Politics The Politics thread

Bill Boddy

Professional layabout
Premium Contributor
It could be quite interesting with Johnson not being able to do anything without the opposition's say so; this includes calling a general election.

Had the brexiteers not reneged on what they said during up to the referendum and agreed to remain members of the Free Market and the Customs Union we would now be well into negotiations on the exit deal.

Johnson was very foolish when he decided to bully those who opposed him over voting against him. It reminds me of when I was at school and we got to the point where Cromwell had died and Charles II was invited to be King: he agreed to the oblivion of friends and indemnity of enemies.

 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
Finally, some good news.

After the supreme court refused to get involved with state partisan gerrymandering, a panel of state judges ruled that the legislative maps violate the state constitution and must be redrawn.


It's incredible that the republicans got away with it for so long, considering the evidence.

Some guy called Hoffeler had secret formulae, tables, and charts to ensure that the republicans had a voting majority in every district.


table.png

Here's the 357 page ruling if anyone's interested :D https://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/athena/files/2019/09/03/5d6ec7bee4b0cdfe0576ee09.pdf

If anyone's wondering where the term gerrymandering comes from: Gerrymandering - Wikipedia
he term is named after Elbridge Gerry, who, as Governor of Massachusetts in 1812, signed a bill that created a partisan district in the Boston area that was compared to the shape of a mythological salamander.
 

Ruslan

Points Scorer
Finally, some good news.

After the supreme court refused to get involved with state partisan gerrymandering, a panel of state judges ruled that the legislative maps violate the state constitution and must be redrawn.


It's incredible that the republicans got away with it for so long, considering the evidence.

Some guy called Hoffeler had secret formulae, tables, and charts to ensure that the republicans had a voting majority in every district.


View attachment 12845

Here's the 357 page ruling if anyone's interested :D https://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/athena/files/2019/09/03/5d6ec7bee4b0cdfe0576ee09.pdf

If anyone's wondering where the term gerrymandering comes from: Gerrymandering - Wikipedia
Well, the whine I got from my Republican friends back in the early 1990s was that they could not secure control of the House because of Democratic gerrymandering. Now, there was naturally some of that going on.....but the real reason was that they weren't that popular. But, after the 2000 census, they took that lesson to heart and executed it with a vengeance. So, it was extremely unprincipled when used against them....but when they got in power, they did it beyond all bounds. Politics seems to generate more hypocrisy than it does principles.

The next census is in 2020.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
I despise gerrymandering no matter who does it.

Both parties are guilty but as far as I can tell, the Republicans are particularly egregious.

Hopefully this ruling is the start of the end of it, or at least reigns it in.
 

Ruslan

Points Scorer
I despise gerrymandering no matter who does it.

Both parties are guilty but as far as I can tell, the Republicans are particularly egregious.

Hopefully this ruling is the start of the end of it, or at least reigns it in.
It definitely needs to be reigned it. I don't recall the courts being involved in this issue before. As it is, they will only correct the most egregious cases. The sharper divides now in the political spectrum by race, heritage, religious beliefs, urban/rural, income, education, etc....have made this all the more possible. It also seems we are becoming incapable of indignation anymore. It is now all "situational ethics."
 

Angel

🧸 Smile, it might never happen.
Contributor
What gethinceri says :(

There is never going to be an end to this is there? I think they all want us all to end up losing our minds!
 
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Greenlantern101

Super Hero And All Round Good Guy
Contributor
Prediction.
No no-deal bill passed today.
Borris calls for a general election Oct 15
Corbyn is fished in 2/3Rd vote for it.
1 hour before parliament is prorouged
Boris changes election date to November 1st.
As no parliament business can be done during the shut down and the 5 week election period no deal is set.
We leave Oct 31st with no deal.
Nov 1st Boris wins election.
 
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Angel

🧸 Smile, it might never happen.
Contributor
Well the proroguing of parliament is legal according to the Scottish judge.

Now Jeremy Corbyn has said he and Labour won't vote a General Election, even though they've been calling for one for months, you couldn't make it up!!! :s
 

Bill Boddy

Professional layabout
Premium Contributor
Boris Johnson said that the Conservatives who voted against him would not be allowed to stand in future elections. But can he do this?


"Current MPs wishing to stand again require a majority from association members."

So it is the Association who decide in this: it may well be that the Association members may decide to follow his word but he does not have the right to demand it. But then, we are used to him coming out with things that he has not thought out.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
So Johnson has lost the first vote and if it passed in full later tonight, it "will force the PM to ask for an extension to 31 October Brexit deadline if a deal has not been agreed with the EU. "

And if the EU says no?

(Which they have already said they will if there is no compelling reason to extend again.)
 

Titch

Champion Elect
Premium Contributor
Then we are thrown out of the EU without a deal. Parliament in meltdown, a leader without a parliamentary majority and total chaos. It’s frightening.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
The no deal issue is being made to be bigger than it actually is.

Yes, there will undoubtedly be some issues in the short term, but over time new trade and movement deals will be announced and things will stabilise.

The EU does as much business with the UK as the UK does with it.
More, in fact.
Thee EU, taken as a whole is the UK’s largest trading partner. In 2018, UK exports to the EU were £289 billion (46% of all UK exports). UK imports from the EU were £345 billion (54% of all UK imports).
 

cider_and_toast

Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex
Staff member
Premium Contributor
How much as a percentage of the whole EU was their exports to the UK?

54 percent of our imports may come from the EU but that may only equal 5 percent of EU exports. So to say we get more from them than we give them is a bit of a misnomer.
 

Brogan

🦶 Leg end
Staff member
I didn't mean to imply that the impact would be more for them, it was just purely the monetary value which is higher, not a percentage of GDP/trade.

The EU had a net surplus of ~£65 billion as far as UK imports/exports are concerned - that's not an insignificant amount of money.
Based on this article, the total of £345 billion is somewhere around 8%-18% of their exports: Does the EU need us more than we need them?

Even so, it is still £345 billion spent by the UK in EU countries, so they would definitely feel that if it was to cease overnight.

As that article puts it:
All these figures point in the same direction. The UK looks more exposed in the event of disruption to trade relations.

That is not to say the impact on the EU would be trivial, far from it.

The EU 27 would undoubtedly face significant economic harm from major disturbances to their trade with the UK.
But yes, there's no doubt that it would have a bigger impact on the UK overall.
 

FB

Not my cup of cake
Valued Member
The EU 27 Germany would undoubtedly face significant economic harm from major disturbances to their trade with the UK.

Just thought that needed correcting

FYI - the UK's largest trading partners in Europe are Germany (cars), Belgium (cars) and Spain (cars). Meanwhile the EU has signed a free trade deal with Japan which will encourage them to move all the car plants they have in the UK back to Japan. Well done the EU, looking after all of the Member States there!
 
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