascari and that it will be allowed in qualifying.


Pit to Lewis: “You're still the fastest car in sectors 1 and 2. ALO has just pipped us overall; he's fast in sector 3.”

Pit to Lewis: “The guys say ALO ran very wide at the exit of Ascari in sector 3. That will be allowed in qualifying.”

LH: “Did he run right over the Astroturf?”

Pit to Lewis: “I'll find out for you.”

Pit to Lewis: “ALO's tyre was one foot outside the white line at Ascari. Not a massive amount, but a bit.”
 
Vettel had to stop in P3 due to a KERS issue:
Battery, low battery. Stop the car in a safe place.
Stop the car?
Yes, stop the car.
Ok, stop.

Hopefully it's nothing too drastic and can be sorted before qualifying.
 
Ron Dennis seen prowling around the McLaren garage in team kit in FP3

He was also having a little chat with Luca. I was watching the practice without commentary so I could hear exactly what they were saying. After a few seconds on camera, Luca put his hand on Ron's shoulder and says "It's so good to see you", to which ron replied the same.

Those guys have had a few battles over the years huh?
 
So will we see Alonso going out just behind Massa to try and benefit from a tow?

It would make sense for Ferrari to do that.

Edit: Whitmarsh just said some teams were practising that, although it looked a bit one sided to him :D
 
Alonso and Ferrari trying to be too clever and failing spectacularly.

Alonso should have just driven his own lap, instead of trying to get help from someone else.
 
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