Grand Prix 2014 German Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

The races are now coming thick and fast and the Drivers Championship is warming up nicely after Nico Rosberg's first DNF of the season gave a relatively easy win to Lewis Hamilton. The circus moves on now to Germany, at the emasculated Hockenheim circuit.

Last year Vettel won the first home race of his career. This year I'm sure another German driver, in the shape of Nico Rosberg, will be hoping this will be his turn. After Lewis won his home race maybe Mercedes will have something predetermined (oops, I've just started the first conspiracy theory).

Outside of both Mercedes cars failing it's hard to see any other team winning. Should the Silver Arrows falter Williams are looking best placed to pick something up but I suspect it's more likely to be a podium for either Massa or Bottas. McLaren appeared to find some pace at Silverstone, maybe their technical team have finally realised they have the best engine on the grid and should, perhaps, take advantage of it. Red Bull will also be looking to pick up the crumbs and, as appears to be the pattern, Ricciardo is more likely benefit than Vettel.

The Force India cars were off the pace in Silverstone, perhaps Hockenheim will better suit them. I'm sure the other Nico will want to put on a good show for his home crowd. It will be interesting to see which German midfield runner Fernando Alonso chooses to have a fight with. His preference most races has been Nico Hulkenberg but at Silverstone he decided to have a fight with Sebastian Vettel, which was quite entertaining.

Toro Rosso will be just behind the Ferrari's and Red Bull's, maybe collecting point or two. Of the other teams Lotus will just ahead of Sauber, the biggest question will be who will crash into whom during the race. Marussia and Caterham will fighting to be last, with Caterham almost certain to win that battle.

I forgot to mention Kimi Raikkonen. Hopefully he will be fully recovered for the German race but, on current form, Ferrari might look to stick someone else in the car.

Did I mention I'll be there? Well I will. Look out for a fat bloke with two kids waving like a tit at the camera. Maybe I'll put some Union Jack underpants on my head, that should please the German TV director :D Bring on the frites and wurst!
 
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Il_leone said:
Hockenheim the old circuit was a car killer but actually there was not much overtaking if I remember despite 3 straights with chicane to follow

I don't mind the new circuit because it actually promotes overtaking
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Really? The most famous "overtake" is the "Alonso is faster than you".
 
I think it's going to be fascinating to see, should the FRIC suspension ban come into tuition, how much Mercedes advantage will decrease. If it deteriorates, great! Means even more exciting races. If not, then bloody hell what have Mercedes got in this car that makes it so quick!??
 
Although I miss the original Hockenheim, I don't mind the truncated version - at least we tend to get more exciting races. I remember a certain one-handed charge from 13th to 2nd in 2004 in particular...;)

The Nurburgring was better before they added the fiddly extra loop, but it's never been that great a circuit IMO. I am always disappointed when it crops up on Gran Tursimo (not the Norschleife though - that's splendid!).
 
I fairness, the old Hockenheim wasn't a great race track but watching some of the races in the mid-80's with the drivers trying to wrestle the 1000bhp turbo monsters through the stadium section with no wing, as they were set up for the super fast blast out into the country side and back, was quite fascinating.
 
FB said:
I fairness, the old Hockenheim wasn't a great race track but watching some of the races in the mid-80's with the drivers trying to wrestle the 1000bhp turbo monsters through the stadium section with no wing, as they were set up for the super fast blast out into the country side and back, was quite fascinating.
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The difference between the stadium section and the long straights made the old track more challenging than the high-downforce nature of the new track. In the 80s there were much more high-speed circuits (Monza, Hockenheim, Österreichring, Paul Ricard, Silverstone) compared to nowadays (only Monza), so I think it's a shame that increasingly more tracks are redesigned to form an "average" track, as we already have plenty of them.
 
Absolutely Monkeyhead , there has been for many years now a tendency towards making tracks more and more alike. Monza is the only truly super-fast track left on the calendar and because the demands there are different to what they are anywhere else the form-book tends to be different too.
When all tracks are becoming largely indistinguishable from one another to the casual observer it's bad for racing and bad for the championship. Whoever is fastest at any given track is just as likely to fastest anywhere else.
 
My memories of the old Hockenheim was that it was nigh on impossible to overtake. For instance, in 1992, Nigel Mansell in the vastly superior Williams Renault, with new tyres could only overtake Senna by jumping the chicane and getting the run on him on the next straight! The track always seemed too narrow to allow proper racing, and couldn't be widened due to the forest on either side!

The new circuit has much more racing possibilities; for instance, remember Button's drive from 14th in 2004, when he was driving one handed for much of the race.

Certainly, the new circuit for me is far better than the Nurburgring.

New Hockenheim>old Hockenheim>new nurburgring.
 
I think the main reason why overtaking was more difficult than you'd think at the old Hockenheim was the huge part played by raw engine power. If your engine wasn't more powerful than the guy in front's there was virtually no chance you'd get past on those long straights and Senna and Mansell in 92 was a good example. The Renault that year was probably the best compromise over the course of a season, good torque and excellent driveability but at Hockenheim, raw power was key, and Honda, who had switched to the V12 that year, was in its element there.

It was a bit different at the height of the turbo era, where fuel consumption was a critical factor in races, and there were more overtaking there before 1988.Drivers could save fuel in the tow of other cars and turn up the boost when they ready to launch an attack.

Still, it does say something about the blandness of new tracks when for the second Grand Prix in three, roughly half the number of posts on GP discussion threads have been spent discussing the merits of the tracks' previous layouts.
 
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TEABAGYOKEL's 2014 SO FAR

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Road of Bones said:
Although I miss the original Hockenheim, I don't mind the truncated version - at least we tend to get more exciting races. I remember a certain one-handed charge from 13th to 2nd in 2004 in particular...;)

The Nurburgring was better before they added the fiddly extra loop, but it's never been that great a circuit IMO. I am always disappointed when it crops up on Gran Tursimo (not the Norschleife though - that's splendid!).
Click to expand


The Norschleife was a beast of a circuit can't remember which game I played it on - I had try and do a lap in 10 minutes in the snow and it was impossible
 

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