Grand Prix 2018 United States Grand Prix Practice, Qualifying & Race Discussion

Discussion in 'Formula One Discussion' started by Olivier, Oct 7, 2018.

  1. Dartman

    Dartman Points Scorer

    Aquaplaning starts at 9Xsq root of tyre pressure in mph when the depth of water overcomes the depth of tread so with about 20psi in a F1 tyre thats aboout 15 mph and you have no control
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  3. FB

    FB Not my cup of cake Valued Member

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    I listened to it on the radio, sounded like quite a good race so I might take the time to watch some of it on the DVR.
    cider_and_toast likes this.
  4. I really enjoed the race, the track seems very very good and that certainly helps in delivering good races. A great drive from Kimi and from Verstappen. I think that Hamilton was very cautions on his last stint and that is one of the reasons why he'll win this year's WDC, I personally think that he could have overtaken Versnatten and possibly Kimi, IMHO he didn't want to take too much of a punt with Verstappen.

    The race also leaves me with a few questions:

    - why Kimi hasn't raced like he did yesterday for years?

    - why Vettel always tries to change the angle of his car any time he comes anywhere near another car? yesterday he could have easily walked away from that mistake had he accepted to nudge Ricciardo's car, he decided that he couldn't take that risk and I am wondering why because every young kid in karting knows that if you understeer and try to put the car in oversteer to close the line into a bend there is only one outcome: you spin. So my question is why is Vettel so scared of getting anywhere near another car even in a situation like he had yesterday with Ricciardo, had they touched it wouldn't have been Vettel's fault (and most likely both would have been able to continue their race with no problem), it was obvious that he had a bit of unexpected understeer, my problem is with how he reacted to that. It's the third time that he does it and the third time that he spins, if he thinks that he's not allowed to race on a level playing field with the others he should be honest about it

    - why do we all accept consistent unsportly behaviour from Bottas? letting your team mate through is fine, not great but fine, holding up you team mate's opponent race after race isn't. And I'm sure that deep down Bottas is a very nice chap, one of the nicest probably, so I don't think that this attitude is really his decision. I mean is it really necessary for Mercedes with the massive advantage that they have in the standings?

    - why did Camilleri tell Kimi that his services very no longer needed just a couple of hours before the race in Monza? are Camilleri and Elkan up to the job?
    Angel likes this.
  5. Dartman

    Dartman Points Scorer

    That should read about 40mph, bit early for the brainLOL
  6. Greenlantern101

    Greenlantern101 Super Hero And All Round Good Guy Contributor

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    Ocon and Magnessun officially disqualified for fuel flow infringements.

  7. F1Brits_90

    F1Brits_90 Race Winner

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    ocon was a slam dunk, but magunssen is the confusing 1 because how?? because I thought that fuel tank only held 105kg & also they always underfill for performance reason & hoping for a safety car
  8. Angel

    Angel Happy to be here. Contributor

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    I agree Publius Cornelius Scipio If only Kimi drove like that all the time, clearly he can when he wants to. The fact he often doesn't appear to want to bother makes it all the more frustrating. You can see why teams (mostly Ferrari) get fed up and let him go when he's clearly not trying like he should.

    Ferrari have Seb who was/is over driving and Kimi who has been under driving. I wonder if Leclerc will just be driving when he gets there!
    Galahad likes this.
  9. Ruslan

    Ruslan Points Scorer

    I feel prophetic.
  10. :snigger:
  11. F1Brits_90

    F1Brits_90 Race Winner

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    as I said on the rating thread how can not love that race because we did get some great action through the teams uncertainty. like the beginning of 2012 the less teams know, almost the better the racing. & I think as viewer 1 of the great feelings in sport. Bar a underdog winning, is watching the "old guys" rolling back the years. like Federer at Wimbledon, Tiger Woods at the tour champ ,Phil Taylor at World Matchplay. Steve davis beating John Higgins & even Mansell back in 1994 or Schumacher taking pole. there is just a warm glow as who doesnt like the romantic side of sport. I took more pleasure in yesterday win than if Hamilton had won

    I know that kimi is unpredictable & any non f1 fan gets confused at this popularity. Because he is a anti hero. His motivation can be temperamental depending on chance of victory. But i love his relaxed attitude. Having a magnum, taking no crap from his engineers. His interview made me laugh "its better than 2nd" i want rory mcilroy to say that if he wins masters or that been so long he forgot when finnish national anthem finishes.
    Like or not but he is a character when in this age too many plain boring ones. excluding indy 500's Kimi is 11th oldest winner & 6th youngest winner, in last 40yrs only Mansell Regazzoni & Reutemann were older & last time kimi raikkonen won a race for Ferrari. badoer was kimi teammate at ferrari. sutil at force india, Nakajima & Rosberg were teammates at Williams finally Heikki Kovaleinen came 6th in McLaren
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2018
  12. Ruslan

    Ruslan Points Scorer

    Was Ferrari the stronger car? It may well have been. It appeared that at least in the case of Bottas versus Vettel, that Bottas simply ran out of tires at the end and could do nothing about Vettel. It would appear that at least at this race, we were back to seeing Mercedes burn through the tires quicker than Ferrari. As Hamilton took two pit stops, we did not see this with his car.

    If Vettel did not loose three spots in qualifying on Saturday and did not hit Ricciardo on Sunday....would we have seen a Ferrari 1-2 at this race?
  13. Mercedes had to close the holes in their wheels as they were deemed a moving aerodynamic device and they got their old issues with overheating the rear tyres. Regarding Vettel, that could well have been the case but I think that Hamilton would have defended the first corner much harder from Vettel (as any reasonable driver would, in fairness) as in such a situation Hamilton would gain an advantage if they crashed, with Kimi he had everything to lose
  14. Angel

    Angel Happy to be here. Contributor

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    Come on then Ruslan, who will Seb crash into, sorry, try to pass next weekend? ;)
  15. cider_and_toast

    cider_and_toast Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex Staff Member Premium Contributor

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    Does anyone else think Hamilton's aggressive hard left at the start was actually more detrimental to him than it was worth?

    He got away as well as Kimi and I think would have had the legs into the first corner. Even if not he would have been able to slot into second there. It seemed like an odd thing to do.
  16. The Artist.....

    The Artist..... Champion Elect

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    The "Schumacher chop" is now such a de-rigeur move in F1 that I'm not sure that some drivers realise that it's not always necessary.

    That being said, it doesn't come anywhere near as bad as Mansell in Portugal in 1990... Having been thoroughly pissed off by Ferrari's internal politicking, he almost took his own team-mate out of the race, and both of them were shuffled back in the pack... (Check out 4:41 onwards)

    Last edited: Oct 23, 2018
    gethinceri likes this.
  17. Izumi

    Izumi Points Scorer

    Hard to say today if MB will continue with F1 after 2020. German business media suggest that Dr. Zetsche's days as a chairman are numbered, and we do not know anything about his potential replacement, just as how such move could potentially affect their F1 involvement. There could be at the top just a change for sake of change. (Nothing is forever in auto-business.)
    There are some shareholder's voices who are totally opposed participation in the series on basis of misdirected spending. Not too friendly climate in US just gives them one more argument to shut it down, and limit their racing exposure. Brexit headaches could add one more argument "why bother at all"?
    My guess is that many fans would shout "yippee ki-yay," however I say be careful what you wish for. There could be impactful consequences should MB leave, and it might not be all for good. To use cliche, MB in F1 is too big to move out without leaving havoc behind.
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2018
  18. Angel

    Angel Happy to be here. Contributor

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    He almost always does it, I'm not sure if it's to intimidate his opponents or because he genuinely believes he will gain from it. He doesn't always, but it doesn't stop him trying. He's far from alone in making that move though as The Artist..... said.
  19. F1Brits_90

    F1Brits_90 Race Winner

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    cider_and_toast I think its an unconscious move that all drivers use now, just an acceptable tool in their arsenal. I thinking of the last few races I think Bottas did it in Russia, Hamilton did in Singapore & Kimi did it in Monza. but lewis you would've been briefed because we all knew that it was highly likely kimi would lead into the 1st corner with the better tyres & inside line

    Izumi of course if Mercedes leave their would be big short term problems but long term it can only be good because the finances are much discussed & how they have made F1 a closed shop to any new teams because why would any join F1 currently. they are seeing the top 3 spending a combined billion between them per season & that level is only increasing. then likes of Renault or Force India spending 100+m to finish a lap down in 7th or 8th. if they left hopefully the long term positives are that its a more sustainable sport, more talent less money make it into the sport & B teams die a death
  20. RasputinLives

    RasputinLives Not dead Contributor

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    Vettel did it in Singapore one time and got roasted for it.
  21. cider_and_toast

    cider_and_toast Exulted Lord High Moderator of the Apex Staff Member Premium Contributor

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    In this case, its not about the right and wrong of the chop, its more a case that Hamilton hindered his own getaway by chopping. By coming across on Kimi, he took a longer route and pretty much conceded the inside line to the corner. Both cars got away well. Hamilton seemed to hold his line then decide to chop. That action allowed Kimi to draw level long before the corner.

    It could be argued that pole at the CoA would be better placed on the left which would enable the pole sitter a greater choice of lines to take. Then again, from a racing point of view, leave it where it is.

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