Current Haas

Discussion in 'Teams' started by Greenlantern101, Sep 29, 2015.

  1. Il_leone

    Il_leone Champion Elect

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    why are people questioning it now , given they (Haas) explored a loophole when they first joined F1 ? if Haas was at the back of the grid and going slowly like last season then no one would care which they were . They gave up at the end of last season and started focusing on 2018 before most teams
     
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  3. Bill Boddy

    Bill Boddy Professional layabout Premium Contributor

    Did they get off scot free then?
     
  4. siffert_fan

    siffert_fan Too old to watch the Asian races live. Contributor

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    FB and cider_and_toast like this.
  5. siffert_fan

    siffert_fan Too old to watch the Asian races live. Contributor

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    I have to agree with this assertion:

    F1 stewards influenced by drivers' reputation - Haas
     
  6. Il_leone

    Il_leone Champion Elect

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    This is nothing new - the big drivers seems to get away with more - Senna, Schumacher, Alonso , Vettel,Hamilton - they all have gotten away with things which bordered on marginal and controversial
     
  7. The Artist.....

    The Artist..... Champion Elect

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    Grosjean has been disqualified from Monza due to an illegal floor,

    The twist is that Haas knew it was illegal, but ran it anyway
    FIA says Haas knew Grosjean's floor was illegal but ran it anyway

    The last time a team tried to cheat like this was BAR in 2005; they faced a 2 race ban for deliberate cheating...
     
  8. Il_leone

    Il_leone Champion Elect

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    Well that is going to have some serious repurcussions if the accusations are true , it might go as far as disqualifying Haas from the constructors championship
     
  9. Angel

    Angel Pole Sitter Supporter

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    If they knew they were cheating and did it anyway, they deserve to be disqualified. If they're not punished robustly what's to stop them all cheating?
     
  10. siffert_fan

    siffert_fan Too old to watch the Asian races live. Contributor

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    According to the article, at the start of the summer break, the FIA told them, and other teams, that the floor should be changed.
    They told the FIA that they were dependent on their suppliers and the change might not be done until Singapore. The FIA did NOT prohibit their using it, they just said that if they did use it and another team challenged it, they could be disqualified from that race.

    HOW is that "cheating"?
     
  11. RasputinLives

    RasputinLives Not dead Contributor

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    FIA being as pro-active with the rules as ever there. "We're not going to decide. We'll wait to see if any of the teams have an opinion". Joke.
     
    gethinceri likes this.
  12. Angel

    Angel Pole Sitter Supporter

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    Running something you know is breaking the rules is very much cheating to me. So the FIA didn't say you absolutely can't do it but they did warn them they'd disqualify them if it was challenged because it's illegal. So how is using it not cheating? If they'd used it without knowing it was illegal it wouldn't be cheating, knowing it wasn't allowed and still using it to me can't be seen as anything other than cheating.

    For me the FIA are just as in the wrong as Haas for allowing it too.
     
  13. RasputinLives

    RasputinLives Not dead Contributor

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    it's not cheating because they said up front to the ruling body they were going to use it for the next two Grand Prix and the ruling body didn't tell them they couldn't. How many times has it gone through scrutineering and passed since the summer break?

    If you cast your minds back to last year Merc ran an engine for two races (Belgium and Monza actually) that contradicted rules the FIA brought in. They were allowed to run them due to the expense it would be to change them. They put an engine that was within the rules back in their car by Singapore. What's the difference? Well Mercedes bring far more investment and shout louder.
     
    siffert_fan likes this.
  14. Angel

    Angel Pole Sitter Supporter

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    See we clearly have differing ideas about cheating. To me, if you know the rules and do something that you know is breaking them, that's cheating. The fact the governing body allows you to do it doesn't make it any better and how they can allow it and let it through scrutineering I don't know. What's the point of having any rules at all if you're going to allow them to be broken that way? Where do you draw the line on that? When have you broken the rules enough to be penalised for it?

    Maybe I'm just a stickler for the rules, but that is how I see it.
     
  15. RasputinLives

    RasputinLives Not dead Contributor

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    But its not a rule if the people who make the rules have told you that you can do it. As far as I'm concerned it didn't become a rule until someone protested about it and the FIA decided to make it a rule. If you look at it that way Haas didn't knowingly do it so therefore it's not cheating.

    This is all because we have a toothless FIA.
     
  16. siffert_fan

    siffert_fan Too old to watch the Asian races live. Contributor

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    I don't understand how the governing body can make rule changes in mid-season (except for safety reasons). Doing so gives an enormous advantage to the high-dollar (manufacturer) teams.

    If something is legal at the start of the season, how can it be deemed illegal in mid-season? Legal is legal, isn't it?
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2018
  17. Il_leone

    Il_leone Champion Elect

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    siffert_fan because rules can be exploited by very clever people
     
  18. siffert_fan

    siffert_fan Too old to watch the Asian races live. Contributor

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    Or because a private team is ahead of a manufacturer in the championship?
     
  19. Grizzly

    Grizzly Bear Contributor

    Siffert_fan - The FIA issued a specific clarification at the request of a number of teams who were working to differing interpretations of this technical reg. Prior to the clarification, all teams interpretations were deemed acceptable. However, the teams sought clarification of the rule from the technical delegate. The FIA have not changed the rules, they have interpreted them on request and passed on their interpretation to the teams.

    This is the procedure and they followed it. However much the procedure might stink, that's what we have and all the teams know the process backwards. Haas, with full knowledge of the situation, took a calculated risk and it backfired on them.
     
  20. RasputinLives

    RasputinLives Not dead Contributor

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    So why weren't they DQ'd until someone protested it?
     
  21. Grizzly

    Grizzly Bear Contributor

    Much like our law courts. Government might make the legislation, but you've not broken the law until its been tested in court and the judge has done his job.
     

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